Anime Gothic 3: The circle is now complete

[Tigranes]

G3 is a great game as long as you just play Myrtana and stop. I went through the other two areas once and ended up using cheats to teleport everywhere or it'd have taken 50 hours just running around. For the Myrtana parts with the Community Patch I don't really think it's far behind G1/G2.

 

[Jestai]

How many of those look like Rusty Swords?

01. Hashishin knife
02. Hashishin bow
03. Bone bow
04. Rapier
05. Headhunter's crossbow
06. Hashishin sword
07. Composite bow
08. Slave death (crossbow)
09. Mercenary crossbow
10. Skull shield
11. War bow
12. Blood harvest (crossbow)
13. Bearded axe
14. Katana +
15. Paladin sword
16. Ruby blade ++
17. Wolf ripper (bow)
18. Order sword
19. Meat axe
20. Ice blade +
21. Oak bow
22. Cutlass
23. Nordmarian crossbow
24. Warhammer
25. Army bow
26. Ore two-hander
27. Rune shield +
28. Horn bow
29. Blueprint (Rune sword) +
30. Rhino killer (crossbow)
31. Inquisitor +
32. El Bastardo
33. Headsman's sword +
34. Nimrod (bow)
35. Greatsword +
36. Master sword +++
37. Barbarian battleaxe +
38. Heavy crossbow
39. Blueprint (Sword of the Ancestors) +
40. Rune bow +
41. Great inquisitor +
42. War crossbow +
43. Blueprint (Power of the Ancestors) +
44. Demon bow +
45. Berserker axe +
46. Krash Morra (crossbow) +
47. Berserker's wrath (axe) +
48. Wrath of Innos +

 

[Unkillable Cat]

If that's the case, then make the whole continent smaller. Furthermore, I'm sure someone with a little imagination (and time) could have made it less barren. Varant should be teeming with old ruins and underground cave systems.

:facepalm: Deserts are only teeming with one thing: Sand.

But I agree with you on the fact that they should have made the continent smaller. I've never completed Gothic 3, the closest I got was going through Myrtana, then Nordmar, then just giving up once I reached the main Hashishin city. It was all the same, except in a desert instead of a lush forest area or a frozen mountainscape. For example they could have "reversed" the desert so that the big Hashishin city would be closest to the Myrtana border, then have the map extend a little southwest from there where you could find a ruin or two, but going any further into the desert would kill you in the same way that the sea monster would eat you in Gothic 2. You'd reduce the Hashishin area by about 70%, yet only lose about 30% of the gameplay at the most for that area.

How is progressively better loot is worse than having 50 chests with the same items in fixed locations? Prevents you from metagaming? Forces you to explore every square inch so you can have your 100% completion for whatever reason makes your heart beat? Also, some items were good, some items were ok, some were pointless.

Consistency is a good start. Gothic 1 and 2 had fixed items, all items were always in the same place. As far as I know people didn't mind. But that only gives a counter-argument relevant to Gothic 3. Then again, name some other games that use the same system for getting good loot from chests.

 

[taxalot]

One of these days I am going to play Gothic IV, thoroughly enjoy it, and then post about it on the Codex. I will get at least 20 brofists.

I played Gothic 1 to 3. 3 was the weekest of the series. It was just Oblivion in third person mode with even less depth.

Forsaken Gods was both awful and good. I liked some of its ideas, but it was ruined by the fucking cheap indians that programmed it and created this incompletable mess. It needs a community patch.

 

[A user named cat]

Combat is fucking awful as is the randomized chest looting system. This in turn kills exploration unless you just like looking at pretty scenery. I remember some massive cave near the starting town (Ardea?) it had skeletons, ogres, minecrawlers, and wyverns in it. The ecology was nonsensical. Quests aren't boring? You must have only done about three quests. As noted, most are of the MMO variety.

This, to the hundredth degree. Some of you are fucking nuts, G3 was an abomination even without the performance issues. Anyone saying it's better than the first two overall should be lobotomized and sentenced to ProsperLand. It was the Oblivion of the series, while G4 is Fallout 3. Just complete garbage sequels and insults to the series.

I remember playing G3 for the first time and laughing out at the absymal clickfest combat and how everyone in the opening battle were just flailing their dildo swords like retards. Especially when you take the first two games into account and how important timing was, and how you had to learn to even simply string together two strikes in a row. Then you step outside the village and it's about as un-Gothic of a world as possible, with everything bright, shiny and Todd Howard.

If someone ever tells me they can't play G1/2 due to the clunky controls or dated visuals, then I at least tell them to play Risen 1. You never go full Gothic 3.

 

[Tigranes]

It's not as good as G1/2 but frankly the differences between them and G3 is exaggerated; it is the worst of the three but it is very much part of that series. Once the stupid stunlock issues were solved the combat was quite similar, and so was the world design and style. It's not like G1/2 had super complicated quests and Deep Moral Ambiguity, just a ruthless no-frills world and G3 had that. The visuals were fairly consistent too, just with a dose of bloom. I'm not even counting the final 1/3 of the game for all of those, since all of those, without fail, had horrible trash mob fillers. Honestly can't see how G3 is "nothing like" G1/2, it's just a not very well boiled cousin.

 

[Humppaleka]

One of these days I am going to play Gothic IV, thoroughly enjoy it, and then post about it on the Codex. I will get at least 20 brofists.

I played Gothic 1 to 3. 3 was the weekest of the series. It was just Oblivion in third person mode with even less depth.

Forsaken Gods was both awful and good. I liked some of its ideas, but it was ruined by the fucking cheap indians that programmed it and created this incompletable mess. It needs a community patch.

But it does have one, it is now called "Forsaken Gods Enhanced Edition" as the Community Patch was implemented in the official release. Not that I know much about it, played for maybe 3-4 hours, no problems up to that point.

 

[Jestai]

Consistency is a good start. Gothic 1 and 2 had fixed items, all items were always in the same place. As far as I know people didn't mind. But that only gives a counter-argument relevant to Gothic 3. Then again, name some other games that use the same system for getting good loot from chests.

I don't know any other games using this mechanism and maybe it isn't consistent with other Gothic games, but that's hardly the point. I'm just talking about the idea itself and the way it was implemented in Gothic 3. I can somewhat get why some people don't like it for subjective reasons, but it's pretty decent objectively: I mean, if you have 50 items to give, would you rather hide them in any random order or in a somewhat progressive order? It also really suits the openness of the world and of the quests: do whatever you want in any order you want. Maybe once in a while you'll get a stupid item after killing a dragon, but it's far from the "lol killed an entire orc camp and all i got is this rusty ironsword" bullshit some people are spreading here.

 

[DeepOcean]

Consistency is a good start. Gothic 1 and 2 had fixed items, all items were always in the same place. As far as I know people didn't mind. But that only gives a counter-argument relevant to Gothic 3. Then again, name some other games that use the same system for getting good loot from chests.

I don't know any other games using this mechanism and maybe it isn't consistent with other Gothic games, but that's hardly the point. I'm just talking about the idea itself and the way it was implemented in Gothic 3. I can somewhat get why some people don't like it for subjective reasons, but it's pretty decent objectively: I mean, if you have 50 items to give, would you rather hide them in any random order or in a somewhat progressive order? It also really suits the openness of the world and of the quests: do whatever you want in any order you want. Maybe once in a while you'll get a stupid item after killing a dragon, but it's far from the "lol killed an entire orc camp and all i got is this rusty ironsword" bullshit some people are spreading here.

What "do whatever you want in any order you want" have anything to do with the magic chests system,can you get the Dragon Killer super Dragon killing sword in the beginning of the game if you know what to do? No, so you can't do eveything you want in the order you want. A static item looting system isn't about hiding anything, nothing is hidden and everything can be aquired at low levels if you know where to look and is skillful enough with the combat system to manage to defeat monsters thougher than you. You look at a cave entrance, there is chance of you getting shit, something that you already have or something extraordinary, you don't know, the monsters are hard to deal but you manage to kill them and get shit, next time you have more luck and find the Doom David Gayder penetrator sword that was in the cave next the cave you just entered, lost in a Bioware homosexual sacrifice altar but you didn't saw the cave the entrace because it was hidden by a bush. the magic chest system assure you that is going to be something that you already have or shit. Finding the Hamburguer Helpler dick exterminator machete in the chest behind the bathroom of Bob the lazy bisexual bandit because you oppened enough chests is just silly. If the only thing you need is to open every chest you find, then the chests on the very end on a really hard cave can have the same loot that one next to generic black to fill equality quotas dude nearby the stables, you can easily kill exploration that way.

 

[Murk]

Ya'll on crack, Nordmar was fucking amazing. The first time I walked into it from some winding mountain pass and the snow picked up, with that beautiful soundtrack hammering in the feeling that I'm lost and have no idea what's going on... then I come across a ridge and bam, Orc squad sitting there. Vaeeee viiiicccttuuuuussssssss

 

[Cosmo]

Indeed. i've already said it.
How many Open-world RPGs actually managed to lose you, and with only a tiny parcel of, say, Skyrim's landmass ? Nordmar level building is nothing less than exemplar.

 

[Lilura]

The guy complaining about waving dildos around needs to get Community patch and activate New Melee AI, or play a magic-user.

I thought Faring was the most beautifully crafted area in the whole Gothic series. Gothic 3 may not hold a candle to the first two, but its still got more soul than any dress the dolly up TES entry.

 

[Metro]

Still haven't understood the problem with magic chests and I'm still waiting for a better argument than "lol obviously bad ignored". How is progressively better loot is worse than having 50 chests with the same items in fixed locations? Prevents you from metagaming? Forces you to explore every square inch so you can have your 100% completion for whatever reason makes your heart beat? Also, some items were good, some items were ok, some were pointless. It's not like item1<item2<item3<item4[...]<item50.

Because it's grinding not exploration. Yes, fixed loot can lead to metagaming but that really isn't a problem for a first playthrough unless you go and look at guides/spoilers but that's the player's fault. Hell, you could argue it's metagaming to have to find X number of special chests in the game to unlock certain items. Randomized loot is fucking retarded. Why? Because it allows you to find better loot in a chest two feet from the starting town than in a chest at the bottom of a cave of ogres or minecrawlers or whatever. Moreover it goes hand-in-hand with lazy world design. It's much better to have a cave or abandoned fort or whatever populated by bandits who have relevant treasure/items than a generic hole filled with five different types of monsters (who would probably just attack each other) at the end of which you'd find a couple of wooden ladles and a light spell scroll.

Ya'll on crack, Nordmar was fucking amazing. The first time I walked into it from some winding mountain pass and the snow picked up, with that beautiful soundtrack hammering in the feeling that I'm lost and have no idea what's going on... then I come across a ridge and bam, Orc squad sitting there. Vaeeee viiiicccttuuuuussssssss

Nordmar was shit and, as someone else noted, retarded to navigate. You can tell it was probably the last zone to be developed given its rushed state. It has a few nice vignettes (like the mine) but... the orc camps? Talk about fucking tedious.

Indeed. i've already said it.
How many Open-world RPGs actually managed to lose you, and with only a tiny parcel of, say, Skyrim's landmass ? Nordmar level building is nothing less than exemplar.

Exemplar? Maybe if you like hiking simulators.

The guy complaining about waving dildos around needs to get Community patch and activate New Melee AI, or play a magic-user.

It's not the AI, it's the mechanics. Melee combat is horrendous. Its far superior in Risen because it actually mimics the first two Gothics and attacks have weight. 'Or play a magic-user?' Magic has always been brokenly overpowered in PB games. So much so that playing a mage is almost a cop-out. In the first two it is fun to see the storyline but you're not getting the full experience as the game's difficulty is clearly balance around melee. That said, the monster count in G3 is so overkill that you're better off playing a mage and nuking the shit out of everything.

Seems to me the type of people who praise G3 tend to like E-Larp simulators.

 

[Cosmo]

Nordmaar level, with its treacherous pathes and blizzard storms was clearly designed to lose the player. The lay of the land directly impacted the gameplay and was "felt" by the player. Maybe in a way that you didn't like but what other first or third person RPG can boast to have achieved that ?

 

[Metro]

Plenty of games have 'achieved' poor world design. The failings of Nordmaar's design are further magnified by the lack of climbing in G3 (and yes, you can glitch jump/slide in a few places but there isn't any proper climbing).

 

[Metro]

Ninja edit, Lilura? The patch doesn't rewrite the game's engine/actual mechanics.

 

[Lilura]

Ninja edit, Lilura? The patch doesn't rewrite the game's engine/actual mechanics.

I didn't like my tone towards you, that's all. I agree that the melee combat sucks, just that New Melee AI improves it dramatically. Most people who bitch about Gothic 3 haven't bothered to look into the CP's Alternative Balancing and NMAI, just saying. Have you tried it?

Also, magic is quite powerful in the vanilla game, have you tried it?

 

[Metro]

Yes, I've tried it. And, as I've said, the problem isn't the AI, it's the mechanics, the weight, the feel, it's crap compared to the first two and Risen. Regarding magic, I said: "Magic has always been brokenly overpowered in PB games." I'm not sure how you read that as an inference that magic isn't powerful in Gothic 1 (which, btw, I've played four or five times). Since I can't really elaborate without repeating myself... I'll repeat myself: PB games have always been balanced around melee combat as their implementation of magic has always been brokenly overpowered to the point where combat isn't challenging. So, again, saying 'try a mage' in regards to G3 is mostly a cop out.

 

[Lilura]

Yes, I've tried it. And, as I've said, the problem isn't the AI, it's the mechanics, the weight, the feel, it's crap compared to the first two and Risen.

More is changed than the AI, for example the Hero block system. But yeah, especially 2handed weapons don't feel right at all and I did notice that, its no Dark Souls.

PB games have always been balanced around melee combat as their implementation of magic has always been brokenly overpowered to the point where combat isn't challenging. So, again, saying 'try a mage' in regards to G3 is mostly a cop out.

I agree, and it was a flippant remark in response to a funny remark about dildos. I said it because in the vanilla game stunlock in melee (mostly with wolves) is rather sanity draining, whereas magic is EZmode.

 

[Lady_Error]

I couldn't even bring myself to buy the Gothics when they were on sale on GOG. They look too much like the decline games of the last decade.

 

[Metro]

I could even bring myself to buy the Gothics when they were on sale on GOG. They look too much like the decline games of the last decade.

 

[Murk]

Nordmar was shit and, as someone else noted, retarded to navigate. You can tell it was probably the last zone to be developed given its rushed state. It has a few nice vignettes (like the mine) but... the orc camps? Talk about fucking tedious.

The orc extermination was annoying, but exploring the actual landscape was great; you're warned before you enter that it is a harsh, hazardous terrain and that you shouldn't enter unless you're prepared for serpentine paths, cliffs, and beastlings that want to devour your innards so grit your teeth and gird your loins.

Opinions, etc.

*Heinous blasphemy deserving naught but fire.*

ERROR INDEED

 

[Severian Silk]

G3 had a nice landscape. However, the combat was worse than G1/G2 which I played with a gamepad. Liberating towns became repetitive after the first few. Toward the end the quests all started feeling samey: boring fedex town quests that did not advance the plot. Meh.

 

[agentorange]

Yeah. Gothic landscapes are what Bethesda wish they could do; the worlds in Gothic actually feel like every path and cave has been carefully crafted and placed, with great uses of elevation to create romantic vistas or mountain passes that actually feel treacherous - when you come across a river it makes sense that it is there, and it winds and turns with sandbanks and waterfalls - making you feel like you're exploring a world in which people could actually live, rather than a bland open landscape passed once over with a few brushes.

If any other (Edit: well, most other) game had the amount of issues Gothic 3 did on release I would have fucked right off, but even with the stunlock combat, totally absent optimization, and the load times that took like 5 minutes, it still absorbed me. I'm looking forward to playing it again now that I've played Gothic 1, and will play Gothic 2.

And as someone said before, the soundtrack in 3 is indeed amazing.

 

[Aeschylus]

I couldn't even bring myself to buy the Gothics when they were on sale on GOG. They look too much like the decline games of the last decade.

GET OUT.

Oh, and the end of G3 looked like they were running out of time because... they were.

I didn't hate Gothic 3, but I always felt it lacked the density of content that the first two games had that made them great. In the sense that, there was little to no wasted space in G1 or G2, and any random area you decided to explore was likely to reward you with something interesting. G3 had that to an extent, but was stuffed with a lot more filler, ala TES. Again, this is probably because they overshot and ran out of time. Oh well, we'll always have NotR.