Is the New Decline(tm) of cRPGs imminent?

[Zanzoken]

Due to recent events I get the feeling that the cRPG renaissance is running its course. Consider the RPG landscape as it exists today.

Bethesda and Bioware have nothing of value to offer whatsoever. CDPR is making a lot of money with their storyfag action RPGs, which I guess is okay if you're interested in that. But in terms of classic cRPGs the AAA space is dead and has been for awhile.

Then we have the "AA" class of devs that were brought back by Kickstarter -- namely Obsidian, Larian, and inXile. All have released their debut titles which appear to be critically and financially successful, albeit with a more mixed reception on the Codex. Now we're gearing up for Round 2 from these guys, but when I read through the feature lists of their upcoming titles I feel more concerned than excited. This new crop of RPGs is clearly being designed to emphasize co-op, multiplayer, and console porting. We also hear buzzwords like "cinematic cameras", "Origin Stories", and "item fever". Romances are starting to creep in too.

I know these guys are trying to run businesses. But I am worried that the temptation to bring in more and more casuals (and their $$$) is going to ruin major cRPGs for the second time.

One upshot is that the market for indies is still alive and delivering quality work from developers like Iron Tower, Whalenought, and Stygian. But the market is always perilous for devs of this size and stability is hard to achieve. Usually one bad release is enough to put small shops under.

So what's the Codex verdict? Are we entering the early stages of a New Decline?

 

[Jimmious]

No on the contrary, the incline has just started. The success of turn-based or generally "old-school" RPGs has lit the fire and more are popping out all the time.
Especially now with the indies being so strong, we are getting way too many good titles.

Also just because some people don't like co-op or cinematic cameras that doesn't mean they show decline.
D:OS was extreme incline and the co-op was glorious

 

[Bester]

Are we entering the early stages of a New Decline?

We were never out of it.

 

[Infinitron]

The New Decline is still (mostly) turn-based, so it's better than the Old Decline.

But I don't know, I actually think it's kind of promising that they're trying new things now.

 

[Jimmious]

We can't be seriously discussing this. There was a period where Dragon Age Origins came out and it was a miracle.
Now we will call Torment a decline for example because "the hit point system is not how we like it"? Come on guys, that's too much edge

 

[undecaf]

Are we entering the early stages of a New Decline?

Shit might be on it's way to the fan, but we're not quite there yet despite some controversy over certain titles.

 

[Mustawd]

 

[Mustawd]

The New Decline is still (mostly) turn-based,

RTwP is gathering all its dark forces to try and assert its dominance, yet again. So far it seems to be an even match, with mostly crappy cRPGs being RTwP.


-PoE
-SCL
-Black Geyser

 

[mondblut]

The decline never went away, fools. There was no "renaissance", just hopping on crowdfunding bandwagon to tap into an underserved niche and ride into recognition on your backs. Now that the franchises are established, you are no longer needed.

 

[Somberlain]

Developers who twirl their moustaches are easy to spot. Those who clothe themselves in turn-based incline are well camouflaged.

 

[Neanderthal]

When those of us who are commited to the creation of the perfect CRPG can no longer sit and tolerate the prostitution of development that is proliferating around us, it is time to speak out! The gamers of our times are harlots and charlatans, who use science without being scientists and abuse art without being artists. We are witnessing the demise of the genre, so be it! The Codex must prepare itself to herald the advent of incline, whose presence can now be shared with the fortunate few who have the ears to hear, the vision to see, and the intelligence to comprehend.

Wait, I feel something stirring...Are we witnessing the birth of such a sculpture? Within the confines of these gigabytes of data an immaculate conception is about to take place...listen...can you hear? The catharsis of the birth is almost too much to bear, it is emerging, its glistening form and voluptuous curves. Harken to the ecstatic cries of the newly born, spreading to fill the vacuum of our pathetic little lives.

Oh the bliss! The pleasure caressing your senses! How can you have survived until this historic moment? How could the world have continued to mark time whilst writhing in ignorance as to the future of the aging, hideous creature known as gaming? Behold the Codex brings you Digital Sculpture!

 

[Shin]

It's too early to tell if we're heading into a period of decline, but the (spiritual/moral) decline of Obsidian and inXile has dealt a harsh blow (inXile might redeem itself with T:ToN). I'd say Larian is the only one "AA" dev which is on top of their game right now; but I guess we'll be able to judge that once D:OS2 drops. On the other hand, if this new period of incline (The Kickstarter Era) has proven anything, it's that the indie teams are more than capable of producing good cRPG's.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Decline from what?

 

[StrongBelwas]

Compared to what we had a few years ago of course we aren't going back into decline, but it still isn't great. But anyone who thinks there is going to be stuff consistently better then "Good for what it is" from studios with any significant budget is kidding themselves. The elements of a game that make it incline and the elements of a game that make it popular with critics and the wRPG mainstream almost always directly conflict. D:OS 2 has 100 people working on it, they're going to take every chance they can get to make it accessible. The only realistic, consistent sources of incline are microbudget developers* with long dev times and tiny crews. At the very least, the AA developers now acknowledge there is a crowd for cRPGs and will try to keep the scales in balance between pleasing the Bioware/Bethesda refugees and not completely turning us off, but they will almost always go for the larger crowd.

*And on the bright side, those now actually stand a chance of survival, when back then we mostly just had Vogel and Pierre.

 

[Arulan]

I don't think so, or at the very least, it's too early to tell. At some point, these developers who have sold us on bringing back old CRPG design need to venture forth themselves. They need to further these design philosophies on their own creativity.

 

[vmar]

Nah, I mean sure there's plenty of generic shit in this renaissance but games like Underrail, Divinity OS, and AoD give me hope.

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

Dammit, I used to love ranting about The Decline. I feel so pointless now, like my favourite teddy bear has been taken away from me. Please can everything go to shit again so I can go back to fun shitposting and pseudo-intellectual discussions about game minutia

FTFY.

 

[Repulsive]

Heading back there rapidly. Our messiah's smell the cheese.

 

[mondblut]

*And on the bright side, those now actually stand a chance of survival, when back then we mostly just had Vogel and Pierre.

And how so? Back then Vogel and Pierre had no crap to compete with for their 5000 sales. Now the market is full of trash and reaching for someone yet uninitiated is pretty much impossible, they have already blown their monthly 20 bucks gaming budget on overhyped casual crap like grimrock or darkest dungeon (or, even more likely, on ridiculously turbooverhyped hipster shitstains like undertail), or on the gotta-try-to-kinda-please-everyone-to-stay-afloat AA nostalgiaxploitation productions.

It needs to burn down to the ground, I say. Behead those who poke at the corpse of RPGs with a stick and yell, "hey, look, it moved, I am an RPG saviour, gimme moneys".

 

[agris]

Underrail
Age of Decadence
Serpent in the Staglands
Expeditions: Conquistador
Xenonaughts
Neo Scavenger
Fallout 1.5: Resurrection
Legend of Grimrock
Duskers
Stasis
Hard West
Might & Magic X
OpenXcom
Primordia
Shadowrun Seattle/Berlin/DongKong
Sorcery!



Those are just the fun ones I've played recently. Then we have these to look forward to:

Battle Brothers
Copper Dreams
Stellar Tactics
Rogue System
Beautiful Desolation
Torment
Stygian
Battletech
Bard's Tale 4
Eisenwald: Blood of November
No Truce with the Furies
Dungeons of Aledorn
Pathologic remake
Star Traders 2



I don't see a problem, unless you're really into AAA games.

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

If you're not careful, you'll just turn into a second-tier Lyric Suite...

 

[Momock]

Is the New Decline(tm) of cRPGs imminent?

I don't know where you have seen an Incline from witch we are supposed to be Declining again. Wasteland 2 was shit, D:OS was shit, Underrail was "meh" at best. The only RPG that was worth my time during the past decade was AoD, and it's far from perfection (at least it has the heart in the right place and it gives hope in the next game from Iron Tower that should adress the issues of it's predecessor).

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

I don't know where you have seen an Incline from witch we are supposed to be Declining again.

Joined:Sep 25, 2014
Messages:16

I guess from reading the forums...?

 

[Zanzoken]

The New Decline is still (mostly) turn-based, so it's better than the Old Decline.

But I don't know, I actually think it's kind of promising that they're trying new things now.

I'd like to give the AAs credit for that, except there are plenty of classic cRPG elements they executed poorly the first time around. It's not as if PoE, WL2, and D:OS were flawless additions to the genre.

They could be improving upon these elements in their sequels instead of expending tons of resources on new features. It feels like the franchises are shifting in new directions -- and toward new markets.

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

It's not as if PoE, WL2, and D:OS were flawless additions to the genre.

You want flawless?