Josh Sawyer Q&A Thread

[Neanderthal]

Both.

 

[Sacred82]

Both.

you mean like... being black and white at the same time?
being hot and cold at the same time?

being pizza and burger at the same time?

Those things usually suck.


RPG characters are supposed to be heroes. Human beings are also called heroes IRL sometimes. Marvel drivel is considered superheroes. There's a difference in perception there. What would you say the defining characteristics of the superhero are vs. the hero?

 

[Neanderthal]

Box office vs wooden box.

 

[Sacred82]

thanks for playing, I'll have a non-retarded conversation with myself.

I think the superhero confusion in RPG's comes from 1) what I've cited above: strong increase in power in a relatively short time and 2) the fact that, gasp, the game requires the heroes to be ultimately succesful.


IOW, people feel like they're playing a superhero if the universe bends around them to ensure they won't fail…


Point 3) in this dilemma is probably the supervillain problem I mentioned above: since players feel like they're superheroes, it would take literal supervillains to thwart their progress, even for a short time. Now that I think about it, I always found it strange when people cited "good" game villains… since most of those tend to fall into the ridiculous supervillain category. But apparently, that retarded shit on the one end supports the superhero shit that players want to see on the other end.

A game villain tends to be already considered well done if they have "one weakness"; even though the one weakness bullshit is exactly a staple of those retarded superhero vs. supervillain scenarios.

 

[Mastermind]

There are many things I would like to see Sawyer work with, but I would never let him near anything superhero-related. All the Joker needs to be is a guy who shows up one day with little to no explanation (same with any super-villain, really) and then proceeds to announce he's gonna murder the Mayor for no reason at all. Any story set before he became the over-the-top character that makes his existance worthwhile is not going to be interesting, and that is why I have no interest in watching the new movie.

MCA on the other hand would work wonders with some capeshit property. His work on Star Wars was fresh yet faithful, and I have no doubts he could offer a great take on someone like the Joker.

His work on star wars was abysmally retarded. Imagine a story where the main villain wants to kill gravity because he thinks being stuck to the ground is basically slavery and you get avellone's contribution to star wars.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Starts harmless, progresses and trains, aspires, uses tools and preparation, learn by doing, steadily rises in effectiveness and foes capabilities and all that stuff.

Course he's probably not killed the hundreds or thousands that an adventurer has, but he'll have done a good few, you can't hit that many folk and expect em all to live.

I'm standing by my claim that that's not the typical superhero shtick. In fact… that's what a human being does. No "I got bitten by the spider/ I come from another planet so I gots da superpowaz".

So either:

Batman =/= superhero

or simply

Batman = human being

Batman has (indirectly, and to some degree directly) taken down the entire Justice League singlehandedly.
If he's not a superhero then "superhero" means nothing.

 

[Sacred82]

Starts harmless, progresses and trains, aspires, uses tools and preparation, learn by doing, steadily rises in effectiveness and foes capabilities and all that stuff.

Course he's probably not killed the hundreds or thousands that an adventurer has, but he'll have done a good few, you can't hit that many folk and expect em all to live.

I'm standing by my claim that that's not the typical superhero shtick. In fact… that's what a human being does. No "I got bitten by the spider/ I come from another planet so I gots da superpowaz".

So either:

Batman =/= superhero

or simply

Batman = human being

Batman has (indirectly, and to some degree directly) taken down the entire Justice League singlehandedly.
If he's not a superhero then "superhero" means nothing.

So a superhero is a hero but more gooderer. He can kill more enemies deaderer than a hero could. Right?

How many enemies could a hero kill then, and what 'power level' could they have?

 

[Neanderthal]

Are we talking real heroes or crpg characters, because usually as I said before the kill count for players is astronomical, hundreds if not thousands.

Batman tackles thugs in the beginning and eventually can take on Superman, the Paladin begins with thugs and Goblins until eventually taking on an Arch Devil or Demon. Superheroes.

 

[Sacred82]

Are we talking real heroes or crpg characters, because usually as I said before the kill count for players is astronomical, hundreds if not thousands.

well that's already establishing body count as the thing that defines the hero and makes the superhero.

Batman tackles thugs in the beginning and eventually can take on Superman, the Paladin begins with thugs and Goblins until eventually taking on an Arch Devil or Demon. Superheroes.

you advance from easy opponents to strong opponents =/= superheroism (superherodom?)

up to now I've always taken to mean 'hero' in the RPG sense that they advance in their abilities more quickly than the average person, that they can develop abilities beyond the reach of the average person, and that they are looking for a dangerous but challenging lifestyle rather than a comfortable and dull one. I'd say that still stands. They're not unique in any way though. Only The Joker is The Joker, only Batman is Batman. A Human Fighter is just one of many. Eventually, either because the weaker ones have been weeded out or because luck allowed you to survive and learn from the experience, anyone who set out from where Human Fighter set out could have tackled the Arch Devil or Demon.

 

[Neanderthal]

Same could be said of Batman again, whether it's luck, determination or fate that allows them to step up to the plate.

I'd prefer for more grounded and punishing systems for crpgs than what we get, roll back the scale.

The sign of a bad GM for me has always been the god killing campaign, that and all the monty haul loot that goes with it.

 

[Sacred82]

Same could be said of Batman again, whether it's luck, determination or fate that allows them to step up to the plate.

I'd prefer for more grounded and punishing systems for crpgs than what we get, roll back the scale.

well, like I said I think players feel (C)RPG's have devolved into superhero antics because power growth happens too quickly and too strongly. OTOH, how anticlimactic do RPG's have to be to telegraph to the player that he's controlling just one (or four) of many talented adventurers in the world?

I mean, an open world sandbox-y approach with different challenges for different power levels - like Darklands or Daggerfall - allows for both. You can play some street scum who'll never get very rich or powerful, and still get to do and experience different things about the world. Or you can play focused heroes that tackle and beat the main quest.

For a more linear design, more survival related mechanics can also do the trick. No matter how powerful you get, you always have to eat.

But generally speaking, I think if people feel like they're playing a superhero game when it's supposed to be a regular fantasy RPG, that's a problem. Superheroes are defined by the point you get to meet them; adventurers advance from regular blokes to… heroes. There's not really a different 'tier' of heroes below them, as you'd have to assume for superheroes.

 

[Prime Junta]

star wars was abysmally retarded

Yes. Yes, it was.

 

[Sizzle]

 

[2house2fly]

His work on star wars was abysmally retarded. Imagine a story where the main villain wants to kill gravity because he thinks being stuck to the ground is basically slavery and you get avellone's contribution to star wars.

sure, if gravity was sentient and decided who could fly and who couldn't.

Kreia isn't a million miles removed from Skull Face in Metal Gear Solid V, come to think about it. His Force is the English language, which he hopes to bring about a utopia by destroying even as it's the only language he's actually shown to be capable of speaking

 

[Mastermind]

His work on star wars was abysmally retarded. Imagine a story where the main villain wants to kill gravity because he thinks being stuck to the ground is basically slavery and you get avellone's contribution to star wars.

sure, if gravity was sentient and decided who could fly and who couldn't.

Kreia isn't a million miles removed from Skull Face in Metal Gear Solid V, come to think about it. His Force is the English language, which he hopes to bring about a utopia by destroying even as it's the only language he's actually shown to be capable of speaking

The force's sentience is never explicitly confirmed or denied. But you do bring up a good point, in that it's likely Avellone's antitheism that's the driving force behind his inane storytelling in kotor. He wants to rant about God, but there's no God in the theistic sense in Star Wars so the Force'll have to do. It's hamfisted and arguably breaks the setting so he can rant about one of his pet issues instead of working with the setting like a better writer would have.

 

[FreeKaner]

Another day, another dog whistle from Sawyer.

 

[Nano]

Josh still has memories of playing tabletop games with the Black Isle guys? Aww, that's so sweet.

 

[2house2fly]

The force's sentience is never explicitly confirmed or denied. But you do bring up a good point, in that it's likely Avellone's antitheism that's the driving force behind his inane storytelling in kotor. He wants to rant about God, but there's no God in the theistic sense in Star Wars so the Force'll have to do. It's hamfisted and arguably breaks the setting so he can rant about one of his pet issues instead of working with the setting like a better writer would have.

The Force doesn't have to be "canonically" sentient for a character in the setting to believe it is sentient. I'd typed that before reading the rest of your post which turned out to be clearly trolling, but I'm too lazy to delete it

 

[Mastermind]

The Force doesn't have to be "canonically" sentient for a character in the setting to believe it is sentient. I'd typed that before reading the rest of your post which turned out to be clearly trolling, but I'm too lazy to delete it

My entire original point is that she's batshit crazy and the plot is retarded as a result, this doesn't really add anything to the conversation.

 

[Orma]

 

[Orma]

 

[Nutria]

He's a really extreme hipster in every way.

He insists that Darklands was the greatest game ever.

So do I.

Oh shit, I gotta go to Home Depot and buy some rope.

 

[Orma]

 

[Hellion]

Couldn't help but notice how he didn't even tag Avellone in this tweet, as everybody else would have probably done.

 

[pomenitul]

He doesn't seem like the tagging type to begin with.