Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning?

[Metro]

0/2 then.

 

[MaroonSkein]

0/2 then.

This is what I never understood about the Codex. Does the hairstyle of your stat sheet really matter? Why such loyalty to PC as a gaming platform when the genre you like the most has moved to other platforms? It makes no sense to me.

 

[anus_pounder]

Feel free to play a more traditional style RPG instead.

Oh wait, they don't make those anymore.

Instead of that, I'll just constantly complain about there being no good games anymore.

The essence of a true codexer.

 

[MaroonSkein]

The essence of a true codexer.

Is it? Bitching about bad games is one thing. Ignoring good games because their existence doesn't fit your preconceived perception of the gaming landscape is stupidity.

 

[Angthoron]

Played the demo the other day. The start was pretty much complete and total shit, but strangely enough the game improved once out of the tower.

I guess I agree that this is the poor man's answer to DKS EA's answer to DKS, but it's not as bad as I expected, in fact, once it's on a massive discount on Steam I might even end up buying it, unless it'll demand installation of Origin.

 

[kris]

The essence of a true codexer.

Is it? Bitching about bad games is one thing. Ignoring good games because their existence doesn't fit your preconceived perception of the gaming landscape is stupidity.

What good game is being ignored?

 

[MaroonSkein]

What good game is being ignored?

Every good game without a PC version.

 

[Icewater]

What good game is being ignored?

Every good game without a PC version.

I see what you did there. I think.

You actually were doing something there, right?

 

[MaroonSkein]

I see what you did there. I think.

You actually were doing something there, right?

I was fighting the idea that traditional RPGs are no longer made, which only holds true if you arbitrarily choose to ignore Japan, handhelds and indies. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind or fishing for Kodex Kool Kredits.

 

[Metro]

In before Crooked Bee.

 

[felipepepe]

I was fighting the idea that traditional RPGs are no longer made, which only holds true if you arbitrarily choose to ignore Japan, handhelds and indies. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind or fishing for Kodex Kool Kredits.

You know, I have a DS, and I've played & enjoyed Etrian Odissey 2 & 3, The World Ends With You, SMT: Devil Survivor & Strange Journey, Dragon Quest IX, FF Tactics and many others, and they are great games I recommend to any RPG fan.

BUT it's still not the same thing. No matter how great the game is on the DS, you wish you could see something like it on the PC, using the all the resources available. I'm not talking only about graphics, but the big screen, great sound, mouse & keyboard, mods and that sine qua non oldfag feeling that a PC will always offer a more complete & immersive experience than any handheld or console.

Put that together with the codexian despise for japanese stereotyphes & art style and you have the reason why shitty PC-port of KoA: Reckoning gets lot's of threads and SMT: Devil Survivor 2 will be worth only a couple of posts here.

 

[Mozgoëbstvo]

I see what you did there. I think.

You actually were doing something there, right?

I was fighting the idea that traditional RPGs are no longer made, which only holds true if you arbitrarily choose to ignore Japan, handhelds and indies. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind or fishing for Kodex Kool Kredits.

Actually, you are 100% right. Turn based stat-heavy RPGs and strategy at all levels has moved to various handhelds. Gotta buy one someday. Dunno why I still haven't.

 

[Ivory Samoan]

I got a Gameboy Advance with a copy of Super Mario wedged in it, won't come out.. think it could have been fused in with spilt coffee around the turn of the century.
Could be time for a new handheld.. (will get left under something and forgotten not long after purchase no doubt... and revisited in 2022 when feeling nostalgic).

 

[Skittles]

I see what you did there. I think.

You actually were doing something there, right?

I was fighting the idea that traditional RPGs are no longer made, which only holds true if you arbitrarily choose to ignore Japan, handhelds and indies. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind or fishing for Kodex Kool Kredits.

I've got no money for something that either isn't available in this country or is, but with 400% markup. I burnt out on the Dragon Quest this, Breath of Fire that and Golden Sun th' other on borrowed Gameboys as a kid, but got kind of tired of what was being produced even back then.

That said, if you could identify something that could give me a taste of either JA2 or TOEE combat engines or Darklands style character creation and sandbox, I'm sure I could find a way to play it. And I mean that seriously, not as a backhanded "NO SUCH GAME EXISTS STFU" comment.

In other words, kris seconded.

 

[Mangoose]

Emulators, bros.

 

[Skittles]

...I'm sure I could find a way to play it.

Yup, what should I be emulating though?

 

[WalmartJesus]

I see what you did there. I think.

You actually were doing something there, right?

I was fighting the idea that traditional RPGs are no longer made, which only holds true if you arbitrarily choose to ignore Japan, handhelds and indies. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind or fishing for Kodex Kool Kredits.

It was obviously just my mind playing tricks on me when seeing discussions on the Codex consisting of people praising Dark Souls and Valkyria Chronicles as well as Let's Play threads of games like Tactics Ogre,Final Fantasy Tactics,Chrono Trigger,Shining in The Darkness,or Shin Megami Tensei.


And I dont know what the fuck you're on about with the whole "no love for indies" jargon considering how many people here perform fellatio on Knights of The Chalice.

 

[Stinger]

Yup, what should I be emulating though?

Use the DesMume emulator for DS games like Devil Survivor. Since it has zero '3D' models and is more less completely sprite based it shouldn't require a very high end PC.

 

[MaroonSkein]

BUT it's still not the same thing. No matter how great the game is on the DS, you wish you could see something like it on the PC, using the all the resources available. I'm not talking only about graphics, but the big screen, great sound, mouse & keyboard, mods and that sine qua non oldfag feeling that a PC will always offer a more complete & immersive experience than any handheld or console.

Really? Take a look at Clash of Heroes. There are two versions of the game: the original DS version and a later remake for PC/PS3/360. The latter version runs at a higher resolution and has much improved graphics and sound. Is it a better game than the original version? Not in the slightest. It's the same game. True, it has a shinier wrapper, but after the wow factor of it wears off (which takes an hour or so), you're left with the same product. There's nothing preventing handheld games from reaching the same highs that PC games do.

That said, if you could identify something that could give me a taste of either JA2 or TOEE combat engines or Darklands style character creation and sandbox, I'm sure I could find a way to play it.

Try Devil Survivor (DS) and Valkyria Chronicles II (PSP).

It was obviously just my mind playing tricks on me when seeing discussions on the Codex consisting of people praising Dark Souls and Valkyria Chronicles as well as Let's Play threads of games like Tactics Ogre,Final Fantasy Tactics,Chrono Trigger,Shining in The Darkness,or Shin Megami Tensei.

The first few pages of these threads are always full of "OLOLOLOLO, consoletards only like this trash because they've never seen a good game!" comments, though. The Dark Souls threads are a particularly good example. There was a noticeable drop in the number of derisive comments when the petition for a PC port was started.

And I dont know what the fuck you're on about with the whole "no love for indies" jargon considering how many people here perform fellatio on Knights of The Chalice.

The post I was replying to:

Game is banal shit, boring.

Why can we not negative brofist posts? I'd love to do that to Mastermind's above me.

Feel free to play a more traditional style RPG instead.

Oh wait, they don't make those anymore.

Do you see anything here about indies being an exception? I sure don't. Their existence is ignored for the sake of making a point.

 

[felipepepe]

Really? Take a look at Clash of Heroes. There are two versions of the game: the original DS version and a later remake for PC/PS3/360. The latter version runs at a higher resolution and has much improved graphics and sound. Is it a better game than the original version? Not in the slightest. It's the same game. True, it has a shinier wrapper, but after the wow factor of it wears off (which takes an hour or so), you're left with the same product. There's nothing preventing handheld games from reaching the same highs that PC games do.

You missed the point man, Clash of the Heroes is the kind of game that could have been released for the PS1 or even SNES and the game would still play the same way.

Think backwards: you cannot sucessufully port Fallout, Baldur's Gate, Arcanum, PS: Torment, Gothic II, Risen, DKS, Betrayal at Krondor, or even Skyrim and Dragon Age into a DS without losing a lot. It's the same as how shitty game UI has become since every RPG needs to be playable on consoles as well. So stop to imagine what great japanese developers could do if they focused on the PC instead of the DS, if they had the most complex controls and powerful hardware available. It would definetly blow away any recent AAA western "RPG", just like Dark Souls did and I'm sure that Dragon Dogma will do as well, even thought they are console-only.

 

[kris]

What good game is being ignored?

Every good game without a PC version.

Tell me about those good games. And I am serious even if I doubt I will ever play them.

 

[felipepepe]

What good game is being ignored?

Every good game without a PC version.

Tell me about those good games. And I am serious even if I doubt I will ever play them.

Speaking only on RPGs: Dark Souls for Xbox & PS3, the persona games for PS2, Monster Hunter series on the PSP and a shitload for the DS, like SMT: Devil Survivor & Strange Journey, Radiant Story, Dark Spire, Etrian's Odissey, Disgaea, Dragon Quest IX, Infinite Space, The World Ends With You, Orcs & Elves, etc...

 

[MaroonSkein]

Really? Take a look at Clash of Heroes. There are two versions of the game: the original DS version and a later remake for PC/PS3/360. The latter version runs at a higher resolution and has much improved graphics and sound. Is it a better game than the original version? Not in the slightest. It's the same game. True, it has a shinier wrapper, but after the wow factor of it wears off (which takes an hour or so), you're left with the same product. There's nothing preventing handheld games from reaching the same highs that PC games do.

You missed the point man, Clash of the Heroes is the kind of game that could have been released for the PS1 or even SNES and the game would still play the same way.

Think backwards: you cannot sucessufully port Fallout, Baldur's Gate, Arcanum, PS: Torment, Gothic II, Risen, DKS, Betrayal at Krondor, or even Skyrim and Dragon Age into a DS without losing a lot.

You're the one approaching this from the wrong angle. When you ask if a certain PC game can be directly ported to DS, the answer in most cases is going to be no. In case of 2D games, it's because all art assets were created for 640x480 or larger screens. DS' screens are much smaller than that. However, it's entirely possible to create a DS game that plays exactly like Fallout, BG or Arcanum (as in, has the same combat and character advancement systems).

3D games you mentioned are indeed impossible to port because of the lack of an analogue stick, which makes navigation in 3D space extremely difficult. The good news is that handheld technology didn't freeze when DS came out. Vita can run every single game you mentioned. Risen, DKS, Skyrim and DA won't look as good as they do on a powerful PC, but they'll run.

 

[felipepepe]

The jump from consoles games to portables is not that big, Skyrim would really only lose graphics and maybe some voices, since it's already made to be played with a controller. But if a title is PC-only, too much will be lost in the process. Any PC RPG port for a handheld would be a poor man's version of the game.

The ammount of text & information that Fallout or Planescape have on-screen are simply impossible to fit in any handheld screen, they would have to compromise the character screen & iten description, simplify menus and the UI, and remove the combat log. Controlling your party in BG would be impossible, a touch-screen is great, but is still no match for a mouse & keyboard, that's why even Age of Empire DS had to ditch the RTS and became turn-based. No doubt older games like Wizardy can be perferctly ported, just like Dark Spire shows, but we are in motherfucking 2012, it's not that absurd to ask for a RPG that goes beyond 30-years-old dungeon-crawnling.

Again, I'm not bashing portables, I love my DS and enjoyed many games on it, but I really understand and sometimes feel the same as Codexers that wishes for a real RPG made with the PC in mind, filled with text & description, full keyboard & mouse controls, mods, and other things that any console or portable game simply cannot provide. And I hope that I can soon point out AoD as the example of what we wanted and finally got.

 

[SCO]

Keep dreaming.

Unless the game file formats of the AoD are especially tailored to be "appendable" (like the various 2da, bcs and ids in BGs), and there is such a tool/programming language like weidu available, i wouldn't hold my breath for AoD to be moddable (much like bloodlines really isn't or Prelude to Darkness).

A eminently moddable game (not the haphazard abominations that; indeed; engines like morrowind or BG-weidu result in) would need some hardcore modularization code tools.
At a bare minimum quests should have a kind of "description language" and functions that affect parts of the world (join faction, leave faction, seal map, show map, kill dude, make dude hostile, charm dude, use object, take object, steal object) would use those descriptions to enable/fail/disable quests/objects/npcs/maps automatically so that a mod doesn't need to know about other mods affecting a npc, only that if the player kills them; or a map is disabled forever it is failed if the quest is not beyond that stage; and even that won't help for logical errors; only the "busy work" of not leaving unconnected ends dangling as red herrings.