Fallout Let's DISCUSS the Vault Experiments again!

[Gozma]

Whose idea was the shit where every vault was a sinister social experiment? Did that start in FO2 somewhere?

 

[likaq]

Yes, shit abominable retarded idea "vaults are social experiment" started in FO2

 

[Gozma]

^ I somewhat thought it started in VB/the FO bible is why I brung it up

 

[Drakron]

Whose idea was the shit where every vault was a sinister social experiment? Did that start in FO2 somewhere?

FO2 made it clear that it kinda was, more of a side project really as it was more about the Enclave having test samples for their "wipe all the mutants" virus, plus I guess that how they managed to fund the Enclave itself by using the Vault program to get the funds and the technology without anyone noticing it much.

On the other hand, this was just something that was mentioned to why the Vaults had such a fail ratio, in Fallout none of the Vaults actually worked (even Vault 13 that just failed) and in FO2 we did had a Vault that did the job, Vault 8 since it was supposed to be a control Vault ... Vault 13 was simply picked because its relationship with Arroyo made it far more suitable.

 

[Seaking4]

Whose idea was the shit where every vault was a sinister social experiment? Did that start in FO2 somewhere?

FO2 made it clear that it kinda was, more of a side project really as it was more about the Enclave having test samples for their "wipe all the mutants" virus, plus I guess that how they managed to fund the Enclave itself by using the Vault program to get the funds and the technology without anyone noticing it much.

On the other hand, this was just something that was mentioned to why the Vaults had such a fail ratio, in Fallout none of the Vaults actually worked (even Vault 13 that just failed) and in FO2 we did had a Vault that did the job, Vault 8 since it was supposed to be a control Vault ... Vault 13 was simply picked because its relationship with Arroyo made it far more suitable.

Wasn't Vault 13 the control vault? They just mixed up the order so Vault 13 got one extra Geck and Vault 8 got extra water chips.

 

[Drakron]

Wasn't Vault 13 the control vault? They just mixed up the order so Vault 13 got one extra Geck and Vault 8 got extra water chips.

No, looking at the wiki it was a study on prolong isolation and was meant to stay closed for 200 years.
Vault 8 was open 10 years after the bombs, it was meant as a control Vault.

But as I said this was due to the changes from Fallout to Fallout 2 ... in Fallout none of the Vaults actually work as in Fallout 2 is were the whole social experiment plot was added.

 

[Morality Games]

Yes, shit abominable retarded idea "vaults are social experiment" started in FO2

Heh. It's not so bad, although it seems more like something from the Cthulhu mythos than something the government would do.

 

[Spectacle]

Yes, shit abominable retarded idea "vaults are social experiment" started in FO2

Heh. It's not so bad, although it seems more like something from the Cthulhu mythos than something the government would do.

No, it is that bad, it's completely retarded, comic book style Evil Scientists doing Mad Science for the lulz. All issues of ethics and practicality aside, there is no fucking way anyone would even consider spending that much time and resources on a psychology experiment. The whole thing is completely immersion breaking and the main reason why I consider Fallout 1 to be the only real game in the series.

 

[Roguey]

Whose idea was the shit where every vault was a sinister social experiment? Did that start in FO2 somewhere?

http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/fallout-4.72806/page-121#post-3299561

:D

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Personally, I liked the original idea of Vault 15 suffering from multiple failures. First a water controller chip malfunction, then a meltdown and finally an earthquake burial.

 

[Morality Games]

Yes, shit abominable retarded idea "vaults are social experiment" started in FO2

Heh. It's not so bad, although it seems more like something from the Cthulhu mythos than something the government would do.

No, it is that bad, it's completely retarded, comic book style Evil Scientists doing Mad Science for the lulz. All issues of ethics and practicality aside, there is no fucking way anyone would even consider spending that much time and resources on a psychology experiment. The whole thing is completely immersion breaking and the main reason why I consider Fallout 1 to be the only real game in the series.

You definitely have to strain it for it make sense, but its not ultimately more implausible than the idea that art decko would have a cultural monopoly over the United States' moral and visual norms 130 years after its time. That's been part of the series since the original Fallout.

The idea starts making more sense when you start piecing together the puzzle. 50s aesthetics aside, the Great War broke out in the 2070s and 2080s. That's an era where even modern projections suggest we may have devised anti-matter rocketry that would allow us to travel through space at 40-70% the speed of light. Looking at it strictly from the point of the view of the government of the time, the implications of failure (the end of the human race and civilization as the Enclave knew and considered their moral prerogative to preserve) were sufficiently serious that using the vaults as an experiment to thin out any margin for error and obtain a more perfect design for an enclosed human habitation in a colony ship was morally justifiable.

Both the United States and Soviet militaries did some similarly outlandish and crooked experiments during the Cold War, with Stalin investigating whether it was possible to breed humans and chimpanzees to create super-soldiers.

 

[Night Goat]

No, it is that bad, it's completely retarded, comic book style Evil Scientists doing Mad Science for the lulz. All issues of ethics and practicality aside, there is no fucking way anyone would even consider spending that much time and resources on a psychology experiment. The whole thing is completely immersion breaking and the main reason why I consider Fallout 1 to be the only real game in the series.

 

[Hugh Vagoth]

People are upset over the Vault experiments because they're "immersion breaking" and "sci-fi lulz"? Isn't Fallout that game series that takes places in an alternate retro futuristic '50s universe with super mutants and flying robots?

 

[Xor]

People are upset over the Vault experiments because they're "immersion breaking" and "sci-fi lulz"? Isn't Fallout that game series that takes places in an alternate retro futuristic '50s universe with super mutants and flying robots?

People turning into zombies after being exposed to radiation, giant animals, two-headed cows, a drug that makes you immune to radiation, and an instant healing elixir are all obviously more reasonable than something as unrealistic as the vault experiment.


I sometimes think people who bitch about Fallout 2 ruining the series by not taking itself seriously weren't paying very close attention to the first game.

 

[FeelTheRads]

That old thing again.

Did you know that if sci-fi has interstellar spaceships it's ok to have elves too? True story.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

People turning into zombies after being exposed to radiation, giant animals, two-headed cows, a drug that makes you immune to radiation, and an instant healing elixir are all obviously more reasonable than something as unrealistic as the vault experiment.


I sometimes think people who bitch about Fallout 2 ruining the series by not taking itself seriously weren't paying very close attention to the first game.

Err... These aren't equivalent. One refers to violating rules of physics and biology of our universe, another to human motivations.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Looking at it strictly from the point of the view of the government of the time, the implications of failure (the end of the human race and civilization as the Enclave knew and considered their moral prerogative to preserve) were sufficiently serious that using the vaults as an experiment to thin out any margin for error and obtain a more perfect design for an enclosed human habitation in a colony ship was morally justifiable.

There would be no need for this if only they had doctor Albert Tokaj to combat the confinement syndrome.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

I think it was indeed Tim Cain who coined the basic plot of FO2, Enclave, Vault Experiments, etc.

I think it actually made sense when the Vault Experiments were, you know, stuff that made sense. Like a vault isolated for 200 years, or a vault full of different cultures. Or the vault that breaks down constantly, the one with overcrowding, etc etc. Fallout-verse has pretty much every tech needed to make a fusion-powered orion-propelled starship, complete with cryo.

It does explain why some vaults turn out differently from each other, its a nice way to allow vaults to be different from each other.
The problem is that vaults are being banalised since 3, every game has four vaults in it in such a small area and they're all just dungeons where something happened and now everybody's dead/left. Essentially, every vault except 101 in FO3 and FNV = Vault 15. Over and over. At least the ones in FNV weren't as banal.

 

[sser]

Lore-wise, the vaults make perfect sense. The 1950s/60s were full of insane government experiments and I think the alternate-history timeline builds on that. Hell, Dr. Strangelove kinda parodies the vault idea, and it works because it's totally believable that a circa 1950s government would, under duress, come up with such a bizarre plan. If anything, the notion of a vault system is more sane than some of the actual, real-life shit world governments have thought up.

 

[naossano]

It is only Fo3 that made most vault doomed.
It isn't the same in FoNV.
Vault 3 was fine before the fiends came to slaughters the inhabitants.
Vault 11 was nasty, but this is the inhabitants that chose to make a civil war. Had they not did it, it would have survived longer.
Vault 34 was fine before the Boomers & the guy with the bright follower left, which was pretty recent. Then, it went hell.
Vault 21 had gambler who surrundered to House after a lost bet.
Dunno about Vault 19 fate, but the experiment itself didn't feel lethal.
Only vault 22 was screwed by the experiments.

Vault 15 is in Fo1-Fo2, not FoNV.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

It is only Fo3 that made most vault doomed.
It isn't the same in FoNV.
Vault 3 was fine before the fiends came to slaughters the inhabitants.
Vault 11 was nasty, but this is the inhabitants that chose to make a civil war. Had they not did it, it would have survived longer.
Vault 34 was fine before the Boomers & the guy with the bright follower left, which was pretty recent. Then, it went hell.
Vault 21 had gambler who surrundered to House after a lost bet.
Dunno about Vault 19 fate, but the experiment itself didn't feel lethal.
Only vault 22 was screwed by the experiments.

Vault 15 is in Fo1-Fo2, not FoNV.

Vault 3 is actually a commentary on Vault 13. Like 13 they had a water problem but rather than remaining isolated and sending a lone vault dweller to find a way to fix it, they opened up and tried to strike a relationship with the nearby locals, which backfired.

 

[Darth Roxor]

did this really warrant a thread split

jesus christ

 

[Lhynn]

People turning into zombies after being exposed to radiation, giant animals, two-headed cows, a drug that makes you immune to radiation, and an instant healing elixir are all obviously more reasonable than something as unrealistic as the vault experiment.

I sometimes think people who bitch about Fallout 2 ruining the series by not taking itself seriously weren't paying very close attention to the first game.

Do people really cant tell the difference between something that makes sense within universe and something that doesnt?
Yes, suspension of disbelief works like that, we can believe mages can throw fireballs in a given story, but we will find hard to believe that smart, capable officials have the same motivation as mustache twirling villains. I know you are trying to be funny, but when i read shit like this i find it painful.

 

[taxalot]

How about some middle ground : realizing that this shit doesn't make any sense at all, but it's sill pretty fun and cool ?

 

[toro]

How about some middle ground : realizing that this shit doesn't make any sense at all, but it's sill pretty fun and cool ?

Is this an experiment?