My Fallout 3 impressions.

[gunman]

It's Fallout. It's different from Interplay's Fallout because Interplay is not making it. Call it whatever you want, I don't care and it doesn't matter.

Too bad New World Computing disappeared before making Fallout 3.

Fallout 3, by New World Computing

 

[Hamster]

Wow, stupid fanboism right here on codex.
Accusing someone of "calling game a piece of shit" in responce to slightest criticism is something i would expect from 13 years old x-boxers.
Retarded "it's different" argument is also present:

It's different from Interplay's Fallout because Interplay is not making it

 

[Stevee Wonder]

Just a quick analogy, before I go to sleep:
Let's imagine a setting, where the wheel is not invented.
It's a very cool setting, and somebody buys rights to make a racing game in it.
Yea, racing on cars with wheels and whatnot.
It may turn out that it's the best racing game of all time, but if you care about setting, you can only play it by putting a 'mental block' and saying 'it's not "setting X"! Wheels are impossible there, so it's just some sort of spin-off.'
If you can do it - you will enjoy the game. If not - it would be the proverbial 'spoonful of tar in a bucket of honey' for you.

So, in order for me to enjoy F3 (just like for VD), I must renounce all it's ties to Fallout 1 and 2. Otherwise, I'd have to cringe at the butchered lore constantly, thus lowering my enjoyment considerably, to the point of complete rejection. (See skyway).

So reading in Fallout is like inventing the wheel?

What.. the.. fuck?

You assume that people in Fallout 3 can't read then go back and 'retcon' Fallout 1/2 to be full of illiterates as well?

What.. the.. fuck?

Internal consistency?

What.. the.. fuck?

Like Vault 'experiments' weren't a fucking hackjob in the first place because it 'sounded zany and cool!'.

Seriously.

What.. the.. fuck.

 

[Chefe]

Wow, stupid fanboism right here on codex.
Accusing someone of "calling game a piece of shit" in responce to slightest criticism is something i would expect from 13 years old x-boxers.

Yea... no.

Observe:

I didn't even know FO3 was supposed to be set 200 years after the war before reading it here. Mostly because nothing in the game makes it seem like it would be.

Yea, mostly because people don't really behave like it's been a few generations after the bombs fell. Somebody already mentioned literacy, and it's a very good question... the Moira questline for 'writing a book' is not only haven for the most stupid dialogue in the game, but if you think about it - it's utterly pointless! The 'target audience' of those books (wastelanders, for instance) should not be able to read it!
Is there anything in Fallout lore that can explain this?

Is there anything in Fallout lore that can explain this?

Do you need Fallout lore to tell how people can learn to read? WTF?

Holy shit man... just wow.

Maybe it's a fucking pop-up picture book with Molerats that fold up. Then even you might fucking understand it.

Somebody already mentioned literacy, and it's a very good question... the Moira questline for 'writing a book' is not only haven for the most stupid dialogue in the game, but if you think about it - it's utterly pointless!

Why? I mean serious folk ... its not WRITING WAS CREATED OVER OVER 4000 YEARS!

RIGHT!

I guess LITERACY CAN ONLY BE ARCHIVED BY THE AWESOME POWER OF SCIENCE!!!! not having someone explain what letters means and how to construct phrases, you know ... HOME TEACHING!

Heh, you think you are so smart, huh?
Well, while writing existed for thousands of years, absolute most people, except for elite (nobles, priests), were illiterate. That changed only about a hundred years ago, when a lot of jobs started to require literacy, and a system of public education was established.
What do we have in a PA world? Schools destroyed (well, all infrastructure destroyed). People have to battle for survival - spending every waking hour hunting and scavenging for food, working in the fields, etc.
The first generation would be literate, and may attempt to teach their offspring basics of literacy, with varying degree of success. And then they die off.
Next generation may not even bother teaching their children - they have much more problems at hand, due to pre-war food reserves running out, and this skill being generally useless in day-to-day life of a 'typical wastelander'.
And remember, kids, as a norm, are LAZY and DON'T LIKE TO READ (and learn in general). Imagine a typical console retard (redding is teh hard!), but 2x dumber due to malnutrition and genetic aberrations. Imagine him in a situation where he has to toil 12 hours a day just to survive and his parents too, btw. No schools, no teachers, very few (if any) books. No reading with a flashlight under a pillow… cause flashlights are a damn precious commodity. Fuck, some people cannot even afford clean water!
Now that continues for about 5 generations before game starts (likely even more, cause life should be much shorter in general... supermutants aside).
Of course, people in vaults must be literate, and perhaps so are people in large settlements, where they can have luxury of free time, and where literacy may actually be useful (but not all, certainly – only ‘high class’ citizens).
But remember, it's Moira's book I'm talking about. People in Vaults will not see it - they are sealed from outside world. Elite in large settlements do not really need it - they are established already.
Target audience of this book, 'typical wastelanders', struggling to survive on a day-to-day basis... are highly likely to be illiterate.
That's what I'm talking about.

Btw, read this article I've googled after one minute of searching:

Illiteracy in the united states.
Year 1880, and some states still boast total illiteracy of more then 50%. So much for '4000 years'.
Don't underestimate the effect apocalypce can have on people. You think it takes a lot for them to 'turn native'?

EDIT:

Also, an example from Russian history (talking about 'Blessed Monarchy and evil commies', heh)

At the time of the Bolshevik Revolution, 37.9 percent of the male population above seven years old was literate and only 12.5 percent of the female population was literate.

That was quickly fixed after the revolution, but the point still stands.
Rewind another 50 years ago - and we have 100% illiterate peasants (that stand for "typical wastelanders") and about 10% of literate people - them being government officials, clergy, nobility and some craftsmen.
If you think that nuclear war cannot set civilization back a few hundred years... well, I admire you optimism

A nuclear war CAN thrown back humanity several centuries but that is just technologically, society can regress (it did in terms of slavery but that is because government collapsed) but that is a diferent subject and if women are allowed to vote, hold higher office and there is racial equality why on Earth would they decide "reading is teh hard" and ditch it? especially when its a easily taught very useful skill with all that pre-Great War stuff lying around?

Well, some people would gladly skip learning to read now if they could get away with that, I can guarantee you that. Otherwise we’d not have the ‘full voice acting’ being basically a requirement for games.
And reading is NOT very easily taught skill. It takes practice, literature and, above all - lots of time and dedication. And, unlike our brave protagonist, people in PA setting don't have such luxury. When war throws you back technologically a few hundred years, you must remember, that during that time an average peasant had to spend MOST of their time dedicated to survival - growing crops, mending tools and housing, fighting raiders, etc. And due to radiation, collapse of infrastructure, etc – it would be EVEN HARDER then for an average MA peasant. So, unless they REALLY need to, they will not spend their valuable time on teaching children to read and write (especially - write, and once books begin to fall apart - which is even noted in F3 - there would be nothing to learn from).
So, why do you think they would consider teaching their children literacy?
"Lots of prewar stuff" would be USELESS for 'an average wastelander'. And operation of guns/plows can be easily described vocally, just like it was for thousands of years.
Books will decay after a hundred years, especially w/o proper storage conditions.
Computers are available only to BOS and Vaults - and they don't have a problem with literacy, anyway. The fact that they are everyone in F3 is a travesty.
I daresay they would only know a few more common written words (like you may remember a few hierogliphs), and not much else.
Am I missing anything?

Now, Hamster, hopefully you'll see the benefit of reading a thread before posting some stupid comment.

 

[Claw]

FO3 takes place 200 years after the war, yet the world looks like it's been only a few decades. Working computers are everywhere (i.e. not in labs, but in abandoned buildings).

Fallout did a good job maintaining the PA atmosphere and presenting two worlds - the wasteland and the pre-war "islands" (vaults, military base, etc). Fallout 3 mixes them up carelessly. The artefacts of the long gone age are everywhere (mostly because Bethesda failed to maintain the 200 year since the war angle) and finding a working computer or a pre-war still intact location doesn't give you a sense of wonder.

Same goes for food, working cola machines, and those attached to walls medical boxes that seemed to be everywhere. Everyone wants scrap metal, yet metal is one thing this setting is loaded with. In fact, there is too much of pretty much everything in Fallout 3. Comparing both games, it's hard to say FO3 takes place more than a 100 years later. In fact it looks like the other way around. It has more in common (super mutants including) with Gears of War, not Fallout.

(...)

Exploding cars, nuclear catapults, harmless nuclear explosions, etc. 'nuff said.

You can easily fill your house with brand new scientific equipment that shouldn't have been around for 200 years.

Robot-butler.

There is an organization, called The Railroad, that's dedicated to helping androids gain their independence. I'll repeat that. DEDICATED TO HELPING ROBOTS GAIN INDEPENDENCE. In a post-apocalyptic world.

Comes with a robot who managed to become human. Interesting quest overall, but it's not Fallout.

Quite frankly those sound more like bad design than just "not Fallout" to me. I mean, even if we accept that it's not Fallout, it still is a post-apocalyptic scenario supposedly taking place 200 years after the war, and according to you it fails in that regard as well.

My review explains what I liked. Disagree? Argue.

When will we be able to read your review then?

3 games that get a lot of love at the Codex:

Bloodlines, Gothic 2, The Witcher

(...) but they are very, very far from being perfect.

Well, I don't know who claimed they were. It's more relevant how their flaws compare to Bethout's. I guess I'm gonna have to play Bethout first.

 

[Balor]

And hey, you know what? Not everyone has to read. Some people may be read to! Like your mommy reads to you at night. And as long as one person can read the book to see the effects of rad poisoning and how to deal with then everyone benefits.

Fuck. Reading in Fallout. Serious fucking business.

Hey, now THAT is an argument I can agree with!
While most people can (and should) be illiterate, there are bound to be a few 'lorekeepers' here and there, that make their living by 'identifying' stuff, preserving and reading books, and carefully training apprentices. Fuck, that is even in AoD, how could I forget that.
So, I rest my case.

Chefe is still a fangirl bitch that loves putting words in other people's mouths and putting cocks in her mouth, though.
I rather enjoy F3 for what it is - pretty atmospheric PA game, with lots of merits and lots of flaws... some of which can be fixed easily, but it will never become a true Fallout sequel, due to butchered lore.

 

[Hamster]

Observe:
.

So, i see that Balor likes to have arguments about lore, nothing wrong about that.
Where is the "F3 is a piece of shit" comment you are rambling about?

 

[gunman]

F3 is a piece of shit

 

[Drakron]

Sorry Balor but I am afraid you are looking at the wrong games.

Fallout 1 had Mariposa Base running at 100%, Fallout 2 had Sierra Army Depot also working at 100% as I could mention the Lost Hills Bunker, Poseidon Energy Oil Rig or Navarro Base.

How about New Reno? it had a Chop Shop at its entry ... how about the New California Republic Capital (Shady Sands) or Vault City?

How about Broken Hills and its nuclear reactor that powers the town? or Gecko that was build on a (still) functional Poseidon Power Plant No. 12 (that had a functional terminal that had access to the PoseidonNet network).

Yes, some towns looked like they had no power but we KNOW Broken Hills had it and so did Shady Sands (in Fallout 2) and Vault City so we cannot really tell if they had power or not just looking at the graphics.

Again, the problem lies what people THINK Fallout is about and ignore ANYTHING that contradicts it ... like the Gun Runners in Fallout 1 that already manufactured ammunition but since it goes against the lost tech were bullets have to be as rare as one headed cows so its just ignored.

Serious ... a lot of locations in Fallout 3 have nothing besides destroyed houses and rubble and yes, all the "dungeons" have items but then again, so did the locations of the previous Fallout titles (its called "carrot-on-stick", if exploration of ruins given us nothing besides getting out of then with less ammo and healing items the player would ignore then) and since Fallout 3 have a open world is no wonder it sticks up far more that the previous Fallout games were we knew that shack in the middle of nowhere was either connected to a quest or had loot as in Fallout 3 you have no idea if those building over there have anything at all.

Heck I explored a power station in Fallout 3 and all I got as a locked safe containing some ammo, some pre-war money and some random junk item.

 

[Texas Red]

Can GF 6600 play FO 3 on minimum without horrendous lag?

 

[Vault Dweller]

My review explains what I liked. Disagree? Argue.

When will we be able to read your review then?

I was talking about Gothic 3 there and meant my G3 review. I'm still playing Fallout 3. Expect a review in about 2 weeks.

The writing is ok overall. Occasionally it's awful, sometimes it's pretty good, overall it's more than passable. Most audio and text files are well written. Most side quests' dialogues are good.

Examples of this? I'm having a lot of trouble finding those dialogue strings.

I'll post some screens when I got home (it's 10am in Toronto, so that might take awhile).

Here you go:

 

[gunman]

Bethesda brings choices and consequenses to a new level in Fallout 3

Shooting Amata (please be patient during the hectic FPS hack and slash)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2V93k4mEprQ

 

[Vault Dweller]

- gunman gains 5 instant credibility points and "I too hate Bethesda!" cool perk.

 

[gunman]

- gunman gains 5 instant credibility points and "I too hate Bethesda!" cool perk.

Hey, I don't hate Bethesda more that McDonalds or Microsoft. They are sucsessful businesses. I only hate the people that needs them

 

[Vault Dweller]

I bet you think that sounded really cool.

 

[gunman]

I bet you think that sounded really cool.

Of course. Cheers! (pouring another glass of wine). To hell with it!

 

[spectre]

Tsk tsk, VD you're fogetting that you too, at some point in time, were young, naive, wanted to fit in, fuck the system and put on yellow shoelaces?

 

[gunman]

Jesus Christ man! Are you saying that after growing up, we are going to accept Bethesda, Microsoft and McDonalds?

 

[Stevee Wonder]

I think he is saying that when you grow up you may realize how ridiculous you sound in trying to equate the three.

Oh wait. Interplay and Troika were freaking philanthropists and would turn down billions just to make you happy. I keep forgetting that.

 

[gunman]

I think he is saying that when you grow up you may realize how ridiculous you sound in trying to equate the three.

Oh wait. Interplay and Troika were freaking philanthropists and would turn down billions just to make you happy. I keep forgetting that.

Stevee Wonder, I don't want to hurt your feelings, but I'm pretty sure that I'm older than you. Secondly, I rather eqauate the three mentioned by me, than equating Bethesda with Interplay and Troika.

 

[Mr. Wednesday]

Jesus Christ man! Are you saying that after growing up, we are going to accept Bethesda, Microsoft and McDonalds?

See there's a computer chip in your brain that activates eventually (developed by Bethesda, financed by M$, McDonalds gives them food I think) and makes you a corporate $lave.

Oh and Walmart is evil too i think.

 

[Elwro]

Can GF 6600 play FO 3 on minimum without horrendous lag?

If it's a 6600GT, then yes. I set all viewing distances to maximum and I'm playing with no problems on my Amd 3600+ with a 6600GT. It runs better than Oblivion. If it's a 'regular' 6600, then I don't know.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Bethesda brings choices and consequenses to a new level in Fallout 3

Shooting Amata (please be patient during the hectic FPS hack and slash)

Hahahahah. Now that's just freakin' sad. Why even have her in an area in the game where you can kill her if you start shooting guards and the Overseer if they're going to use her prior to leaving the vault? She's off screen through the first part of the killing, just have her "pop out" of the game until she's needed. Popping out would be better than letting the player kill her and then she turns up alive again.

 

[Wintermute]

Tranny Alert!

 

[Claw]

Popping out would be better than letting the player kill her and then she turns up alive again.

Don't be daft, she was never dead. The player just knocked her unconscious by shooting her in the head. "Popping out" would be unnatural. I applaud Bethesda's attempts at creating a coherent gameworld.