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Preview Negative Dragon Age preview

Monolith

Prophet
Joined
Mar 7, 2006
Messages
1,290
Location
München
Tags: BioWare; Dragon Age

John Walker from Rock, Paper, Shotgun had a short look at Dragon Age during the E3, getting shown the dragon battle and a supposedly romantic scene. <a href="http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/06/10/rps-at-e3-dragon-age-origins/#more-12708">He was not amused</a>.
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<blockquote>Our hero - one of the Grey Wardens, the group to which players will belong in an effort to fight back against the Blight, and the evil Arch Demon bringing it about - has a present for a lady, Morrigan. It’s a magical book that she has been looking for. She’s going to be very pleased to receive it. Once it’s dragged from our inventory to hers, she responds with some of the most excruciatingly dreadful flirtation I’ve ever seen. The acting is very weak, my face screwed up as I wrote the word “AWFUL” on my pad in the dark. She’s dressed as you might imagine a girl would appear on the cover of a 1980s D&D book, wearing what appear to be a couple of straps of material, most of her breasts hanging out. We can respond to her elephantine attempts at flirting by suggesting we’re open to her ideas. Once we’ve ambiguously agreed to her advances a couple of times, it cuts to a glimpse of an awkward sex scene that saw everyone in the room burst out laughing. Possibly not the desired reaction.
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This all took place in a camp - something you can create at any time while wandering the game’s open spaces, a place to recoup, get some sleep, and chat with your companions. And indeed fuck them all, apparently. Because as we emerged from our night with Morrigan, we went over to chat with the slightly more modestly dressed redhead Leliana, who it turns out is apparently our girlfriend. Leliana’s voice makes Morrigan’s seem Shakespearian. The delivery is so deeply weird, stunted and childish. Unsurprisingly she’s upset at our bedroom antics, and protests. But not with any vigour or passion, but rather damply complains that it’s not particularly nice of us to go sleeping with other women right in front of her. Acknowledging that she can’t necessarily stop us from sleeping around, she meekly asks that we either stick just with her, or have the grace to break up with her as we continue our conquests. We choose to tell her that we love her really. She immediately capitulates and welcomes us back into her arms, before you’ve washed the smell of the last woman off you. So romantic! Here my notepad reads, “Pathetic.”</blockquote>
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I can understand awful, awkward, pathetic - but <b>childish</b>? Somebody should tell him that Dragon Age is a <b>mature</b> RPG, for fucks sake. A million dollars marketing campaign can't be wrong.
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Spotted at: <a href="http://www.rpgwatch.com">RPG Watch</a>
 

Ahzaruuk

Arbiter
Joined
Oct 15, 2006
Messages
1,184
Location
Just a city called Sirius.
Not surprising, really.

Games that try to label themselves as Mature instantly present the opposite impression. Just like anyo ther marketing buzzword used.
 

Silellak

Cipher
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,198
Location
Tucson, AZ
This was fucking painful to read. I had high hopes for this game back when it was announced in 2004 or whenever. Now I almost wish it'd been mercifully canceled rather than turned into this hybrid of BG2 and the Witcher, as written by a 13 year old boy.
 

Brother None

inXile Entertainment
Developer
Joined
Jul 11, 2004
Messages
5,673
Ahzaruuk said:
Not surprising, really.

It's not surprising that DA comes off as tripe

It's more surprising that the media, and not just RPS, are acknowledging fully how terrible it looks, and how nonsensical the PR campaign is.
 

Mister Arkham

Scholar
Joined
Apr 24, 2008
Messages
763
Location
Not buried deep enough
It's true enough that the negative press is surprising. Maybe the gaming media has just gotten tired of giving Bioware something of a free pass, especially since they're now an EA property and everyone still loves to shit on EA... I don't know, if the game had been released in it's original form several years ago it might be different, but now it looks vapid and forgettable to me, like a serious step backwards. Given how the game looks, the super-hyping on Bioware's part, and it's lengthy development cycle this reeks like a vanity project of near Daikatana levels.

That said, I'm going to start using "I'd like to give her a book" around friends this week just to see what happens.
 
Joined
May 6, 2009
Messages
1,875,973
Location
Glass Fields, Ruins of Old Iran
We can respond to her elephantine attempts at flirting by suggesting we’re open to her ideas

It seems you can avoid all this clusterfuck by saying "No thx, bai", so no problem really. People that like the sex get what they want, people that don't like the sex get what they want.
 

Gromnir

Liturgist
Joined
Jan 11, 2004
Messages
394
1) tangential crpg romance is always gonna be stoopid

you got a limited number o' dialogue encounters to takes characters from introduction through entire dramatic arc... and you gotta do so that is insular and discreet relative to critical path plot. is always gonna be rushed and seeming childish given how little genuine development writers can devote to such stuff. to then takes a single brief encounter within a necessarily already rushed romance arc as a kinda indicator o' dragon age romance quality may be an approach that is having multiple opportunities for flaw.

personal, Gromnir LOATHES crpg romance as they has been showing up in games since bioware did bg2. to has some reviewer tell us that da romance is Fail is hardly gonna shock us as we thinks the whole notion o' a tangential romance is busted. that being said, such stoopid romances as has appeared in bio and obsidian and other developer games in recent years is remarkable popular with the fans... particularly women gamers.

*shrug*

am understanding that the e3 preview were showing how there were game mechanics aspects related to da romances. am not sure what is so significant 'bout adding a gift-giving feature to romances. perhaps the developers is still sore that atari and hasbro got all worked up over brothels post nwn... so now they essentially turn all romantic interests into wh0res who "put-out" in response to being compensated with gifts? can player skip the gift nonsense and provide monetary gold equivalent? perhaps biowarians has developed a menu o' services that the romantic interests will provide, and the gift/cost equivalent to receive each service?

...

am not a fan o' tangential romance. am very much opposed to this "innovative" gift-giving mechanic that reduces romance interests to level o' prostitutes. 'course Gromnir also recognizes that given the necessarily rushed nature o' a tangential romance, a snippet o' such a romance is gonna seem particular bad. hell, try and read only the lovey-dovey scenes from a Jane Austen novel. is painful. romance w/o context is almost invariable bad... save for poetry.

2) the reviewer is kinda fail.

look, as we note already, Gromnir is on-board with the notion that da romance probable sux... 'cause am not seeing how a tangential crpg romance can ever be anything but rushed and broken. that being said, when a hack reviewer tells us what we is expecting to hear, we almost feels embarrassed that we agree with the guy... somehow our pov is diminished simply by association. is a bit like when vol agrees with Gromnir.


"We can respond to her elephantine attempts at flirting by suggesting we’re open to her ideas." am getting that "elephantine" is 'posed to represent how clumsy the dialogue is implemented in da, but is horrible writing... and am not sure what clodding dialogue is... dialogue having a tendency to form... clods? every couple o' sentences we were struck by some irregularity or awkwardness that made continuing to read a chore. call ironic if you will that Gromnir would criticize writing... but Gromnir does on purpose. j. walker observations is maybe spot on, but is disappointing that the reviewers tedious writing makes us want to disagree with him as a mater o' principle.

HA! Good Fun!
 

Ahzaruuk

Arbiter
Joined
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Messages
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Just a city called Sirius.
Clockwork Knight said:
We can respond to her elephantine attempts at flirting by suggesting we’re open to her ideas

It seems you can avoid all this clusterfuck by saying "No thx, bai", so no problem really. People that like the sex get what they want, people that don't like the sex get what they want.
I think it's more the presentation that they have issues with. The fact that she's slapped together like a medival Hooker and then how she goes form "meh" to "Oh a book! that's so fucking erotic I want to bang you so hard right here" and how your actual girlfriend is like "Well that wasn't very nice of you to cheat on me right in my presence, but how bout some sex anyway?"
 

Silellak

Cipher
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,198
Location
Tucson, AZ
Clockwork Knight said:
We can respond to her elephantine attempts at flirting by suggesting we’re open to her ideas

It seems you can avoid all this clusterfuck by saying "No thx, bai", so no problem really. People that like the sex get what they want, people that don't like the sex get what they want.

This doesn't change the childish, adolescent view of women presented by the game - admittedly NOT a Bioware-specific problem, but if you're going to claim to be mature - how about you start by approaching women in fantasy at something above a high school level?

The "sex" isn't the real problem. It's a symptom of a greater problem, which is Bioware's apparent lack of understanding what the words "dark" and "mature" mean for audiences above the age of 15. They're trying to sell this game to the Baldur's Gate crowd, while at the same time alienating them by delivering a game that most adults would be embarrassed to be caught playing.

I can fast forward through the sex scenes of a porn, but that doesn't make the acting or the story any better or the maturity level any higher.
 

Talby

Arcane
Patron
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Messages
5,507
Codex USB, 2014
I'm glad Kate Mulgrew is getting some work. Someone has to be the welfare provider for former Star Trek actors now that Enterprise killed of the series.
 
Joined
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Glass Fields, Ruins of Old Iran
^Why do you think romance mods are always on the top 10 lists? Kids are people too...unfortunately

I can fast forward through the sex scenes of a porn, but that doesn't make the acting or the story any better or the maturity level any higher.

Maybe not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fate/stay_night

http://kotaku.com/254374/pc-game-manga-anime-ps2-title-porno

It's animu, but that isn't the point. It started as a game (visual novel, actually) that had porn scenes. People liked the story, it was strong enough to survive without the porn.

So maybe if you ignore the out of place/ awkward porn, DA may turn out alright.
 

Silellak

Cipher
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,198
Location
Tucson, AZ
Clockwork Knight said:
^Why do you think romance mods are always on the top 10 lists? Kids are people too...unfortunately

And now, conveniently, Bioware has removed the middle-man and will deliver awkward, poorly voiced, and horribly written romances directly to us! No fan modification necessary! Huzzah!
 

Tails

Arbiter
Joined
Nov 25, 2007
Messages
1,674
The way that DA wants to get mature label is just sad. I wonder if all that mature content was Bioware idea or EA Games...
 

Gromnir

Liturgist
Joined
Jan 11, 2004
Messages
394
Clockwork Knight said:
^Why do you think romance mods are always on the top 10 lists? Kids are people too...unfortunately

is far too easy and myopic to dismiss the fans o' crpg romance as "kids." is many adult and intelligent gamers who really do enjoy the romances. in particular, women gamers, who is often less impressed with combat encounters, seems to be fans o' the biowarian romances as they afford more/better opportunities for meaningful character interaction. these women gamers is not stoopid or childish... they recognize the flaws in the romances, but they still enjoy. romances may be busted, but even busted romances is better than no romance at all... or so the argument goes.

am not getting it. to Gromnir the tangential romances seems insulting more than intriguing, but they IS popular. something that popular ain't gonna be abandoned by bio. so real issue facing biowarians ain't IF romances should be included, but rather how the included romances can be improved. so it would seems that the new women writers at bio managed to come up with an innovative wh0ring mechanic as a way to improve bio romances.

...

color us unimpressed so far.

HA! Good Fun!
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,924
*shrug* Can't please everyone. Funny enough, the people bashing DA the most will be amongst the first to purchase, steal, and play it. R00fles!
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
http://www.joystiq.com/2009/06/04/hands ... e-origins/

Joystiq wasn't too crazy about the campfire business either:

"Despite being set in ye olde fantasy lands of impossibly large swords and questionable female attire, there's something anachronistic about Dragon Age: Origins. An uncomfortable, zealously juvenile spirit seems to permeate the dragon-slaying proceedings, a feeling that seems to linger even after the game's obnoxious marketing has left the room. Paring BioWare's scenes of war and blood and guts with a Marilyn Manson tune is such a strained ploy, it's almost embarrassing.

The thing is, not all of Dragon Age's awkwardness comes from the suits on the upper floor -- sometimes they come from the clothes discarded in front of a romantic campfire. BioWare is really playing up your character's playboy tendencies, chatting up members of his party, plying them with gifts (that have immediate stats and ability benefits) and weighing up his futures with the adorable redhead or the hard-edged sorceress."
 

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