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On why Gothic 2 original is better than NOTR.

Discussion in 'Piranha Bytes' started by Bratislav, Apr 24, 2017.

  1. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    Il make the six main ponts.

    1) The addon world is neither interesting,nor integrated in the main game. It serves as a huge chore which often leaves me just playing much more focused G2.

    2) Change in Scrolls makes the game logic fall apart. Where every scroll costs 5 mana. And chosen of Innos is no more powerful than an average farmer. In fact give a farmer scroll of summon demon and watch him beat the DRAGONS.
    Utter bad design as a cop out for making some fights too hard.

    3) Change in way Dragon fights work makes them obligatory to be cheesed as a non range player. I do agree that Dragons were too easy too.

    4) Making the game too prone to metagaming and powergaming.

    Naimly the way LP works now.

    EASY FIX: Just make two different values one for Trained LP ans other for extra elixirs etc.
    Why did the devs ignore such an easy fix is beyond me.

    5) Cosmetical but some enemies are.too powerful for the in game logic.

    6) THE BIGGEST NAIL IN THE COFFIN MAKING THE NEW BORING WORLD MANDATORY TO MAIN STORY. UTTER IDIOCY.

    Now what I do liked:

    Overall increase in difficulty is GREAT. The game really needed that for G2 veterans. I would Gladly play the NOTR but without new world and without the scroll nonsence.
     
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  2. hivemind Guest

    hivemind
    not a negative unless you are a beta casual cuck
     
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  3. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    Dont get me wrong I LOVE the idea of making it progressively harder to go beyond human abilities. (Where 100 is peak condition for a human and only very few reach it). When I heard about the change I was thrilled,it is exactly what a good system is. The only issue I have is elixirs being separate from the main pool,braking muh immersion and forcing me to power game.

    Well not really forcing me,just making it a chore.
     
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  4. Darth Roxor Prestigious Gentleman Wielder of the Huegpenis

    Darth Roxor
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    Except NotR also adds a shitton of content to the main world that is of very high quality (like the Khorinis missing people questline), which makes all your points invalid.

    NotR > Gothic 2, and I say it as someone who played NotR for the first time a year ago, and who played through base Gothic 2 like 3-4 times since its release.
     
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  5. evdk comrade troglodyte :M Patron

    evdk
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    Codex 2012 Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
    I only ever played NotR, but vanilla G2 must have been really easy, considering I still was an unstoppable magic god in the end. Admittedly, the beginning was rough.
     
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  6. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    I agree with you on base game. I love NOTR base game more as well.
    But the new world is utter fail,and they could have at least made it optional.
    Whenever I want to replay the NOTR I dread the new world.
     
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  7. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    Try playing ironman. It makes the game really interesting and fun.
    I stopped playing g2 non iron years ago.
     
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  8. Darth Roxor Prestigious Gentleman Wielder of the Huegpenis

    Darth Roxor
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    Wouldn't call it utter fail at all, although I remember 3 things that bugged me aboot it.

    1. Most of the new monsters are just reskins, which is eh.
    2. The pirates are a bit ill-fitting/random.
    3. The fuckhuge ork mob guarding the temple in the desert is a chore to get through.

    Apart from that, the runaway prisoner camp, the explorashun, the temple delving and the overall story were all cool to me.
     
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  9. Ivan Arcane

    Ivan
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    WRONG
     
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  10. Zanzoken Arcane

    Zanzoken
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    Whatever the game's merits I just can't into Gothic because of the shitty ARPG combat. The terrible controls and camera make it a cancer to play.

    I know it gets compared to Morrowind a lot -- the combat in Morrowind is shit too but in a different way. At least it's easy and non-intrusive enough to enjoy the rest of the game.

    :bunkertime:
     
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  11. Kahr Guest

    Kahr
    I don't get the hate for the pirates though.
    Greg is true bro.

    [​IMG]

    Maybe only in german where he is a Fischkopf.

    Also how can you forget all the funny corny Bandit camp stuff?
    With Bloodwyn and Raven and so on.
     
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  12. Paul_cz Arcane

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  13. Grampy_Bone Magister

    Grampy_Bone
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    I tend to agree. Instead of adding on to the leveling curve of the base game, NOTR dilutes it, and makes every quest reward and levelup feel watered down. It's XP inflation. Same gains, a lot more killing.

    The mid- and late-game of Gothic is always pretty meaningless in terms of challenge, all NOTR does is drag it out even more.
     
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  14. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    I suppose if you play magician it does get pretty easy with summons. It is fun tho to attack a group of orcs with your own summoned army. :D.

    Other clases still have some challenge tho,and you can die easily.
     
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  15. Maggot Magister Patron

    Maggot
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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire
    Jharkendar was awesome. It can be a bit annoying starting from the bottom and working your way up again on replays but it's still a fantastic area and the whole NOTR expansion makes the map feel more like a big island with lots of stuff going on in the background rather than just the main plot.
     
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  16. Grampy_Bone Magister

    Grampy_Bone
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    Not really. Combat in Gothic 1/2 is mostly binary. With weapons you either have enough attack power and armor to survive a fight or you don't. The "challenge" of the game is mostly just identifying which monsters are within your combat range and harvesting their XP. Max out your str/dex and chosen weapon, do quests to get the top tier armor, and that's it. Everything dies quickly.

    NOTR nerfed elixirs but added stone tablets so it's basically a wash. It just makes you go through more work to get the same level of stats. Not a huge increase in difficulty. The game is almost as easy to beat with 100 Str as it is with 150 Str.

    Magic is on a different curve, but regardless of your build eventually you level past the curve and faceroll everything.
     
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  17. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    A maxed out lv 60-70 paladin could never win against 10 orcs or so tho. Even 3-4 lizards are potentially deadly encounter.
    The only way would be to attack then ran away then heal which is cheesy.

    While a Fire magician,even at third circle of magic,could kill 10 orcs with little preparation,and some potions. And at 6th circle he could wipe out 30-40 orc warriors. Depending on luck.

    Merc is not even relevant as he is the weakest.

    If you are looking at it from a "il reload until I win" then sure. It is not "hard". But then you have already negated any challenge anyways.
     
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  18. Geckabor Learned

    Geckabor
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    One thing that disappointed me in NOTR was how they made the mage recruitment thing trivial, which originally required 1000 gold and a sheep. In NOTR you just need to complete a couple of quests and you're basically in for free. Was kind of a letdown, 1000 gold early in the game is quite the challenge, especially if you then additionally are probably saving points for mage stats. Also saving potions because of the LP cost changes is really metagame-y and I wonder if there's a mod that would seperate the bonus/increased stat gains from the actually invested ones. Those are basically the two problems I had with the expansion, otherwise it is:incline:.
     
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  19. Bratislav Arcane

    Bratislav
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    You can still do it the old fashion way,which I recommend as it is much more fun. It forces you to invest a bit into str and weapon skills early on,to survive. Especially if you don't cheese it with blacksmithing.
     
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  20. Grampy_Bone Magister

    Grampy_Bone
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    What game are you playing? Stand in one spot -> Swing sword like a buzzsaw -> All orcs die. That's a maxed out character in Gothic 2. Maybe munch some food afterwards to heal up, but top level armor negates most damage. How is healing "cheesy?"
     
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  21. Junmarko Goomba Patron

    Junmarko
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    It was quite funny running into Thorus again "Hey, how are you?"

    Thorus - "...who the fuck are you?"
     
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  22. Darth Roxor Prestigious Gentleman Wielder of the Huegpenis

    Darth Roxor
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    Git gud, scrublord.

    Running into the G1 water mages was much cooler.

    "Oh no... not you again" :dance:
     
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  23. Junmarko Goomba Patron

    Junmarko
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    "Can you teach me magic?"

    "...What?! Are you serious?! NO!"
     
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  24. jaydee2k Learned

    jaydee2k
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    Haha Gothic gets it so fucking right how the world is reacting towards the player char.
    You're a nobody.

    Compare this to Bethesdas idiocy where everyone shits his sorrow in your ear with the very first eye contact...
    Jesus
     
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  25. Cyberarmy Love fool Patron

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    [​IMG]
     
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