Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker Builds and Strats Thread

Octavia becomes really strong when she gets AT lvl 10.

 

Yeah, I'm just going to start over with some sort of Magus build. There's just way too much meat for the grinder to put up with dragging a wander around just for some help in hard fights. If only you could scribe scrolls. Or at least find more of them. Hell, I'd even go Scroll Savant then.

Anyway, back to the drawing board for a new build.

 

maybe the scrolls are only bugged.
scrolls are not the only strange lacking items, many weapons barely appear in the game, at some point you find a javelin +2 later a dart +5 some weapon appear barely one time in the looots/merchants.

game have toons of weapon but 90% are focus feat traps.
game need real crafting.

 

Better to make a fire bloodline sorcerer and then sneak attack with Scorching Rays and later with Hellfire rays.

 

But Scimitars are supposed to not be finessable, right?

 

in p&p, the dervish dance feat makes them finessable. they don't have dervish dance in this game, though, so it got folded into slashing grace. weapon finesse --> weapon focus scimitar --> slashing grace scimitar and you get DEX to both attack and damage.

 

Weapon Finesse, Slashing Grace, etc: this whole line of thinking is really a trap. You gain at the most 1-2 points of AC/to-hit/damage over just going strength instead.

And you lose:

• feats that you could spend on other things
• the ability to pick and choose among whatever weapons you have, and adapt your weapon according to your enemy (e.g. use a construct bane weapon whenever you're fighting constructs
• carrying capacity

 

Well we are talking about a magus here, and saint in particular. With no armor he needs a lot of dex anyway, and gets a free focus as well. Dex, int, con - there's simply not enough points for high strength as well. Even vanilla magus could use some dex until he can put on some better armor.

 

That's all good, but Dex Magus builds are perfectly viable and not a trap. It gives you much better AC until level 13 at least, plus Weapon Finesse is only one feat, and there are enough Agile weapons that you don't need Fencing or Slashing Grace. There are some really good scimitars for a Magus, too, so even Slashing Grace isn't a waste.

 

True. Sword Saint is potentially the ultimate warrior that can both tank and devastate opponents in equal measure. Of course, if built correctly, with meaningful dips here and there

 

He doesn't need dex at all.

I'll say it again, focusing on Dex to the exclusion of Strength nets you at most 1-2 points of AC/to-hit/damage. Maybe 3 AC. Your build is not suddenly going to fail to work because of losing that, and there are significant benefits to not going the Dex route.

 

To use Slashing Grace requires specialism in one weapon, not to mention that it's 3 feats. 3 feats just to be able to use your Dex attribute instead of Strength? 3 feats is a very high investment.

Go strength instead, be able to use any weapon you come across, and invest those feats into Crane Style/Wing/Riposte, gives you 7 AC.

 

Crane Style/Wing/Riposte is 4 feats (or 3 and a Monk level).
Weapon Focus isn't a wasted feat either if you pick Scimitar, Dueling sword, or Rapier as a Magus, but like I said you can easily get by with just Weapon Finesse and Agile weapons. Dex also bolsters your Reflex save (your only bad saving throw, as a Magus).

 

If you're going the Crane Style route then a Monk level makes sense, in which case it's easy to justify picking up that Dodge feat.

Weapon Focus is a bad feat because specialising in weapons is counter-productive in a game where you don't know what the best weapons are. You could find a +4 weapon but be unable to use it. Yes there's a decent mid-game Scimitar available, but what about the late-game ones? Being able to use the best weapon for the job at any given moment is a big advantage.

Reflex save: a small increase in Reflex saves isn't going to dramatically shift your save percentage.

Here's an example of some weapons that can be found in the game:

Also: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OqCOa0wmfzvp7y-N75WiWguwNusU-Lf3/view

You can see there is a wide variety of weapons offering lots of different advantages. Some are good against constructs, giants, etc.

I just don't think it's worthwhile to specialise in a single weapon type.

If I come across a Construct, I can just whip out my Construct Bane weapon and shit on it, for example.

 

People have been posting endgame weapons now, though. That +4 Scimitar is competitive with them, but the best sword is probably the +5 Dueling sword in the Lonely Barrow basement.

The difference in Reflex saves isn't a reason on its own to go Dex, but it will be probably from +3 to +6 compared to a Str build which is non-negligible, especially considering that you'll have better AC for at least half the game.

Besides that, Weapon Finesse+Agile weapon vs Crane Style is 1 feat vs 4.

 

And it limits your weapon choice massively.

 

"Forget those early game feats, take these mid to late game feats instead!"

Even taking a dip into monk, a magus still can't get crane wing until level 7 or riposte until level 11. By then, you can wear medium armor anyway. Sure, you can do more damage before level 5 with a STR build, but you'll also have less AC precisely when you need it most. You also push back your spell casting by a level by dipping into monk and that ain't nothing. At the very least, it's much less clear cut than you make it sound.

In the specific context of a sword saint, which I think was where this tangent started, that's just part of the archetype. You've already paid the opportunity cost in terms of weapon selection and fencing/slashing grace only costs you two feats. If you roll a human sword saint, you can have DEX to both attack and damage for the entire game, and that extra AC from the get-go is very helpful.

Even a normal magus should only be using one-handed melee weapons with a high threat range. If you're playing optimally, you're going to be using a rapier, a scimitar or an estoc most of the time anyway. A magus is giving up a lot less by going with grace than most other classes would.

 

Gentlemen, please remember that you are playing a d20 game. Every point in something is an extra 5% chance of success. A rat familiar for a Wizard automatically increases his success rate on a Fort save by 10%.

Small numbers matter in the d20 because the range isn't really that big.

This is why stat bloat, phat lewt and other "moar bigger numbers for look bettah" shit fucks up the entire system so badly.

 

Ok, those are all good points.

 

Might I also add that being restricted in weapon selection in case of a magus is relatively less of a deal than with other classes because one of this class features is the ability to "customize" his weapon against particularly nasty enemies. Or am I missing something here?

 

Unless you use lol my dude fights only with star knives eventually you be ok.

Regongar uses Scimitars so there are special Magus Scimitars in game
There are good rapiers including salty Codex rapier
Estocs not so much but there are at least a few

 

Right, magus is already limited in weapon choice anyway (and saint even more), but can use his abilities to cover for deficiency in his weapon instead. Flexibility in weapon choice is more of a fighter thing I think, with bonus feats and full BAB he can afford it.

 

I need a Nok Nok build. Anyone?