Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Infinitron]

That's my freaking point. Kangmaker has these retarded builds that no one would want to play for any reason other than they happen to be effective. Are there a lot of people growing up and watching movies about gnome sorcerer illusionists casting Weird spells? Is that what you wanted to be growing up? Yeah, exactly. Or maybe roll a Sword Saint/Paladin/Rogue/Bloodlines Priest multiclass that can use spell A together with ability B to produce a time continuum ripple and kill stuff with farts.

Or go play PoE you fucker

Interesting thing to say because I feel like what may have happened here is that PoE redefined people's expectations for character building. We're now used to this sort of stacking of abilities to achieve "effectiveness" as the definition of good character building (instead of BG2-style epic powers wish fulfillment), but PorkyThePaladin never got the memo.

 

[ArchAngel]

That's my freaking point. Kangmaker has these retarded builds that no one would want to play for any reason other than they happen to be effective. Are there a lot of people growing up and watching movies about gnome sorcerer illusionists casting Weird spells? Is that what you wanted to be growing up? Yeah, exactly. Or maybe roll a Sword Saint/Paladin/Rogue/Bloodlines Priest multiclass that can use spell A together with ability B to produce a time continuum ripple and kill stuff with farts.

Or go play PoE you fucker

Interesting thing to say because I feel like what may have happened here is that PoE redefined people's expectations for character building. We're now used to this sort of stacking of abilities to achieve "effectiveness" as the definition of good character building (instead of BG2-style epic wish fulfillment), but PorkyThePaladin never got the memo.

You misunderstood my point. PoE1 does not have real multiclassing and the character system and difficulty is braindead so you don't need it. It is exactly the game for retards like him.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

That's a memo I will never get either. The issue is not the stacking of abilities per se, that's perfectly fine, but the random vulgar mixing of completely unrelated and often thematically conflicting stuff. There is a reason why certain types of characters are cool and often appear in movies/books/video games. The Wild West gunfighter, the solitary Samurai, the stealthy Ninja, the battle hardened knight. They embody a certain cohesive and thematically pleasing collection of traits and characteristics that go together well.

When, on the other hand, you just let nerds throw together a bunch of crap based solely on how it functions in the context of a particular game, you get these horrifying Eldritch Knight/Kineticist/Sorcerer/Gnome Monkey hodgepodges of mental diarrhea that might work in purely functional terms, but have the aesthetic appeal of a swiss army knife.

 

[Lacrymas]

When you are basing your entire understanding of coolness on mainstream media tropes, it's not surprising people don't "get it" and nerds "throw stuff together". The discussion of narrative coherency and 3E-type multiclassing is a more interesting one, but one which has been talked about since 3E came out.

 

[Chippy]

That's a memo I will never get either. The issue is not the stacking of abilities per se, that's perfectly fine, but the random vulgar mixing of completely unrelated and often thematically conflicting stuff. There is a reason why certain types of characters are cool and often appear in movies/books/video games. The Wild West gunfighter, the solitary Samurai, the stealthy Ninja, the battle hardened knight. They embody a certain cohesive and thematically pleasing collection of traits and characteristics that go together well.

When, on the other hand, you just let nerds throw together a bunch of crap based solely on how it functions in the context of a particular game, you get these horrifying Eldritch Knight/Kineticist/Sorcerer/Gnome Monkey hodgepodges of mental diarrhea that might work in purely functional terms, but have the aesthetic appeal of a swiss army knife.

It's one extreme or the other really; your description > the class I always identify with > the useless Ranger that's always someone else's interpretation and/or resticted by game engines.

 

[Chippy]

Does this game cheat? I just interrupted the spell of an enemy (first major 'boss' you fight) and he got a fireball of without any spellcating speed factor/time displayed, and without having a wand on his corpse. I am confused. Had enough of that shit with the BG modding community.

I'd guess you didn't in fact interrupt his casting. He only failed his Defensive Casting check and provoked an Attack of Opportunity. But he probably passed his Concentration check. Those are 2 separate rolls. And actually interrupting strong casters isn't easy. Unless you're a tripper I guess.

I shot him with a ranged weapon and he stopped casting (or at least stopped the animation) and the game reported a spell interrupt. I suppose it's possible that it happened as you say - but wouldn't the animation have completed and the spell launched as the round countdown completed?.

 

[Haplo]

I saw something about meta magic feat that speeds up spell casting, maybe he had that.

Quicken spell. Yeah, I don't think the kobold has that.
But some of the stronger casters use that later on to cast 2 spells per round.

 

[Haplo]

Does this game cheat? I just interrupted the spell of an enemy (first major 'boss' you fight) and he got a fireball of without any spellcating speed factor/time displayed, and without having a wand on his corpse. I am confused. Had enough of that shit with the BG modding community.

I'd guess you didn't in fact interrupt his casting. He only failed his Defensive Casting check and provoked an Attack of Opportunity. But he probably passed his Concentration check. Those are 2 separate rolls. And actually interrupting strong casters isn't easy. Unless you're a tripper I guess.

I shot him with a ranged weapon and he stopped casting (or at least stopped the animation) and the game reported a spell interrupt. I suppose it's possible that it happened as you say - but wouldn't the animation have completed and the spell launched as the round countdown completed?.

Hmm. Not sure. Maybe he tried again next round? The actual cast time (during which you loose the spell if damaged and failed Concentration) is pretty short.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

We're

No.

Gregz are you still upset about the Zen Archer?

 

[Tacgnol]

That's a memo I will never get either. The issue is not the stacking of abilities per se, that's perfectly fine, but the random vulgar mixing of completely unrelated and often thematically conflicting stuff. There is a reason why certain types of characters are cool and often appear in movies/books/video games. The Wild West gunfighter, the solitary Samurai, the stealthy Ninja, the battle hardened knight. They embody a certain cohesive and thematically pleasing collection of traits and characteristics that go together well.

When, on the other hand, you just let nerds throw together a bunch of crap based solely on how it functions in the context of a particular game, you get these horrifying Eldritch Knight/Kineticist/Sorcerer/Gnome Monkey hodgepodges of mental diarrhea that might work in purely functional terms, but have the aesthetic appeal of a swiss army knife.

I think this relates somewhat to the whole munchkin vs thematic character argument that always rages in pen and paper circles.

You have people that build thematic characters, they'll potentially miss out on power by focusing on class fantasy and "reality" but they don't mind. Then you have the munchkin players who will create eldritch abominations of characters by stacking ungodly class combinations/archetypes etc.

I think people tend to be slightly more open to the latter in CRPGs.

 

[*-*/\--/\~]

Well, I'd love to see the munchkin rage if they limited the characters to having just one or two classes. :D

 

[Cael]

Well, I'd love to see the munchkin rage if they limited the characters to having just one or two classes. :D

Would be fine if prestige classes only needed one or two base classes to qualify. The problem, of course, is that PrC by definition is 3+ classes.

 

[Butter]

You haven't lived until you've changed professions in Grimoire 10 times, finishing on Jester.

 

[*-*/\--/\~]

Well, I'd love to see the munchkin rage if they limited the characters to having just one or two classes. :D

Would be fine if prestige classes only needed one or two base classes to qualify. The problem, of course, is that PrC by definition is 3+ classes.

Then remove the "Prestige" shit. It's only purpose is to pump egos anyway. :D

 

[ArchAngel]

Well, I'd love to see the munchkin rage if they limited the characters to having just one or two classes. :D

Would be fine if prestige classes only needed one or two base classes to qualify. The problem, of course, is that PrC by definition is 3+ classes.

Then remove the "Prestige" shit. It's only purpose is to pump egos anyway. :D

Nope, it allows combinations that base classes don't have. 3e multiclass made things like Fighter/Wizard or Wizard/Cleric not usable like in 2e so they needed to add Prestige Classes to satisfy those groups of players.

 

[Cael]

Well, I'd love to see the munchkin rage if they limited the characters to having just one or two classes. :D

Would be fine if prestige classes only needed one or two base classes to qualify. The problem, of course, is that PrC by definition is 3+ classes.

Then remove the "Prestige" shit. It's only purpose is to pump egos anyway. :D

No. It's purpose is to allow people to create a character that they want and yet be viable in a game. None of that 10/10 Cleric/Wizard shit that 3.0 forced people to do.

How the fuck do you make Thor, for example, without Bloodstorm Blade? Or Wolverine without Tiger Claw Master?

 

[Tacgnol]

Paizo's PRCs in the tabletop tend to be very specialised. They are quite rarely used in practice, but they can make some strong characters if used correctly.

Owlcat didn't adapt some of the more interesting ones unfortunately.

 

[Xeon]

Do stores reset or is there a way to reset them? I am selling all my crap to the one selling BP in the capital, he is now has so much stuff, wondering if there will be problems if I keep filling him with stuff instead of spreading it around.

Edit:
Also is there good exp grinding methods or locations? or is quest exp is the best way to level.

 

[Daidre]

Xeon
1) Shops never reset. Some consumables like rations are replenished but they keep trash you sold them until the end.
2) You can't grind exp in P:K, there is no respawn on locations and amount of exp on random encounters while traveling is close to neglectable on high levels. Also it takes time and time is extremely limited resource in Kingmaker.

Only way to get ahead of curve is to run small parties, switch off skill exp sharing to hoard it on chosen characters (I do it when my main is wiz/sorc for Persuasion + Trickery) or clean higher level locations that is available in second chapter. Kamelands or Dire Narlmarches regions has higher level content and you can get get extra couple of levels there starting from level 6-7+ but to do so some quality cheese required.
Kamelands are lot easier though.

 

[Chippy]

There's a modder on the nexus named Quality of Life that has included crafting feats and a number of other great mods. Just loaded it, and all the crafting seems to be there - problem is it takes 375 days to craft a suit of full plate armor while adventuring and 63 days while dawdling somewhere safe. Is this the official ruleset? 'Cause I was just thinking about waiting until I get the kingdom management and then crafting, but knowing Owlcat

they'll do a Fallout 2

and the magical equivalent of a nuclear bomb will go off and destroy my entire kingdom while I'm sitting around crafting

 

[Sharpedge]

Well, I'd love to see the munchkin rage if they limited the characters to having just one or two classes. :D

There wouldn't be much rage. Most of the Min/Maxing is 19 levels in class of choice and then 1 level in monk.

 

[Lacrymas]

Ah, the ol' 39 sorc/1 pal school of design.

 

[Cael]

Ah, the ol' 39 sorc/1 pal school of design.

2 levels of Pal.

 

[GloomFrost]

That's a memo I will never get either. The issue is not the stacking of abilities per se, that's perfectly fine, but the random vulgar mixing of completely unrelated and often thematically conflicting stuff. There is a reason why certain types of characters are cool and often appear in movies/books/video games. The Wild West gunfighter, the solitary Samurai, the stealthy Ninja, the battle hardened knight. They embody a certain cohesive and thematically pleasing collection of traits and characteristics that go together well.

When, on the other hand, you just let nerds throw together a bunch of crap based solely on how it functions in the context of a particular game, you get these horrifying Eldritch Knight/Kineticist/Sorcerer/Gnome Monkey hodgepodges of mental diarrhea that might work in purely functional terms, but have the aesthetic appeal of a swiss army knife.

So dont play as wired multiclasses, use normal classes. Whats the problem?? Game is perfectly beatable on standard difficulty without using just good old Paladin/warrior, assassin/alchemist classes. I honestly cant understand what are you complaining about.

 

[Cael]

That's a memo I will never get either. The issue is not the stacking of abilities per se, that's perfectly fine, but the random vulgar mixing of completely unrelated and often thematically conflicting stuff. There is a reason why certain types of characters are cool and often appear in movies/books/video games. The Wild West gunfighter, the solitary Samurai, the stealthy Ninja, the battle hardened knight. They embody a certain cohesive and thematically pleasing collection of traits and characteristics that go together well.

When, on the other hand, you just let nerds throw together a bunch of crap based solely on how it functions in the context of a particular game, you get these horrifying Eldritch Knight/Kineticist/Sorcerer/Gnome Monkey hodgepodges of mental diarrhea that might work in purely functional terms, but have the aesthetic appeal of a swiss army knife.

So dont play as wired multiclasses, use normal classes. Whats the problem?? Game is perfectly beatable on standard difficulty without using just good old Paladin/warrior, assassin/alchemist classes. I honestly cant understand what are you complaining about.

Preventing others from playing the game as they like is pretty much the driving force behind dramafags. Seen enough of them in the old 3.5 boards to know the symptoms.