Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Fedora Master]

The changes in the beta look excellent and I really respect Owlcat for continuously working on the game instead of dropping it after a couple of patches. The "Mixed" review on Steam is undeserved but casuals gonna casual.

 

[Haplo]

Dog and wolf both get 2 iteratives at 6 and 11 bab. All of them are bites so it gets 3 trip attempts at max level when leopard has only one. If I remember correctly, dog's bite also treated as 2-handed weapons with 1.5 str bonus to damage.

Thanks to higher str and size they are also ~3-4 CMB ahead of leopard. When kitty's best advantages are being small and fast.

I usually take dog (wolf) when I want Trip and smilodon when I want DPS and shared Team Feats on Sacred Huntmaster. Everything else is kinda flavor.

Since dog's and wolf's trip are based on hitting enemies, their 2nd and especially 3rd attack are not reliable to trip anyone. Also BAB goes into CMB calculations and trips with iterative attacks should also get the same penalty.

Still, it's another attempt and you may roll much higher this time. So not a total waste, particularly the 2nd.

 

[Haplo]

Arent the swordlords already ingame?!?!

Aldori Defenders are in. A Fighter Archetype focused on Dueling Swords.

Now they are introducing Aldori Swordlords - a duelist style Prestige Class with some intimidation tricks.

 

[Daidre]

Slayer works nicely with archer build - 2 Eldritch Archer/4 Thug/14 Slayer is my current run (I was thinking about 4 Thug/16 Slayer too), but I have a hard time trying to fit Aldori Swordlord somewhere. It has decent 1st level ability fort DEX to damage for Dueling Sword, but everything else is meh. Main feature is better debuff for Dazzling Display (but if I understood correctly you need to score a crit for it), some Intimidation bonuses, bit of situational AC.

I have seen some interesting changes in first chapter already (Spoilers!).

Spoiler

1) I have found 3 new locations. 2 are small, but third one is pretty big and I'd score difficulty even above Ratnook Hill. Now I am a bit paranoid about my perception and wasting all Linzi's feats on it.
2) Some locations are moved or changed places, more difficult encounters now farther from Oleg's post.
3) Spider Lair for Bokken quest got complete redesign. It is five time bigger now and you do not need to fight swarms to get berries. But fights after are even nastier than old version (and berries turn sour on timer so rest is limited) and I see even more potential butthurt in comparison. I suspect some elegant trolling from Owlcat here.
4) Game breaking bug at Stag Lord fort. I hope for a patch or workaround today.

Edit: Oh, and I forgot to mention new +1 or Masterwork weapons everywhere for missing weapon types, mostly exotics. I have found a Dart!

 

[razvedchiki]

Aldori Defenders are in. A Fighter Archetype focused on Dueling Swords.

Now they are introducing Aldori Swordlords - a duelist style Prestige Class with some intimidation tricks.

oooo yea from the olden tymes i much desired to play swasbucklers! aldori defenders rock,with one lvl of monk and you can tank and dish out some damage.
lets hope this time if you are an aldori swordlord jamandi will take notice.

 

[Yosharian]

Are there even any decent Darts for end-game? I don't remember seeing any

 

[Shadenuat]

third one is pretty big and I'd score difficulty even above Ratnook Hill

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

And fuck the Smilodon. I'll never use it as a pet. I'd rather pick the Centipede because I think picking a weaker pet makes me special.

No, I just like to have fun with a game, not copy what everyone else is doing. I think it's dumb if everyone uses the same pet, where's the fun in that? I also don't min/max or follow build guides for the same reason. Level up.

 

[Lacrymas]

I'm too cool to math.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Math is boring in a CRPG if every outcome ends up the same - same pets, same feats, same everything. Fuck that. I'd rather wing it and just have fun taking things I find cool.

 

[Yosharian]

And fuck the Smilodon. I'll never use it as a pet. I'd rather pick the Centipede because I think picking a weaker pet makes me special.

No, I just like to have fun with a game, not copy what everyone else is doing. I think it's dumb if everyone uses the same pet, where's the fun in that? I also don't min/max or follow build guides for the same reason. Level up.

I was just poking fun. I understand not wanting to pick what everyone else picks, I do it too sometimes.

But the Smilodon is so much more powerful than the other companions that it's absurd. This isn't like the Smilodon is a little bit better than the others, it's like it's literally 5x more powerful than some of them.

 

[Delterius]

my sylvan sorcerer picked a bear because bears are cool

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

I was just poking fun. I understand not wanting to pick what everyone else picks, I do it too sometimes.

But the Smilodon is so much more powerful than the other companions that it's absurd. This isn't like the Smilodon is a little bit better than the others, it's like it's literally 5x more powerful than some of them.

Even more reason not to use it IMO. If it's that overpowered I'd probably avoid it anyway since I like challenge and don't want a cakewalk through the game.

 

[Lacrymas]

But that's like saying, oh, I'll make my melee guy have 12 STR and DEX because I don't want the game to be a cakewalk. The problem lies somewhere else methinks.

 

[Yosharian]

I was just poking fun. I understand not wanting to pick what everyone else picks, I do it too sometimes.

But the Smilodon is so much more powerful than the other companions that it's absurd. This isn't like the Smilodon is a little bit better than the others, it's like it's literally 5x more powerful than some of them.

Even more reason not to use it IMO. If it's that overpowered I'd probably avoid it anyway since I like challenge and don't want a cakewalk through the game.

I hope you didn't pick a Wizard either, since they are overpowered as well.

Also don't use the Devourer of Metal longbow, because it's also overpowered.

 

[Delterius]

But that's like saying, oh, I'll make my melee guy have 12 STR and DEX because I don't want the game to be a cakewalk. The problem lies somewhere else methinks.

Well, one assumes that all melee classes are balanced towards maxing Strenght or making use of the finesse feats. This is more akin to 'pick this Fighter archetype to multiply STR bonuses by 5'. It feels kinda cheap.

It's not that people don't want to break the game. Rather, they want to be classy about it. It's is not unlike dating, I suppose.

 

[Yosharian]

my sylvan sorcerer picked a bear because bears are cool

Sylvan Sorcerers are pretty overpowered, are you sure you're being cool by picking one?

 

[Delterius]

my sylvan sorcerer picked a bear because bears are cool

Sylvan Sorcerers are pretty overpowered, are you sure you're being cool by picking one?

Please, I played 50 different combinations of arcane casters in 100 hours and only killed the stag lord twice. I have been all shades of cool and uncool.

 

[Cael]

But that's like saying, oh, I'll make my melee guy have 12 STR and DEX because I don't want the game to be a cakewalk. The problem lies somewhere else methinks.

Everything is overpowered because dramafags be dramafags.

 

[Yosharian]

my sylvan sorcerer picked a bear because bears are cool

Sylvan Sorcerers are pretty overpowered, are you sure you're being cool by picking one?

Please, I played 50 different combinations of arcane casters in 100 hours and only killed the stag lord twice. I have been all shades of cool and uncool.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

But that's like saying, oh, I'll make my melee guy have 12 STR and DEX because I don't want the game to be a cakewalk. The problem lies somewhere else methinks.

There's a difference between following an optimal build guide and taking 12 str/dex. You don't have to take it to those extremes.

I hope you didn't pick a Wizard either, since they are overpowered as well.

Also don't use the Devourer of Metal longbow, because it's also overpowered.

Again, no need to go to those extremes. The game is still challenging with a wizard and that longbow. If you take a pet that does 5x more damage than the next one, that is a little much. But it's not really game-breakingly powerful, I just wouldn't pick one because I like to be creative and try different things than what everyone uses or follows. That's fun for me.

 

[Yosharian]

But that's like saying, oh, I'll make my melee guy have 12 STR and DEX because I don't want the game to be a cakewalk. The problem lies somewhere else methinks.

There's a difference between following an optimal build guide and taking 12 str/dex. You don't have to take it to those extremes.

I hope you didn't pick a Wizard either, since they are overpowered as well.

Also don't use the Devourer of Metal longbow, because it's also overpowered.

Again, no need to go to those extremes. The game is still challenging with a wizard and that longbow. If you take a pet that does 5x more damage than the next one, that is a little much. But it's not really game-breakingly powerful, I just wouldn't pick one because I like to be creative and try different things than what everyone uses or follows. That's fun for me.

The game can still be challenging with a Smilodon, too. And Wizards are actually game-breakingly powerful if you know how to use them.

 

[Daidre]

There's a difference between following an optimal build guide and taking 12 str/dex. You don't have to take it to those extremes.

I wonder where experimenting with system to create optimal build fits into this worldview. Or whether player supposed to abandon everything too powerful he created after hours of exercises with test builds.

 

[Delterius]

But that's like saying, oh, I'll make my melee guy have 12 STR and DEX because I don't want the game to be a cakewalk. The problem lies somewhere else methinks.

There's a difference between following an optimal build guide and taking 12 str/dex. You don't have to take it to those extremes.

I hope you didn't pick a Wizard either, since they are overpowered as well.

Also don't use the Devourer of Metal longbow, because it's also overpowered.

Again, no need to go to those extremes. The game is still challenging with a wizard and that longbow. If you take a pet that does 5x more damage than the next one, that is a little much. But it's not really game-breakingly powerful, I just wouldn't pick one because I like to be creative and try different things than what everyone uses or follows. That's fun for me.

The game can still be challenging with a Smilodon, too. And Wizards are actually game-breakingly powerful if you know how to use them.

boys, before we continue i'd like to remind you that this started with a gag written under the most :friendly: of banners

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

THE GLORY OF TURN BASED COMBAT HAS ARRIVED ON KANGMAKER!!!

Turn-Based Combat* (Mod on Nexusmods)
https://www.nexusmods.com/pathfinderkingmaker/mods/109

*(experimental)