KickStarter Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pre-Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

Yeah I have one more - why are you excited for this game? I watched the pitch video, looked at the KS page and came away feeling like it was another watered-down IE-inspired game. Is it the source material that's getting everyone's jimmies in a knot? I think 3.5e is a shit system anyway, so I'm not the target audience, but that's why I asked for the opinion of a person who thought X and Y above.

 

Because it will play slower like IE games, and it will be first non indie D&D game since NWN2. It will be very close to PnP (which is better than D&D 3.5). Unlike NWN2 it will not have a shit engine and shit camera (it will have a fixed camera like IE games).
Also it will be using a Kingmaker adventure path that is probably best one that exists (for both Pathfinder and DnD). It will have a proper resting system that will limit resting anywhere anytime and force your to deal with problems like PnP does. It will be proper hardcore with spells abilities and everything very similar to PnP.
For me I love IE games and I played them a lot. Unlike PoE and DAO which were somewhat disappointing, I see this as the first true IE games like modern game.

 

Interesting, thanks again ArchAngel. Are you sure about the limited resting? Is the Kingmaker setting akin to The Keep on the Borderlands mega-module?

 

Do you actually play P&P? Because this isn't even remotely close to being true. It is one of the most ambitious though

The rest of what you say I pretty much agree with though, except I like DA:O and love PoE with White March. But I also fucking love 3.5 and especially Pathfinder agris, so YMMV.

 

Hoo boy, I can't wait for the butthurt when this is actually released. Will ArchAngel go full Sensuki, or only Lacrymas?

 

that's my read, i've been burned too much.

i still don't see why this is getting the hype it is from the site.

 

Because the IE-games are loved and Pathfinder is the best version of D&D to date (system, not fluff, obviously)? I mean you might not agree but that's why

 

Yes but that's why I asked all the questions I did on the previous page- can this studio credibly claim felicity to the IE games and the Pathfinder TT system? Have they stated positions on mechanics and gameplay that are consistent with what you've said? IE-games and Pathfinder's version of 3.5E D&D.

 

Whether they can do what they claim is anyone's guess, but I had the same doubt as to the implementation of the system as you had, and they have since stated and re-stated that it will be as-complete-as-possible implementation of P&P rules.

 

Will you play devil's advocate for me then, and tell me your biggest concerns for the game based on what you know? Sorry for being demanding, tell me to F-off if you want; I'm not about to read 34 pages of comments and try to parse PR-speak for insights that I know this community generates daily.

 

Maybe this helps to get an idea of the Kingmaker AP and how detailed it is:

Show Spoiler Hide Spoiler

The hope is that this will be a PnP module conversion that can truly fly.

 

- Developer with doubtful experience
- Massive feature creep
- Dubious implementation of what might be the most complex P&P system in existance in terms of amount of customization assets (GURPS and others are potentially more complex mechanically but 3.5 and Pathfinder just have so god damned many unique assets)

 

Yup, same here. Those are huge. Thanks again.

 

I played part 1 of the adventure path. Also know a bit more about how complex it gets but don't know details. I know enough that I consider this best PnP module because the rest are usually very limiting in what players get to do and how.

 

Sensuki was a very dedicated beta tester and that is why he broke apart later. I neither have time or willpower to do what he did. At worst I will be disappointed like I was with PoE. Even if they fuck up, I don't see this being as bad as NWN1 or NWN2.

 

Start the Codex fundraiser for this game.

 

Russians.


It's either going to be extremely weird, Oleg Kulik killed and dismembered a pig on stage, some other guy I forgot the name of took an Orthodox icon and smashed it with an axe in the center of Moscow (also Pathologic and The Void, Evil Islands wasn't your standard RPG either), or incredibly bland, slightly incompetent and faintly smelling of xenophobia and village idiocy. Judging by the lone screenshot it's the second option. No idea why MCA is even mentioned here.

 

One example does not make a "harbinger"

This is beginning to remind me of careers where entry-level jobs need "5 years' experience"

 

Avdey Ter-Oganian.
Funniest thing is, the guy later became a subject of criminal investigation (for that very work, even though it was actually a copy of an icon), escaped to Prague (I think? don't remember exactly), and there became a staunch conservative doing relatively traditional paintings.
Though technically (ethnically) he's Armenian.

Also, every single one of those was a result an overambitious project, with press-releases promising everything and the kitchen sink, and then the game comes out and... whoops!
Though since they don't have a publisher (do they?) to make them release anything, it's probably going to end up another Grimoire.

 

What's wierd about actionism? It's not like it's some brand new art movement or something that exclusively exists in Russia (or even was invented in Russia).
Learn about art history before making racist assumptions or you will look like a village idiot!

 

Actionism IS kinda weird though, killing and dismembering a pig on a stage also is, which WAS "new" (in the 80s) , and maybe even justified depending on how you look at it, actionists used their own bodies for their performances, not others'. You might notice that I'm not condemning the weirdness, just stating it, even hoping for it. Is that racism? Is Russian a "race"? I'm leaning towards no. And trust me, I know my art history :p

 

While Owlcat as a studio is new, the developers have plenty of experience, particularly the leads have 15+ years of professional experience each.

I have seen the code that a team under the leads has produced. It's solid and competent. They clearly know their C++ and managed to build all the complex systems required for an AAA game and get it to work with a sound understanding of the development process. This includes dedicated systems for debugging and QA. It's not to say that it is without flaws, for example in the AI department (though most studios have difficulties here), and in hindsight some architecture and design decisions proved not optimal. But that's common for most video game projects. All in all I'd say they are a tier above Obsidian.

They are sufficiently staffed. From the AMA:

The leads worked about five years on a game that has a massive number of feats, skills, combat and spell elements. While that was a strategy game, Heroes V + two expansions, which is not a RPG and Pathfinder likely will have the upper hand in terms of complexity, the systems required for implementing a massive amount of features, balancing and debugging are comparable. From what I have witnessed, they systematically build the tools and systems they need to arrive at a goal.

The biggest risk I would see is whether they will manage to build a game in which the story is on par with the systems. It can easily get cheesy, superficial, underwhelming, or like in PoE's case feel too much like an exercise. But considering what MCA said in the AMA and on the Codex, particularly relating to the authors from Paizo and Owlcat, I am not pessimistic. Knowing a bit about the leads of Owlcat, I can imagine that they respect MCA and it may turn out that he will lead by competence even if he doesn't wear the hat of the narrative design lead.

Regarding the Codexian to negotiate with Owlcat, I'd recommend to choose someone who can visit their offices in Moscow and report many new and shiny things for us.