Incline RPG Codex's Top 50 cRPGs - Results and Reviews

[tuluse]

So if I modded PST to have random pieces of cover strewn throughout the levels with no change to gameplay mechanics... it would be popamole?

If I asked a bunch of hypothetical questions while being intentionally obtuse, would it troll the codex?

 

[Bubbles]

I just don't see why mole popping is so strictly defined through sticky cover. To me, any game where you can beat a game by just standing in place and shooting at things that pop into view is popamole.

 

[Athelas]

Bunch of games with shitty gameplay. Business as usual, I see.

So if I modded PST to have random pieces of cover strewn throughout the levels with no change to gameplay mechanics... it would be popamole?

The Nameless One has regenerating health, so that would definitely be popamole.

 

[tuluse]

I just don't see why mole popping is so strictly defined through sticky cover. To me, any game where you can beat a game by just standing in place and shooting at things that pop into view is popamole.

Because that's the definition of the term. Some words mean one thing, while other words mean other things.

 

[felipepepe]

Funny, there's a surprising amount of love coming from NeoGAF... I guess there are more than casual jRPGs kids there. They seem to be are loving the list, but are disappointed that U7 is behind Dragon Age.

I don't have a paid e-mail to reply there, someone should post that's because we split between U7 and Serpent Isles, so the votes from fans were divided. Had we considered them a single entry, Ultima VII + Serpent Isle would be at #23, right next to System Shock 2.

Felipepepe, now that Planescape won (again) in the poll you created don't you think it is time to give it a try once more?

Maybe... my brother never tried the game, looked at the list and decided to play it next. I might join him...

 

[SuicideBunny]

I just don't see why mole popping is so strictly defined through sticky cover. To me, any game where you can beat a game by just standing in place and shooting at things that pop into view is popamole.

because actually getting behind cover so bullets hit cover instead of, say, vital organs is somewhat essential to shooters that aim for some semblance of realism instead of arcade bullet sponges. it's not inherently bad. what makes normal cover mechanics popamole is sticky cover that makes you invulnerable from one (more often than not) very roughly defined direction irregardless of how much and what said cover actually covers, from which safe haven you then proceed to pop up in order to pop moles that likewise emerge from behind their covers, although theirs tend not to make them invulnerable in most games, which makes it even more retarded. the difference is that with sticky cover the whole affair becomes a one (or two, since one for aiming second for fire) button game whereas with actual cover positioning and pose do not suddenly become mostly irrelevant.
sticky cover is required because it makes a 3d shooter into a 2d shooting gallery.

 

[Comrade Goby]

I think that console games should be considered for the next version of the list.

Not all JRPG's are shit

And I'm still pretty sure that KAWAII DESU 3000 won't end being voted the #1 game so the sanctity of RPG will be preserved.

 

[felipepepe]

Comrade Goby, I argue for that last year, and we ended up making 2 different lists, one PC-only by Jaesun, other console-only by myself. Here are the results:

PC:

Spoiler

Placement - Name - Votes

1 - Fallout 189
2 - Planescape 176
3 - Fallout 2 169
4 - Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn 155
5 - Arcanum: Of Steamworks & Magick Obscura 151
6 - Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 125
7 - Baldur's Gate 108
8 - Icewind Dale 105
9 - Fallout: New Vegas 95
9 - The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind 95
9 - The Temple of Elemental Evil 95
10 - Deus Ex 92
11- Neverwinter Nights 2: Mask of the Betrayer 85
12 - Gothic II 78
13 - Jagged Alliance 2 69
14 - Icewind Dale II 66
15 - Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II - The Sith Lords 65
16 - Betrayal at Krondor 64
17 - Wizardry 8 61
18 - Knights of the Chalice 60
19 - The Witcher 58
20 - Dark Sun: Shattered Lands 57
21 - Darklands 54
21 - System Shock 2 54
22 - Might and Magic VI: The Mandate of Heaven 53
23 - Wizardry: Crusaders of the Dark Savant 52
24 - Might and Magic World of Xeen 47
25 - Ultima VII: Part 1 The Black Gate 46
26 - Gothic 43
26 - The Elder Scrolls: Chapter II - Daggerfall 43
27 - Pool Of Radiance 42
27 - Ultima Underworld: The Stygian Abyss 42
28 - Realms of Arkania 2: Star Trail 41
29 - Wasteland 39
30 - Might and Magic VII: For Blood and Honor 37
31 - Divine Divinity 33
32 - Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar 33
33 - Wizardry: Bane of the Cosmic Forge 32
34 - Arx Fatalis 31
35 - Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 30
36 - Realms of Arkania: Blade of Destiny 29
37 - Diablo 28
37 - Diablo II 28
38 - Lands of Lore: The Throne of Chaos 27
38 - Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny 27
39 - Curse of the Azure Bonds 25
39 - Might and Magic III: Isles of Terra 25
40 - Dragon Age Origins 24
41 - Dungeon Master 23
41 - Neverwinter Nights - Hordes of the Underdark 23
41 - The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings 23
42 - Risen 22
42 - Ultima VI: The False Prophet 22
43 - ADOM Ancient Domains of Mystery (ADOM) 20
44 - Mount & Blade: Warband 19
45 - Divinity II: The Dragon Knight Saga 18
46 - Geneforge 17
46 - Legend of Grimrock 17
46 - Neverwinter Nights 17
47 - Drakensang: The River of Time 16
47 - Prelude to Darkness 16
48 - Anachronox 14
48 - Deus Ex : Human Revolution 14
48 - King of Dragon Pass 14
48 - The Dark Heart of Uukrul 14
48 - Ultima Underworld 2: Labyrinth of Worlds 14
48 - Ultima VII: Part 2 The Serpent Isle 14
49 - Eye of the Beholder 13
49 - Eye of the Beholder II: The Legend of Darkmoon 13
49 - Neverwinter Nights 2 13
49 - Pools of Darkness 13
49 - The Bard's Tale I : Tales of the Unknown 13
50 - Albion 12
50 - Might and Magic II: Gates to Another World 12
50 - Quest For Glory IV: Shadows of Darkness 12
50 - Vampire: The Masquerade – Redemption 12

Console:

Spoiler

Had the voting of both lists been together, Chrono Trigger and FF VI would appear around #38 of the PC list, next to Ultima 5 and M&M III.

Obviously the voting system is completely different than the one we did now, and way less people took part as well. While I would find it interesting to make a ALL RPGS list, the Codex IS PC-oriented...

 

[Bubbles]

Does a game need to force you to use ranged combat over melee/stealth in order to be popamole, or simply offer the option? If offering the option is enough, are games with optional popamole content (like a minigame) also popamole games?

Does forcing you to constantly change (sticky) cover remove the popamole-ness from a game? If so, what about games that only occasionally force you to do that on a battle-by-battle basis? What about games that offer a select few "special" battles where popamole mechanics apply? Are they popamole, not popamole, pseudo-popamole, partially popamole, popamole hybrids, or something else entirely?

 

[Excidium]

Quit that shit already FFS

 

[Bubbles]

Just admit you have no idea how to properly define popamole.

 

[Comrade Goby]

Comrade Goby, I argue for that last year, and we ended up making 2 different lists, one PC-only by Jaesun, other console-only by myself. Here are the results:

PC:

Spoiler

Placement - Name - Votes

1 - Fallout 189
2 - Planescape 176
3 - Fallout 2 169
4 - Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn 155
5 - Arcanum: Of Steamworks & Magick Obscura 151
6 - Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 125
7 - Baldur's Gate 108
8 - Icewind Dale 105
9 - Fallout: New Vegas 95
9 - The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind 95
9 - The Temple of Elemental Evil 95
10 - Deus Ex 92
11- Neverwinter Nights 2: Mask of the Betrayer 85
12 - Gothic II 78
13 - Jagged Alliance 2 69
14 - Icewind Dale II 66
15 - Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II - The Sith Lords 65
16 - Betrayal at Krondor 64
17 - Wizardry 8 61
18 - Knights of the Chalice 60
19 - The Witcher 58
20 - Dark Sun: Shattered Lands 57
21 - Darklands 54
21 - System Shock 2 54
22 - Might and Magic VI: The Mandate of Heaven 53
23 - Wizardry: Crusaders of the Dark Savant 52
24 - Might and Magic World of Xeen 47
25 - Ultima VII: Part 1 The Black Gate 46
26 - Gothic 43
26 - The Elder Scrolls: Chapter II - Daggerfall 43
27 - Pool Of Radiance 42
27 - Ultima Underworld: The Stygian Abyss 42
28 - Realms of Arkania 2: Star Trail 41
29 - Wasteland 39
30 - Might and Magic VII: For Blood and Honor 37
31 - Divine Divinity 33
32 - Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar 33
33 - Wizardry: Bane of the Cosmic Forge 32
34 - Arx Fatalis 31
35 - Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 30
36 - Realms of Arkania: Blade of Destiny 29
37 - Diablo 28
37 - Diablo II 28
38 - Lands of Lore: The Throne of Chaos 27
38 - Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny 27
39 - Curse of the Azure Bonds 25
39 - Might and Magic III: Isles of Terra 25
40 - Dragon Age Origins 24
41 - Dungeon Master 23
41 - Neverwinter Nights - Hordes of the Underdark 23
41 - The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings 23
42 - Risen 22
42 - Ultima VI: The False Prophet 22
43 - ADOM Ancient Domains of Mystery (ADOM) 20
44 - Mount & Blade: Warband 19
45 - Divinity II: The Dragon Knight Saga 18
46 - Geneforge 17
46 - Legend of Grimrock 17
46 - Neverwinter Nights 17
47 - Drakensang: The River of Time 16
47 - Prelude to Darkness 16
48 - Anachronox 14
48 - Deus Ex : Human Revolution 14
48 - King of Dragon Pass 14
48 - The Dark Heart of Uukrul 14
48 - Ultima Underworld 2: Labyrinth of Worlds 14
48 - Ultima VII: Part 2 The Serpent Isle 14
49 - Eye of the Beholder 13
49 - Eye of the Beholder II: The Legend of Darkmoon 13
49 - Neverwinter Nights 2 13
49 - Pools of Darkness 13
49 - The Bard's Tale I : Tales of the Unknown 13
50 - Albion 12
50 - Might and Magic II: Gates to Another World 12
50 - Quest For Glory IV: Shadows of Darkness 12
50 - Vampire: The Masquerade – Redemption 12

Console:

Spoiler

Had the voting of both lists been together, Chrono Trigger and FF VI would appear around #38 of the PC list, next to Ultima 5 and M&M III.

Obviously the voting system is completely different than the one we did now, and way less people took part as well. While I would find it interesting to make a ALL RPGS list, the Codex IS PC-oriented...

True but it is still called RPG codex. I think any RPG that gets voted on should be fine.

Hell if there was a mobile game that somehow was a really good RPG it should be able to have the opportunity to get on the list.

 

[SuicideBunny]

Hell if there was a mobile game that somehow was a really good RPG it should be able to have the opportunity to get on the list.

the quest

 

[Bubbles]

True but it is still called RPG codex. I think any RPG that gets voted on should be fine.

Also Jagged Alliance and Star Control 2. We hardly have the strictest standards when it comes to eligibility for those lists already.

 

[felipepepe]

Hell if there was a mobile game that somehow was a really good RPG it should be able to have the opportunity to get on the list.

You must understand we are mainly doing this for the posters here... the fact that Dragon's Dogma and Demon's Souls are awesome matters little if only a small fraction of the community has consoles.

Believe me, I've done the Top Console list last year, plus a Top PS3 and a Top DS RPGs list... the vast majority here really don't care for those.

 

[Gregz]

Just admit you have no idea how to properly define popamole.

STFU YOU NEWFAG DIPSHIT TROLL MORON

Guys, please stop quoting this retard and flooding the thread with his nonsense.

It will go away if you ignore it.

 

[Excidium]

It's just people are afraid of seeing console games at the list. Generally the same kind of people who use terms like "monocled" unironically.

Just admit you have no idea how to properly define popamole.

Just admit that like every newfriend you thought popamole was just a cool internal way to say a game sucks and had some sort of revelation on this thread.

 

[SuicideBunny]

True but it is still called RPG codex. I think any RPG that gets voted on should be fine.

Also Jagged Alliance and Star Control 2. We hardly have the strictest standards when it comes to eligibility for those lists already.

ja might primarily be a strategy or tactics game but it has stronger rpg elements (ranging from mechanics to little stuff like merc reaction to each other or the flowers thing) than most modern supposedly pure rpgs. sc2 on the other hand is only rpg when you broaden your definition to mean that rpgs just have to offer any form of c&c without mechanical aspects, which means that if games and plenty of adventures would also qualify...
got eaten by a grue in the dark? RPG!

 

[Cowboy Moment]

New Vegas, Gothic 2, Jagged Alliance 2, all lower than Morrowind.

Gothic 1 lower than The Witcher and BG1.

You don't even know what you don't know. I remember when BG1 was ahead of both MotB and Morrowind.

 

[Bubbles]

It's just people are afraid of seeing console games at the list. Generally the same kind of people that use terms like "monocled" unironically.


Just admit that like every newfriend you thought popamole was just a cool internal way to say a game sucks and had some sort of revelation on this thread.

No, I thought it had to do with figuratively popping (shooting) figurative moles (enemies) with a figurative hammer (gun) while having to focus on nothing but the action of popping. That codexia narrows down this template to exclusively rail against sticky cover games without casting a critical eye on Codex favourites is just one of those wonderful little quirks that I learned about from this thread.

 

[agentorange]

The enemies (the mole) pop up from behind cover and you pop them. Doesn't take a brain scientist to figure this out.










The Witcher 2 is popamole.

 

[Bubbles]

What if they appear out of thin air, like in DA2, or from behind mysterious doors, like NOLF2? It doesn't have to be cover they're popping up from.

Also, the NOLF games would qualify for this list, right?

 

[tuluse]

No, I thought it had to do with figuratively popping (shooting) figurative moles (enemies) with a figurative hammer (gun) while having to focus on nothing but the action of popping. That codexia narrows down this template to exclusively rail against sticky cover games without casting a critical eye on Codex favourites is just one of those wonderful little quirks that I learned about from this thread.

It was coined specifically to describe Gears of War gameplay. Most people use it more broadly now.

It doesn't strictly mean sticky cover. For example a game like MGS has a sticky cover of sorts but wouldn't be considered popamole by the strict definition of the word.

Also, the NOLF games would qualify for this list, right?

Anything qualifies if enough people think it's an RPG and vote for it (and was released on PC).

 

[felipepepe]

Any PC game you think is a RPG could be voted for; if enough people vote for it as well to enter the list, then obviously it has some merit as a RPG. Simple as that.

 

[Aeschylus]

Funny, there's a surprising amount of love coming from NeoGAF... I guess there are more than casual jRPGs kids there. They seem to be are loving the list, but are disappointed that U7 is behind Dragon Age.

It's kind of funny reading some of the borderline worshipful comments there, like they are looking at some kind of strange, grognard wonderland that they can never hope to reach.