RPG design should be about...

The point is not what I think about dialog choices, narrative choices, and options locked behind a single character creation, the feature I value the most is full party creation so my very own favourite games are very different from the Codex's. The point is that the Codex, and I acknowledge the merits of the games the Codex likes, only likes Black Isle/Looking Glass kinds of games, you can't reduce Codex's taste to exploration of a cool world while there's no trace of an Ultima, Might&Magic, Quest for glory game or any different style exploration-focused game anywhere near the top of the list. Single character non-combat interactivity mechanisms and choices are valued here, which is why I think it's unfair to say the Codex does not care about mechanisms at all.

 

Ahh, when you put it like that, I realise I was coming across as kind of flippant. I don't mean to say that Codex should change its name to "Walking Sim Codex" - it is clear that people here tend to have a clear preference for specific types of mechanics and expect to find them in RPGs (as otherwise they don't really count as RPGs). It is also true that in downplaying that I'm definitely emphasising my own preferences, as I like exploration in all kinds of games.

However, the initial question was what RPG designers should spend most of their effort on, and I think that this poll shows a skewed, knee-jerk response to it. It's not readily obvious what great C&C and non-combat mechanics even look like, great games in the past have done well with fairly rudimentary (yet unobtrusive) interpretations of them, and going to a great deal of effort to try and improve on them has lead to mixed or negative results. On that note, I suspect that one reason for T:ToN's mediocrity was that the developers spent excessive effort on trying to create erudite and complex C&C, to the effect that the game ended up with a lot of superfluous attention to detail on what was ultimately mediocre, bland content. Having more of it certainly wouldn't have helped.

 

Purity of vision is the most important

 

Based and redpilled.

Cringe and bluepilled.

 

Who cares what the majority have as "beloved" or "great"? You are talking here about popularity. What does it matter what "crpg playesrs" accept as poor mechanics or not? They accepted Oblivion as a good game and love romances in CRPGs too. If You want to base your design "ideal" on catering to the majority, be my guest. But I think Your whole premise is based on a terrible fallacy. So yes if the ideal for your main design goal is to make game as popular or "beloved" as possible and make a lot of money - then you are 100% right. Sorry if i disagree that this is an "ideal" design goal at all though.
Interesting world and bad mechanics can make an interesting game - an adventure one, the genre often doesn't have many advanced mechanics to begin with (there are exceptions though so I might be wrong). Or a visual novel. An interesting game in many aspects perhaps but will be a bad crpg 100% of the time. The opposite is not true, there are good crpgs with little immersion and basic world building. A very good game in some aspects but a bad crpg overall. Like Planescape. BTW I counted ~5 games that have good gameplay mechanics in the top 10. Also what argument is this: "Some codexers are bitching about it constantly"? That's what we do for a living. And if you bothered to scroll lover, you will find that the majority of games have good systems. The ones that go to the top are - surprise - the most popular ones. The most well known to the majority of codexers as in any such poll everywhere. This polls are always about, you guessed it, popularity not quality. I for once, as "ideal", don't take the final product popularity as any kind of goal. And you shouldn't either. Unless you are a game developer making a commercial game. But even then it shouldn't be the main consideration as far as design goals are concerned. Hopefully making a good game should. Whether it will be popular or beloved by many should be of no consequence to the player - which almost everyone in this thread are.

 

They should create a virtual world simulation and abstract as much away from it as they need to to create good gameplay.

But of course it's not actually possible to work that way yet, so they're forced to create "gameplay systems" and as much of a Potemkin virtual world as they've got time for around that.

 

"character and plot driven" -- VTMB
"systems and gameplay driven" -- ToEE
" immersion and roleplay driven" -- Arcanum

 

BG2 is all of this, IMO.

 

RPGs are about immersion into another world, but that immersion can come from engaging with character mechanics, from visuals, from story, or from setting/exploration, so as long as couple of those are good you're all set.

 

cool graphics

 

Pointed ears.

 

lol fuck no