Shadowrun Shadowrun: Hong Kong Pre-Release Discussion [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[imweasel]

Actually, both SRR and SR:DF have perspective rendering as an option, in addition to orthographic. It affects every object in the map.

Hmm, interesting. I didn't know that, I'll have to check it out.

 

[Anthedon]

There's a new podcast interview out with Jordan Weisman and Mitch Gitelman (Studio Manager).

 

[Infinitron]

There's a new podcast interview out with Jordan Weisman and Mitch Gitelman (Studio Manager).

 

[tuluse]

Well, Shadowrun (or Pillars of Eternity for that matter) isn't "2D" or "3D", it is something in between.

Shocking, I know.

Anyway, games Like SR that use parallel projection and static 2D backdrops will always look a bit shitty because of the lack of (a dynamic) perspective AKA motion parallaxing and other 3D graphical goodies.

Shadowrun doesn't use a prerendered 2D scene. It's all 3D. Just very simple 3d with painted textures to make it look nice.

 

[roshan]

Well, Shadowrun (or Pillars of Eternity for that matter) isn't "2D" or "3D", it is something in between.

Shocking, I know.

Anyway, games Like SR that use parallel projection and static 2D backdrops will always look a bit shitty because of the lack of (a dynamic) perspective AKA motion parallaxing and other 3D graphical goodies.

There is nothing shitty about the way Shadowrun and Dragonfall look. Now Wasteland 2 on the other hand... Yuck.

Also, by "2D", we're actually referring to "prerendered", which POE is, but SR is actually only pseudo-2D, because the gameworld is actually rendered as a bunch of 3D objects with fixed perspective and 2D textures on top of them. And if you turn on "perspective" projection in the options menu, as opposed to orthographic, you will actually see objects shift slightly in relation to the camera angle.

But gameplay wise, the final product very much delivers the awesomeness of 2D.

 

[Infinitron]

UPDATE: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/webeharebrained/shadowrun-hong-kong/posts/1112727

Hong Kong will have a hub too. Should come as no surprise.

 

[imweasel]

Shadowrun doesn't use a prerendered 2D scene. It's all 3D. Just very simple 3d with painted textures to make it look nice.

You're right. I had a look at the editor, the backgrounds are actually tiled which is pretty nifty. Rudimentary 3D geometry with hand painted textures on the plane orthogonal to the camera's viewpoint, they are basically building blocks with a texture on one side. This is a very smart system and much more dynamic than the huge pre-rendered 2D backgrounds that PoE engine uses.

There is nothing shitty about the way Shadowrun and Dragonfall look. Now Wasteland 2 on the other hand... Yuck.

Also, by "2D", we're actually referring to "prerendered", which POE is, but SR is actually only pseudo-2D, because the gameworld is actually rendered as a bunch of 3D objects with fixed perspective and 2D textures on top of them. And if you turn on "perspective" projection in the options menu, as opposed to orthographic, you will actually see objects shift slightly in relation to the camera angle.

But gameplay wise, the final product very much delivers the awesomeness of 2D.

I started up Dragonfall DC. It does indeed have an option for perspective projection, but it is very rudimentary and the game doesn't have any motion parallaxing. I like motion parallaxing because the perspective dynamically changes with your viewpoint when you pan/tilt/zoom the camera, which makes scenes seem more realistic. You can see this very well in D:OS or Trine. This is missing from games with simple 2D backdrops, so they will never be able to compete to a full 3D scene IMO.

Anyway, it seems to me that you don't really have a problem with 3D scenes (as long as the game uses very good textures), you just don't like to be forced to readjust the camera or like it when some shit pops up blocking your view. I have heard this argument a lot and think it is legit, there is nothing worse than not being able to concentrate on gameplay because you are fighting the camera.

 

[vorvek]

It's also cheaper to make, since you can reuse assets again and again. Every person in Berlin has the same 4 plants showing through the windows of their greenhouse module.

 

[GarfunkeL]

And I never even noticed!

 

[PhantasmaNL]

I like the looks of SR, but can understand that hip young'uns dont dig it. As someone said above, the less time fiddling with camera controls the better. So if they kept this engine the way it was for HK and maybe other campaigns im happy.

I also hope the *never* introduce voice acting. I just started another run of Dragon Fall DC and the silence of the characters is just golden. Gamers used to getting wizbang cutscenes and achievements at 1 minute intervals will probably not like it, but please keep the silence and excellent descriptions/written dialogs. At least these leave some room for your own imagination.

 

[Jaesun]

I also hope the *never* introduce voice acting. I just started another run of Dragon Fall DC and the silence of the characters is just golden. Gamers used to getting wizbang cutscenes and achievements at 1 minute intervals will probably not like it, but please keep the silence and excellent descriptions/written dialogs. At least these leave some room for your own imagination.

They have already stated they will NOT do voice overs for NPC's. They like the player to use their imagination for each of the NPC's. And that is the way it should be.

 

[imweasel]

They have already stated they will NOT do voice overs for NPC's. They like the player to use their imagination for each of the NPC's. And that is the way it should be.

Agreed. But I do really like combat barks, I wouldn't mind if they added those.

 

[Jaesun]

Agreed. But I do really like combat barks, I wouldn't mind if they added those.

They would start to get incredibly boring, unless they spent a lot of $$$$$ recording many many different ones.

But that is money that is much better spent on something else. IMHO.

 

[Infinitron]

I'm in favor of combat barks...but who said they have to be voiced? Just make NPCs shout stuff out occasionally, Fallout-style.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Text combat barks would be pretty awesome. They already do that sort of thing for certain things in SR: DF; like when a captain is calling for backup or something. And there's certainly nothing in the game I'd have wanted them to cut out so they could budget for some generic grunting when people get shot.

 

[tuluse]

I have to admit my biggest popamole indulgence is that I love the talking heads in Fallout and the limited voice acting 90s Interplay RPGs had.

Still, I'm fine with SR being silent and text barks would be cool.

 

[Jaesun]

I'm in favor of combat barks...but who said they have to be voiced? Just make NPCs shout stuff out occasionally, Fallout-style.

That actually would be cool.

 

[Bubbles]

People would accuse them of stealing ideas from WL2.

 

[Athelas]

JA2/IE style voice-acted barks are the best.

I have to admit my biggest popamole indulgence is that I love the talking heads in Fallout and the limited voice acting 90s Interplay RPGs had.

The voice-acting in those was superb (and even included people like Keith David) - I don't think there's a chance of any Kickstarter RPG's achieving that quality.

 

[Abu Antar]

I don't even remember Fallout barks because I'm senile like that, but I did like the spell incantations in Final Fantasy Tactics.

 

[Athelas]

I can see how a mage ending their mystical incantation by saying 'Fire 2' would be memorable (for all the wrong reasons).

 

[Abu Antar]

I can see how a mage ending their mystical incantation by saying 'Fire 2' would be memorable (for all the wrong reasons).

Hurrdurr, you get my point.

 

[Infinitron]

UPDATE: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/webeharebrained/shadowrun-hong-kong/posts/1113215

 

[Bleed the Man]

Jesus, their not putting much effort on the updates, are they?

Only two very short about a particular developer inside work, and now a bit of info about a figure. I know that they have a lot more money that what they really need, and they will end with an even greater amount, but I would appreciate something a bit more juicy with maybe new concept art, or lore updates relevant to the new Hong Kong storyline, they don't need to do much more to keep me hooked.

 

[krist2]

Yeah, not Larian quality with the updates.
Did anyone check out the shout out they had for this card game in their update.
The project has 29 days to go, wanted 10K and as of now nearly has 2000K...
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/elanlee/exploding-kittens?ref=nav_search

very strange how some kickstartes defy all expectations..