Official Codex Discord Server

  1. Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.
    Dismiss Notice

Skyrim is worse than Oblivion in every way

Discussion in 'Bethesda Game Studios' started by baronjohn, Nov 12, 2011.

  1. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    So that makes my level 2 character just as capable of solving the issues in the world as your lvl 46 one, just as efficient but much more expeditious.
     
    ^ Top  
  2. Delterius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Delterius
    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2012
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Entre a serra e o mar.
    There's still the greatest danger of nature of deal with: hp bloated Saber Cats that emulate level caps on zones.
     
    ^ Top  
  3. Night Goat The Immovable Autism Patron No Fun Allowed

    Night Goat
    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,865,091
    Location:
    [redacted]
    Codex 2013 Codex 2014
    If you're playing an Elder Scrolls game expeditiously, you're doing it wrong. You should really take your time to explore everything the world has to offer, so you'll know exactly what to complain about.:smug:
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 2
    ^ Top  
  4. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    oh, im complaining about the fact that you can be stronger at level 10 than at level 20. and that no matter your level, you are still about as powerful as youll ever be. :neveraskedforthis:
     
    ^ Top  
  5. Jugashvili 管官的官 Patron

    Jugashvili
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    1,971
    Location:
    Georgia, Asia
    Codex 2013
    Absolutely. It's amazing how they ruined one of the few good ideas in Skyrim (limited amount of perks for skills) with a terrible design decision (level scaling), thus ensuring that no matter what you do, you must spend those perks in combat-related skills if you don't want to fall behind and get devoured by HP-bloated Draugr/bears.

    So you want to be a thief? Sure, just put some points into backstabbing people and handling blades and bows. What? You mean a thief who steals stuff? What an absurd notion. Why steal when you can loot? Everybody knows that "thief" is just another word for "assassin" nowadays. All the kids want to be assassins, not some Arsene Lupin bullshit. Besides, stealing is player skill-based so even a knuckle-headed warrior can open difficult chests, and even if you do get rich, it's not like there's anything worth buying.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  6. Clockwork Knight Arcane

    Clockwork Knight
    Joined:
    May 6, 2009
    Messages:
    1,869,473
    Location:
    Glass Fields, Ruins of Old Iran
    Tbh, people who want to make a pacifist character probably shouldn't be playing an action RPG where 95% of the skills are combat related.

    edit: though I guess that's beside the point, since the open world nature of the game allows you to avoid combat to a degree. But you have to try really hard.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 2
    ^ Top  
  7. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    no, it does not allow it, you have to kill stuff, if you go speech/pickpocket you wont be able to finish this game, or play it for very long, unless you get companions, set them to essential and just watch them fight from a corner i guess..
     
    ^ Top  
  8. DraQ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    DraQ
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2007
    Messages:
    31,480
    Location:
    Chrząszczyżewoszyce, powiat Łękołody
    The difference in terms of the story is same as between save-scumming and ironman in terms of gameplay.

    Why not?
    Except you don't do it single-handedly.

    You have a large group of guards and Jarl's own housecarl helping you.
    The impressive part happens when you skeletonize the dragon by nomming his soul and start shouting like a pro.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  9. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    I did it alone, was behind a rock where arrows couldnt reach him and fucked him over with a couple power attacks, was pathetic, second time i did that fight he got killed as he landed on a exposed rock, by a couple archers.

    Dragons are idiotic pussies on skyrim, even if everyone says they arent, such is the gameplay/story segregation (i think thats how its called).
     
    ^ Top  
  10. Delterius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Delterius
    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2012
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Entre a serra e o mar.
    The fact that they easily kill the dragon without you is a bit disconcerting too.
     
    ^ Top  
  11. Clockwork Knight Arcane

    Clockwork Knight
    Joined:
    May 6, 2009
    Messages:
    1,869,473
    Location:
    Glass Fields, Ruins of Old Iran

    She got what she wanted, and has no reason to be afraid of pissing you off with a "I was bored and wanted a mortal to do some dirty work for me, hope u don't mind, kthxbai" reveal.
     
    ^ Top  
  12. Jugashvili 管官的官 Patron

    Jugashvili
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    1,971
    Location:
    Georgia, Asia
    Codex 2013
    I don't necessarily mean a pacifist character. I mean being able to put perks into non-combat skills without punishing yourself -- a character with decent skill in combat but whose specialty lies elsewhere. That is not the case with level scaling. As things stand right now, thief = assassin, because all your perks will be going into one handed, sneak, light armor and/or marksman in order to keep up with increasingly hp-bloated levelled enemies, and even so the fights take forever if you can't get the jump on them.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  13. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    Im not into classes

    I play a dude that uses 1h or dual-1h, leather armor, and finishes fights in a matter of seconds, using my own potions/weapon/armor/enchancements, while still keeping a fairly high picklocks/steal/speech, also alteration because i like to transmute my shit into shinnier shit.

    If i had to give a name to my class it would be "indecisive prick".
     
    ^ Top  
  14. DalekFlay Arcane Patron

    DalekFlay
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    Messages:
    11,207
    Location:
    New Vegas
    Why is Skyrim not a completely different kind of game entirely? What a disappointment!
     
    ^ Top  
  15. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    fixed it again, good god man.
     
    ^ Top  
  16. XenomorphII Prophet

    XenomorphII
    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2011
    Messages:
    1,085
    The fundamental problem with Skyrim and the perk system, is that while they help you to focus your character (which I do like), the world doesn't open and close doors based upon said character choices.
     
    ^ Top  
  17. Zewp Arcane

    Zewp
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2012
    Messages:
    3,495
    Location:
    Das Land des Bieres
    Codex 2013
    That's well said. Everything is open to everyone. Even choices not related to your character development such as which faction you join doesn't open or close any doors. The fact that a single character can experience almost all the content available is one of the things I hated most about Skyrim. No reason for other characters.

    I'm currently playing Morrowind and I'm doing the Fighter's Guild quests, now I've been tasked with destroying the Thieves Guild which will lock me out of certain content until I start a new character.
     
    ^ Top  
  18. DalekFlay Arcane Patron

    DalekFlay
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    Messages:
    11,207
    Location:
    New Vegas
    Easy to get around.

    Anyway... yes, Skyrim only offers choice and consequence in character development, not the world (outside of Legion versus rebels). Still, this is a massive improvement to the standard TES formula, and something to be appreciated.
     
    ^ Top  
  19. Caim Arcane

    Caim
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2013
    Messages:
    6,280
    Location:
    Dutchland
    Heh.
     
    ^ Top  
  20. Night Goat The Immovable Autism Patron No Fun Allowed

    Night Goat
    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,865,091
    Location:
    [redacted]
    Codex 2013 Codex 2014
    The solution, as usual, is to play Requiem. You'll get devoured by Draugr and bears no matter what you do!

    For me, the worst thing about stealing is that without wasting perks in the Speech tree, you can't get rich from stealing anyway. Everyone in Skyrim somehow knows if something you have was stolen, even if you stole it on the other side of the province and there are thousands of items just like it. And even mass murderers won't buy something that was stolen, because that would be wrong.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  21. Delterius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Delterius
    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2012
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Entre a serra e o mar.
    That's about what would make up a character in Morrowind.
     
    ^ Top  
  22. Night Goat The Immovable Autism Patron No Fun Allowed

    Night Goat
    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,865,091
    Location:
    [redacted]
    Codex 2013 Codex 2014
    You call that indecisive? In my current playthrough I'm using every skill except heavy armor, two-handed and illusion (so far). Yes, that does mean I'm spread pretty thin.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  23. Lhynn Arcane

    Lhynn
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages:
    8,533
    there is a degree of coherence if you choose everything, you could be called a jack of many trades.
     
    ^ Top  
  24. DalekFlay Arcane Patron

    DalekFlay
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    Messages:
    11,207
    Location:
    New Vegas
    It's an incredibly silly game mechanic, but Morrowind not having something similar made thieving incredibly profitable right out of the gate.

    Honestly a lot of what Bethesda have done since Morrowind seems flavored by the idea that Morrowind was insanely easy to exploit and metagame (which it was) and that this needed to be solved (which is arguable). They seem to ignore the idea that one reason Morrowind was great is because it was fun to break and fuck around in.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  25. Metro Arcane Beg Auditor

    Metro
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2009
    Messages:
    26,755
    You don't even have to steal to get rich. Unless you're playing with some economy adjusting mod you get rich easily by looting and selling the crap you get from dungeons. Speech/mercantile tree not even necessary.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  

(buying stuff via the above buttons helps us pay the hosting bills, thanks!)