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KickStarter Solasta Pre-Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]
- Thread starter Safav Hamon
- Start date
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2019
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- 168
Heh, I knew not everybody would be happy about this one. Making decisions like this definitively isn't easy because we know not everyone will like it, but we had to do something for the sake of gameplay balance. Darkvision characters got nerfed, non-Darkvision characters got nerfed on one hand and buffed on the other (disadvantage in fights in Dim Light but not completely blind in Darkness). Anyway, please feel free to give suggestions - we love to read solutions people come up with.
Thanks man, Pre-Alpha Demo should be available soon-ish
ArchAngel
Arcane
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- Mar 16, 2015
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- 19,997
We did, implement Low Light Vision for elves that works like this and Darkvision for Dwarves that works like in PnP.
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- Jun 21, 2018
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- 4,031
'But wouldn't that incentivise playing a full party of dwarves?'
Mission accomplished.
Mission accomplished.
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- Apr 12, 2019
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- 168
Basically what he said. I understand the logic behind Dwarves having Darkvision since they spend their lives underground, but it doesn't solve the problem of balance.
ArchAngel
Arcane
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Balance is less important than fun. PoE 1 and 2 went balance route. Pathfinder: Kingmaker went fun route.
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- 5,424
Can you hire Chris Avelone to do the writing for you.
I want a faithful DnD game with Avelone writing after all.
I want a faithful DnD game with Avelone writing after all.
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- Sep 25, 2012
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- 28,349
Nightvision goggles.
Yosharian
Arcane
Ew. Fucking EW.
Quantomas
Savant
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2017
- Messages
- 260
Don't change the rules.
Solve it by adding something reasonable. Light spells of variable intensity that last 24h, or an artifact that always provides dim light. Or even something unique like a firefly that helps you out smartly if you are in dire need.
It can't be so difficult to come up with something if you put your mind to it.
rusty_shackleford
Arcane
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2018
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- 50,754
Can you add jetpacks?
I'm not sure how this relates to the discussion about light but I want jetpacks.
I'm not sure how this relates to the discussion about light but I want jetpacks.
vortex
Fabulous Optimist
You mean levitation spell.
It shouldn't be difficult. There is this cantrip that Wizards, Clerics, Eldritch Knights, and Arcane Tricksters have. It's called Light. It lasts an hour, which is irrelevant because cantrips do not use spell slots in 5E and can be cast at will. There are situations in which a Human might not want a bright light floating above them, but tough shit. There are spells for that, too. No need to alter the rules. Especially half of your classes are guaranteed to have it, the other half gain access to it through archetypes, and everyone can get it through feats.
rusty_shackleford
Arcane
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- Jan 14, 2018
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- 50,754
there's these magic things called torches
bonus points if you let me use rope to tie it to my offhand like a buckler
bonus points if you let me use rope to tie it to my offhand like a buckler
ArchAngel
Arcane
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- Mar 16, 2015
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- 19,997
Torches take a hand, a hand that is normally used to wield weapons, shields or potions.
rusty_shackleford
Arcane
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...magic rope.
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- 28,349
That's why he said tie it to the hand buckler style.
ArchAngel
Arcane
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That is retarded. This is an open flame object.
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2019
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- 168
Ahhh I knew that this topic would trigger some reaction :p
We currently have levitate & fly wip (they won't be in the demo afaik because well, it's pretty buggy right now...).
You don't say! O.o
Joking aside, the problem here has multiple aspects. Balance, as we already mentioned, is one - but it's not the only one. When you play Tabletop D&D, you're mostly describing & imagining things - if you're an Elf, or a Dwarf, the DM will have no problem telling you what you see in the dark. This is not the case for a video game - you will be unable to see much on screen if none of your characters is using Light / wielding a torch. So in a way, even if gameplay-wise we didn't change anything, you would still be forced to use a source of light to see - negating your Darkvision advantage. This would mean visibility clashes with gameplay, which is not something we want (because that's just inconsistent, you don't need light but you still need it? Dafuq?)
But what if we made the game actually playable in the dark? Like, make it so you CAN see shit on screen even without light? Well there are other problems with that. One, it means a whole lot of work to ensure the game looks good both with & without light. What about transitional areas, where you go from places with light to places in complete darkness? When does the switch happen? How is it handled if you light one single little torch but the rest is all dark? Does it change depending on which character you have selected? (trust me you wouldn't want that, that's a one way ticket to headache city as you'll be switching characters constantly in combat).
There are tons and tons of other reasons that we didn't necessarily expose in the article, but yea. Know that we're not doing that because we want to change the rules - screw that, our Creative Director is constantly reminding us to stick to the rules - but because it simply didn't work well at all. Sometimes though we might have missed something obvious - but I don't believe that's the case for our Light & Darkness system. It's one of the core pillar of Solasta, so the crew spent countless hours debating this topic - which is not to say we claim to have THE BEST solution out there to handle it, simply that we believe it works better than simply keeping the rules and saying "oh well screw it".
That being said guys, don't misunderstand my message - I really appreciate your raw opinion, keep 'em coming. It's good to question our decisions.
We currently have levitate & fly wip (they won't be in the demo afaik because well, it's pretty buggy right now...).
You don't say! O.o
Joking aside, the problem here has multiple aspects. Balance, as we already mentioned, is one - but it's not the only one. When you play Tabletop D&D, you're mostly describing & imagining things - if you're an Elf, or a Dwarf, the DM will have no problem telling you what you see in the dark. This is not the case for a video game - you will be unable to see much on screen if none of your characters is using Light / wielding a torch. So in a way, even if gameplay-wise we didn't change anything, you would still be forced to use a source of light to see - negating your Darkvision advantage. This would mean visibility clashes with gameplay, which is not something we want (because that's just inconsistent, you don't need light but you still need it? Dafuq?)
But what if we made the game actually playable in the dark? Like, make it so you CAN see shit on screen even without light? Well there are other problems with that. One, it means a whole lot of work to ensure the game looks good both with & without light. What about transitional areas, where you go from places with light to places in complete darkness? When does the switch happen? How is it handled if you light one single little torch but the rest is all dark? Does it change depending on which character you have selected? (trust me you wouldn't want that, that's a one way ticket to headache city as you'll be switching characters constantly in combat).
There are tons and tons of other reasons that we didn't necessarily expose in the article, but yea. Know that we're not doing that because we want to change the rules - screw that, our Creative Director is constantly reminding us to stick to the rules - but because it simply didn't work well at all. Sometimes though we might have missed something obvious - but I don't believe that's the case for our Light & Darkness system. It's one of the core pillar of Solasta, so the crew spent countless hours debating this topic - which is not to say we claim to have THE BEST solution out there to handle it, simply that we believe it works better than simply keeping the rules and saying "oh well screw it".
That being said guys, don't misunderstand my message - I really appreciate your raw opinion, keep 'em coming. It's good to question our decisions.
And if you accidentally set fire to your cloak or hair, you're going to have a lot more light all of a sudden, and your party will be grateful!
Always look on the bright side!
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- Sep 25, 2012
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Use a lantern, sheesh.
ArchAngel
Arcane
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- Mar 16, 2015
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- 19,997
And how will you put a lantern on your hand like a buckler so you can use your hand freely?
No, no, you put the lantern inside the buckler. The Italians figured this out in the renaissance. Also, why not add a gauntlet and some spikes?
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2012
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- 28,349
Never played Dragon's Dogma, have ye?
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