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The Council - episodic narrative adventure with RPG elements set in the late 18th century

V_K

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Mid-ep. 3 and I realized one thing: I like this game's approach to integrating skills into puzzle solutions (i.e. skills giving you clues rather than being a requirement like in QfG), but I don't care much about the talky-talky sequences. I already find myself wishing for a fast forward button. I really wouldn't mind a game set in the very same mansion but deserted.
 

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Just wait until the fuck you that is Chapter 3 end puzzle :lol:
Yeah ... that "we do things counterclockwise for no reason and without telling you" was real nice. :mad:
To be honest, after all the hype I was disappointed. The puzzle is only somewhat challenging because you only get one chance to do it (and even that can be circumvented with high-level agility). You get a couple of misleading clues, but anyone with half a brain and a reasonable build would get it right at the second try, third max. It has nothing on the real fuck you puzzles like e.g. Xulima's Hall of Heroes or some endgame puzzles in Goetia.
Now what I really found annoying is the build-up to the puzzle:
If Sarah never reached the second phase, how did she know that you'd need the moon sphere and the dates?
 

LESS T_T

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Codex 2014
Interview with the main developer Big Bad Wolf: https://jv.jeuxonline.info/article/14696/big-bad-wolf-the-studio-that-tells-stories-in-one-game
  • They'll "never" do episodic release again. "There are several reasons for this reaction. First of all, the production time of an episode is quite long, even once it has been mastered. Between script writing, quest development, translation (the game is written in French, then translated into English) and the creation of in-game cutscenes, it takes nearly five months to produce an episode of the game. At the time of the release of the first episode in March 2018, three other episodes were already in production, at different stages. As a result, it was difficult to include player feedback after this first episode: only a few minor points could be modified."
  • "We truly respect how smart players are. We develop games for adults, mature games."
  • Sales to date are below expectation. They're counting on the sales of complete edition and boxed release in Europe (which is handled by Bigben not Foucs).
  • Regardless of that, the next project is already underway. (Presumably published by Bigben?)
Big Bad Wolf - The studio that tells stories in one game

Big Bad Wolf, the Bordeaux-located and newly created game studio, drawed attention this year with The Council, a minimalist RPG that focuses on players' choices and their consequences. We met them to better understand the genesis of the studio and of their first game.

Big Bad Wolf

In 2014, Fabrice Granger, Thomas Veauclin and Sylvain Sechi wished to leave Paris and offered Cyanide to create a new affiliated studio somewhere in France. They considered many places and finally decided to found Big Bad Wolf in Bordeaux to be, among other reasons, in the direct vicinity of other small French studios (Shiro Games, Motion Twins, Asobo Studio, etc). In August 2014, they finally settled down there and started to establish friendly relationships with their neighbours:

The first thing we've done was to contact other studios in Bordeaux. We were very welcomed as they were delighted by our arrival.

Thomas Veauclin

However, despite still being in the process of being created, the studio already has a fairly clear idea of what it wants to create. Above all, it wishes to focus on narrative, which is one of the strengths of its founders, notably at the origin of the role-playing game Game of Thrones produced by Cyanide. The name of the studio, "Big Bad Wolf", stands for this: it refers to the big bad wolf, one of the most famous fairy tale characters.

The initial desire was also to specialize in a type of game that we liked to do well: narrative RPGs. The goal was to specialize in the games of this genre, in the broadest sense, to set up the studio, its culture, its spirit, its organization specifically for this type of games.

Sylvain Sechi

The founders of the studio did not arrive in Bordeaux empty-handed. They are bringing with them a project they already started working on back in Nanterre, with the code name "Murder". Under this codename lies the game which will become The Council. The history of Big Bad Wolf is therefore inseparable from that of The Council, so let's take a closer look behind the scenes of the game's development.

The Council's development
The first few months of the studio were filled with trial and error baby steps. First of all, it was necessary to determine the technologies that would be used for the project and to fully adapt them to it, so that the Quest Designers can then act on their own. Cyanide's internal engine is chosen at this stage, in particular because of the presence of a Dialog Editor, absent in particular from the Unreal Engine, an essential element to be able to develop The Council.

Then, it was necessary to find the right balance for the game, especially in terms of its narrative structure and dialogues. The project has evolved a lot before reaching what it is today.

We took each traditional component of the RPG and broke them down into small pieces, before putting them all back together by encapsulating them with narrative packaging.

Sylvain Sechi

Combats are then quickly replaced with dialogs. But this must eventually be done with new mechanisms that also allow a genuine story flow. This led to a very strong link between narration and gameplay. The former unlocks gameplay elements (like weakness or immunity) that in return may reshape the story and the way it's told.

From our interview, the table-top RPGs influence is sensible. And indeed, the dialogs system is inspired from few RPGs. In addition, quests are experimentated on paper, like a standard table-top RPG quest, before being implemented in the actual game.

The choice is made to replace the fights with dialogues, but it is necessary to find the right mechanism for this, a mechanism that would respect the narrative framework of the game. Narrative and gameplay are co-dependent: narrative makes it possible to highlight mechanisms, such as the system of weakness and immunities, which in turn modify the way the game is told.

A strong inspiration emerges during our interview: the pen&paper role-playing game. The dialogue system is inspired by that of some role-playing games. Better yet, quests are tested on paper, as a proper role-playing game, before being implemented in the game.


De gauche à droite : Sylvain Sechi, Thomas Veauclin et Fabrice Granger



Gradually, they reach a balance. Nevertheless, another factor plays an important role in the development of The Council: the episodic model. This was not thought of from the very beginning, but it underwent changes during development, forcing some compromises to be made. Thus, The Council was once considered as a game composed of four episodes with four quests each, but the gap between the releases would have been too wide. It was therefore decided to modify the plan and offer five episodes of three quests, with a two-month interval between each release. While this did not affect the narrative framework in its depth, it required some adaptations: each episode had to have a fairly similar duration, requiring the length of some quests to be adapted to achieve it.

Nevertheless, we could feel that the episodic model was not very appreciated, causing Thomas Veauclin to drop a "Never again". There are several reasons for this reaction. First of all, the production time of an episode is quite long, even once it has been mastered. Between script writing, quest development, translation (the game is written in French, then translated into English) and the creation of in-game cutscenes, it takes nearly five months to produce an episode of the game. At the time of the release of the first episode in March 2018, three other episodes were already in production, at different stages. As a result, it was difficult to include player feedback after this first episode: only a few minor points could be modified.

The episodic of tomorrow, for me, is the Netflix model. It's a series, but all episodes are out at the same time. Players' feedback on episodes being released two months apart is generally catastrophic. I don't see any advantage in that.

Thomas Veauclin

Finally, since The Council is a multi-platform game (available on PC, PlayStation 4, Xbox One), each episode had to be certified by all console manufacturers before its publication, forcing them to repeat this operation several times throughout the development. While the episodic model did not have a decisive impact on the game's content, it nevertheless made its development more complicated.

« We're not telling a story, we let you play the story » Sylvain Sechi
Narrative is the main concern of the game's creators. Nevertheless, it is not monolithic: it is thought of as a plural experience, perpetually present.

A lot of information about the lore is spread all over the game's world. Each piece of information tells a lot of things.

Sylvain Sechi

Paintings are the most obvious example: no painting, no frame is placed at random, each is in its spot for a reason. As the designers quickly decided to offer a form of "behind closed doors" approach, exploration plays a decisive role in the player's experience: he is free to explore the mansion on each quest, allowing him to learn a lot about the game and its lore.

We truly respect how smart players are. We develop games for adults, mature games.

Sylvain Sechi

This is reflected in the history of the game. It has its u-turns and turnarounds, but these are nothing close to a deus ex machina: a careful player can find clues for them during each quest. In addition, The Council plays with its own codes by pretending to go in one direction while spreading clues that will later show that the answer is in the opposite direction.

In addition, there is an important search for authenticity. This is reflected in particular in the choice of actors. The characters come from many different countries and so do the actors lending their voices, bringing a rather clear accent to each. This part was not easy to achieve, because it was necessary to find the right balance between immersion and understanding of the dialogues: if an English speaker had been forced to read the subtitles all the time because the accent was too pronounced, this would have been problematic.

A game with consequences
Internally, there is relatively little talk of a "choice game"; we talk of "consequence game" because many do offer choices , but very few actually play on consequences. Our trip was not to create another illusion: we really wanted to offer value to the player.

Sylvain Sechi

The theme of consequences often comes up in our discussion. They guide The Council's conception: "From the player's point of view, what seems coherent? What action should be taken at this point in time? " says Sylvain Sechi.

They also affect the mechanics of the game. They are, for example, the reason for the impossibility to go back in time: the objective is for a player to assume the consequences of his actions. The game also has a good memory: the characters remember the sentences picked by the player and the game even reacts to the number of dialogue possibilities explored by the player. As we saw in our test of Episode 4 (available in French), if the game asks the player to hurry, it checks how the player behaves and adapts accordingly. If the player decides to take his time, several events will occur in parallel, sometimes without him knowing about those.

Moreover, the integration of chess into the game is interesting:

Unlike most games, we don't have a game over. We do not leave the player in a state in which he is forced to repeat it over and over again to finish. It is assumed that he may fail at solving some riddles and the game goes on anyway. Obviously, this will have consequences.

Sylvain Sechi

Everything that happens has consequences. This is true for the player, but also for the developers. They are themselves fans of cliffhangers at the end of the episode, but refuse to solve it in an inconsistent way: if a character finds himself in a delicate situation, he will not get away with it as if by magic at the beginning of the new episode.

This aspect is also reflected in the very special relationship between Louis and the person who plays him. According to the creators, Louis is clearly "written": he adopts a behaviour that is specific to him, particularly in terms of his way of thinking or expressing himself. However, it is the player who chooses his actions and Louis is defined by the choices of the person he embodies: his physique can be affected, as well as his relationships or his vision of events.

Of course, these choices have a cost, as Thomas Veauclin confirms: "It is expensive, it is very expensive, but it is also what makes it possible to create unforgettable and above all unique stories."

The future of Big Bad Wolf
The Council has had a very special destiny. From its first episode, the game was extremely well received by both the press and the players. This greatly reassured Big Bad Wolf's teams, who were concerned about the positioning of the game: was there an audience for such a title? Cyanide had given them great freedom, but they remained worried before receiving the first feedbacks.

However, sales are not matching these praising criticisms. The episodic model was intended to allow a quick confrontation with the market, spreading sales over time: the opposite is actually happening, with many people waiting for all episodes to be released before actually buying the game.

For Big Bad Wolf, the release of episode 5, alongside a box release in Europe, is therefore a crucial moment. It took place on December 4 and the full version was distributed by... Bigben Interactive. Indeed, on May 14, 2018, Cyanide was acquired by this publisher, taking with it its subsidiary Big Bad Wolf and the license The Council.


L'équipe de Big Bad Wolf



For players who enjoy games from a specific studio, a buyout by a competitor is always seen as a threat. In this case, this event seems to have been very well received in Bordeaux. Cyanide will no longer need to look for a publisher for each of its projects, especially since Bigben Interactive wants to extend the studio's editorial line. The Big Bad Wolf teams met their new bosses twice and the exchanges went smoothly.

In any case, regardless of the success of this Complete Edition, the future of the studio seems assured. A future project is already underway, even if they have not been able to reveal any information about it. We thank Fabrice Granger, Thomas Veauclin and Sylvain Sechi for their warm welcome and wish them - and the other members of the studio - all the best for the future.
 

hexer

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Sales to date are below expectation. They're counting on the sales of complete edition and boxed release in Europe (which is handled by Bigben not Foucs).

Was I the only one that missed their marketing campaign?
I found the game by pure chance
 

Zombra

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Just wait until the fuck you that is Chapter 3 end puzzle :lol:
Yeah ... that "we do things counterclockwise for no reason and without telling you" was real nice. :mad:
To be honest, after all the hype I was disappointed. The puzzle is only somewhat challenging because you only get one chance to do it (and even that can be circumvented with high-level agility). You get a couple of misleading clues, but anyone with half a brain and a reasonable build would get it right at the second try, third max.
Full disclosure, after I made my decision I glanced at a walkthrough to see if I was on the right track. (I was.) After I got it wrong I had no fucking idea where to go from there. It took me 5 or 6 different spoiler sites to determine I had the exact right answer except ... "and oh you have to do it upside down". Huh?
 

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Full disclosure, after I made my decision I glanced at a walkthrough to see if I was on the right track. (I was.) After I got it wrong I had no fucking idea where to go from there. It took me 5 or 6 different spoiler sites to determine I had the exact right answer except ... "and oh you have to do it upside down". Huh?
If you're referring to the phases of the moon, when you examine the relevant ring in the puzzle, Louis just names every position on the ring.
I actually made the same mistake the first time around, it's one of the two red herrings I was referring to. But the game is very generous with clues if you examine everything, and by that stage you should already have realized that.
 
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Zombra

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Full disclosure, after I made my decision I glanced at a walkthrough to see if I was on the right track. (I was.) After I got it wrong I had no fucking idea where to go from there. It took me 5 or 6 different spoiler sites to determine I had the exact right answer except ... "and oh you have to do it upside down". Huh?
If you're referring to the phases of the moon, when you examine the relevant ring in the puzzle, Louis just names every position on the ring.
I actually made the same mistake the first time around, it's one of the two red herrings I was referring to. But the game is very generous with clues if you examine everything, and by that stage you should already have realized that.
Yeah, I already heard and completely comprehended that. I'm doing it again right now and now I see the tiny detail that I missed.
The tiny

.Δ
.N


that shows that north is up only when you're reading top to bottom. This makes sense of Louis' multiple mentions of "west to east".
So I guess it's fair after all. Funny that not even the walkthroughs out there mention this detail.
 
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V_K

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The tiny

.

.N


that shows that north is up only when you're reading top to bottom. This makes sense of Louis' multiple mentions of "west to east".
No, I mean when you examine the moon ring on the puzzle dial (rather than on the sphere), Louis says something to the effect that the darkened circle represents new moon and clockwise from it there go waning crescent, last quarter etc. IIRC, it's not even hidden behind a check.
 

V_K

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Ah, I'm wrong actually, this infromation is behind a hard (difficulty 5) Erudition check. Still, with the amount of consumables and skill points you get at that stage, shouldn't be a problem.
 

Zombra

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No, I mean when you examine the moon ring on the puzzle dial (rather than on the sphere), Louis says something to the effect that the darkened circle represents new moon and clockwise from it there go waning crescent, last quarter etc. IIRC, it's not even hidden behind a check.
Like I said, I understood that and comprehended it completely. But what does 'clockwise' mean? Do you go around the dial 1, 2, 3, 4? That seems reasonable, doesn't it?

yBy1CjE.jpg
Face2.png
This is exactly what I did. But this is wrong.

You're supposed to spin the dial clockwise, which means you are effectively moving the symbols counterclockwise (going from 12 to 11, 10, 9 etc.)
So this talk about clockwise/counterclockwise is not helpful at all as it can be interpreted either way, and the more intuitive interpretation is the wrong one.
 
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hexer

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We'll see what the studio's up to for their next game.
If they do it right, they could maybe fill a hole left by Telltale's closure.
 

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No, I mean when you examine the moon ring on the puzzle dial (rather than on the sphere), Louis says something to the effect that the darkened circle represents new moon and clockwise from it there go waning crescent, last quarter etc. IIRC, it's not even hidden behind a check.
Like I said, I understood that and comprehended it completely. But what does 'clockwise' mean? Do you go around the dial 1, 2, 3, 4? That seems reasonable, doesn't it?

This is exactly what I did. But this is wrong.

You're supposed to spin the dial clockwise, which means you are effectively moving the symbols counterclockwise (going from 12 to 11, 10, 9 etc.)
So this talk about clockwise/counterclockwise is not helpful at all as it can be interpreted either way, and the more intuitive interpretation is the wrong one.
What you seem to be missing is that he's saying that the moon at 1:00 is a waning crescent, the last one in the cycle. So he names them in a clockwise fashion, but the way they are ordered is counterclockwise.
Unless you're saying that the combination in your screenshot is your wrong solution. Which would be weird because it did the job for me.
 

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It's okay to fail.
I got the bad ending, fell into an obvious trap because I couldn't be arsed at some point.
 

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I give up.
Let me explain on the screenshot:
Louis literally says this when you do the Erudition check: "The totally dark moon represents the new moon. So going clockwise we have: the waning crescent, the last quarter, the waning gibbous, the full moon, the waxing gibbous, the first quarter, the waxing crescent". Which corresponds to the labeling above.
Now Jesus was crucified on 8 nissam 3793. This date corresponds to 26 March 33 and 7 Sha'ban 607 (the "8 nissam 3" date is the second red herring, but you can figure it out because there's another 3793 date on the list, from which you can see that 8 April can't be right).
26 March 33 gives you 26M.
7 Sha'ban, when used on the moon sphere, gives you first quarter.
So you align Golgotha, crown of thorns, 26M and first quarter and open the door.
Where's the "fuck you" moment, I don't understand?
For the sake of (my) sanity check I might as well ask InD_ImaginE to join the discussion too.
 

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V_K
I got first and last quarters confused. I probably thought "first quarter" meant "the first quarter moon that appears after the new moon" which is another very reasonable assumption to make if one is not an astronomer (I'm not an astronomer). It certainly didn't help that Louis listed them in clockwise order first yet I was expected to count in counterclockwise order. Anyway that was a non-critical clue to me because he said words to the effect of "the correct quarter is the one where the left half is lit up"; once I heard this I thought I had the answer. This is only the correct answer if you are looking at the bottom of the dial, not the top of the dial as is intuitive. If I listened closer to the two statements about quarter moons I could have caught it; I also could have noticed that this was wrong if I paid attention to the N Δ which is upside down at the top of the dial. Again this latter would also have explained the west to east repetition which seemed irrelevant at the time.
I hope it's OK for us to drop it now because I already feel dumb enough, and I hope I've sufficiently explained why I still feel "fuck you"d.
 

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So I've played through ep. 4 and I don't quite get what all the hate is about. Granted, the reveal wasn't handled gracefully, but everything that happens after ties nicely enough to the main narrative. Introducing a new mechanic actually makes sense to me, because at that stage of the game you're just bound to have all the skills, and most of them at level 2. Besides, it makes a largely useless consumable somewhat useful. On the other hand, I liked the spear puzzle - it's not terribly hard, but because of all the misleading clues you can't be 100% sure you chose right until the very endgame.
I was also thinking that it's essentially the kind of game Hepler suggested in that infamous interview - a Bioware RPG with all the (mostly cosmetic) dialog choices but without all the (trash) combat. And I would say that it does a much better job of realizing that vision than Unavowed.
 

hexer

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Now you only have the super-short EP 5 left.
Not sure what was the deal with that.
Maybe there's lots of different endings and all the content is in variations.
 

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I think they just planned more story than they could fit into their budget, so they had to cut some corners (hence also the cringy expo in ep. 4).
 

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Now you only have the super-short EP 5 left.
Not sure what was the deal with that.
Maybe there's lots of different endings and all the content is in variations.

I've seen videos : the final scene can play out in many different ways. However, this doesn't explain everything and clearly there was production issues.
 

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Finished it. Got one of the good endings, although there doesn't seem to be that much variation in the possible outcomes, more in the ways you get there. I haven't measured the time it took me to finish ep. 5, but I didn't feel the first two chapters were much shorter than the rest. The final one was short, yes, but it's essentially just the ending. Three things I'm wondering about now:
1. Who killed Elizabeth and why? From the clues I assumed it was Sarah, but she seemed to be shocked at learning Liz was dead.
2. What's with the torn page from Al Azif? Can you find it and does it matter?
3. The ending slides say that Sarah never made it to France, even though I stopped Emily from shooting her. Is there any way to save her?
 

hexer

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1. Who killed Elizabeth and why? From the clues I assumed it was Sarah, but she seemed to be shocked at learning Liz was dead.

In my playthrough Mortimer admitted he possessed Elizabeth and made her kill herself.
 

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