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The search for Beneath a Steel Sky's creator, Dave Cummins (UPDATE: He's dead :( )

Discussion in 'Adventure Gaming' started by Infinitron, Sep 13, 2012.

  1. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    :hmmm:
     
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  2. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    http://pleimert.tumblr.com/post/31471433150/freerobertfoster

     
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  3. kaizoku Arcane

    kaizoku
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    At first I was like

    But the I went like

    And then I finally went with

    How the hell can he simply lose contact? He may have lost his HDD, but not his email account.

    Also, Revolution never said anything about $2M.



    fake edit:

    Furthemore David Cummins didn't left after BASS (1994). He worked on BS1 (1996) and BS2 (1997). http://pc.mobygames.com/developer/sheet/view/developerId,6901/
    I think that guy is trollin' and possibly very butthurt about something else.

    We need a Sherlock to solve this case.
     
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  4. Troels Pleimert Novice

    Troels Pleimert
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    Hey there. I wrote the butthurt blog post. Thanks for taking the time to comment (and I love the gifs; I'm a sucker for memes).

    You're right; Dave Cummins didn't leave before doing some work on Broken Sword 1, and he had some marginal input on Broken Sword 2. That said, he was still pressured into leaving and the chemistry between him and Cecil was battered beyond repair after BASS.

    I did lose his contact information and was unable to retrieve it, despite my best efforts. You have to remember, this was back in 1997 (if memory serves correctly) and, sadly, I wasn't very good at backing up data. We didn't have cloud services or Gmail back then, so when my hard drive died, it took all my e-mails and contact informations with it. I tried contacting Charles Cecil and Tony Warriner to get Cummins' e-mail again and they ignored me.

    For what it's worth, I'm not trolling. I may be an incurable BASS fanboy, but I am not making this shit up. These are the facts as I remember them from my e-mail conversations with Cecil, Warriner and Cummins, which you're sadly right I have no way of backing up currently. If I could get back in touch with Cummins, he could back up my statements. I'd welcome any opportunity to regain that contact.

    As things are, you have every right to be distrustful, and in your position I would be, too. That doesn't change the fact that what Revolution is doing with their stretch goals is despicable to the point of being insulting.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 4
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  5. kaizoku Arcane

    kaizoku
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    http://simplebrokensword.free.fr/article02.html
    [​IMG]
    So it's basically what has already been told here.
    Cummins was basically the architect of it all.

    We now have a face to the man. Well a barely visible black and white outdated face.
     
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  6. kaizoku Arcane

    kaizoku
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  7. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    That guy is too young to be him.
     
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  8. Troels Pleimert Novice

    Troels Pleimert
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    I'm off to bed now, so I won't be replying anymore for tonight, but I'll be watching this thread closely (got it set up to send me an e-mail for any new replies).

    If you guys are successful in finding Mr. Cummins, I would of course be very interested to get back in touch with him. I have tried Google searching and trolling various social networks, including Facebook, Google+ and LinkedIn, for the man, and there are plenty of Dave Cummins' to choose from, but if he's one of them, he's not much for flaunting his affiliation with Steel Sky.

    I'll assist in any way I can. Tracking him down and reestablishing contact would the fulfillment of a decades-long dream to me.
     
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  9. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

    FeelTheRads
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    I don't get what's your problem. It's a stretch goal. And they repeatedly said that BASS2 is not out of the question even if they don't reach that goal which is 1, not 2 million. If they get it, it just means that they'll start working on it sooner.

    In conclusion: Butthurt and liar.
     
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  10. kaizoku Arcane

    kaizoku
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    My point was, how can you had been exchanging emails with him and not remember his email.
    Furthermore emails have a recipient and sender fields. If he replied to you, then you would have his email. You would simply need to login to the webmail again and open an email.


    Your story is a bit far fetched... I'd give it a 50/50 of it being true.

    If that is indeed true, what pisses me off even more is that potential treasures (BASS1 OST and BASS2 plot) have been lost beyond space and time.
     
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  11. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    kaizoku How old are you, man? Do know what the POP3 mail protocol is?

    People didn't use "webmail" in the 90's.
     
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  12. Humanity has risen! Arcane Patron Repressed Homosexual

    Humanity has risen!
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    I don't get the anger either. These games take time and a lot of resources to complete. They're just doing what they can to best please their fans.
     
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  13. kaizoku Arcane

    kaizoku
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    I don't think he looks young. He's just a bit pale. Check out the lady, she's in her 40s. So he is likely older.

    I only had net access in 1999/2000.

    Given that he sent his emails around 97... and the first webmail services appeared that time also... it's a tough call.
    But wouldn't the emails stay stored at the email server anyway?
     
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  14. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Nope. The mail server (typically your ISP would provide one) would push any new email to your client whenever you connected, without saving a copy. Storage space was limited back then so you had a limited buffer on the server before incoming mails would start to bounce.
     
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  15. Kz3r0 Arcane

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    Finally someone propose a worthy stretch goal, another game instead of a shitty port to Xbawks, and this is called blackmail?!
     
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  16. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

    FeelTheRads
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    But they didn't reply to his email, the bastards!

    Seriously, though, I guess his complaint that it wouldn't be a true BASS is valid, but calling this blackmail is just simply retarded and an outright lie. And asking people to stop donating and cancel their pledges is what's despicable. Fuck you, I don't give a shit about your problems with Revolution. I'm not gonna base my decision on your likes and dislikes.
     
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  17. Troels Pleimert Novice

    Troels Pleimert
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    Cipher is right. We had a ridiculously low space limit with our ISP. So when my HD died, I was like Edward Norton at the beginning of Fight Club, watching what used to be his apartment lie in ruins, almost catatonic.

    Anyway. Whether you believe my story about e-mailing Cummins or not is, I think, irrelevant to the big picture. I'd be suspicious if I were you, too, and since I have no way of proving it's true at current time of writing, I'm not going to bicker about it. Believe it if you choose, or don't.

    I DO think it's blackmail. It's like saying you can have your favorite food if you swallow this oversized dung beetle first. Again, that is personal opinion, not established fact. That's why I wrote a blog post with my personal opinion and stories from memory, not an article or factually based editorial. If you love Broken Sword and want to see it happen, by all means, pledge away. Dangling a Steel Sky sequel as a carrot, in my opinion, is a low move, and one Revolution have tried before. Cecil coming out and saying "we might do Steel Sky 2 anyway" is just damage control, as far as I can see. I am outraged and I'm not the only one.
     
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  18. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    I'm Infinitron, Troels. You know me. You just don't know it. ;) Cipher is my rank.

    Anyway, it sounds to me like you're mostly angry at Revolution Software for "hiding" Dave Cummins from you and for abandoning his vision. After all, didn't Jane Jensen do kind of the same thing with her multi-game Kickstarter?

    Also, what's the difference between holding an entire game "for ransom" and holding expanded content "for ransom"? Is it really that critical?
     
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  19. Troels Pleimert Novice

    Troels Pleimert
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    Sorry, man. Early morning post -- not entirely awake when I wrote that. ;) Nice to (re-)meet you, Infinitron.

    I was a bit miffed that Revolution didn't get back in touch with me, but that was years and years ago. I have tried several different times. Maybe they lost his contact information; maybe they just got busy; maybe they (as I half-jokingly said earlier) realized what a mistake it was to hand out his e-mail address in the first place. I'm not sure.

    Jane's multi-game Kickstarter was a different affair. She didn't shove a potential Gabriel Knight sequel in there on the condition that she be allowed to do a different game first. That's what Revolution are doing. And I'd hardly call a sequel to a completely different game "expanded content." ;)

    I'm not angry with Revolution or Charles Cecil -- they have been very nice to me in the past, before they started ignoring me (which they are well within their right to do). I am angry with what they're doing to one of my favorite games, Beneath a Steel Sky. I have my own suspicions as to why they are suddenly so eager to do Steel Sky 2, but that's in the "wild speculation" category -- and contrary to what people seem to think of me in here, I don't want to engage in that sort of thing publicly. ;)
     
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  20. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

    FeelTheRads
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    Question is, are you gonna edit the lie about 2 million from your blog? Or you think it will carry more weight and impress more people if you lie?
     
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  21. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Feel free to speculate! I'd like to know what you think.

    BTW, admins, I vouch for Troels, you can take him out of newbie moderation.
     
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  22. Troels Pleimert Novice

    Troels Pleimert
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    Yes, I will. It was not my intention to lie about it. But that did teach me a valuable lesson about looking things up before hitting Post. Again, had this been an article or editorial, I would have been more prudent about fact checking. This was a case of me seeing red and firing off a lengthy rant based on memory. There's bound to be a few synaptic misfires in a process such as that.

    That still doesn't mean I made all the stuff up about e-mailing Dave Cummins, though. ;)

    How goes the detective work? I did another search yesterday around Google, various local directories in the U.K., high-profile social media outlets and such, but no luck. Well, plenty of Dave Cummins', but I'm not about to start carpet bombing them all with "did you design my favorite cyberpunk adventure game?". (I did that once. You'd be surprised how many don't like that kind of attention.)
     
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  23. Troels Pleimert Novice

    Troels Pleimert
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    I wouldn't be comfortable doing that, since I don't want to paint an ugly picture of someone who hasn't had the chance to defend themselves. It'd be like spreading rumors in grade school that "the fat kid is also gay," and then it turns out his mom bought him the pink shorts and forced him to wear them in public.
     
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  24. Guido Fawkes Defensor Fidei

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    After BS3 and BS4 I kind of lost confidence in Cecil. His interviews and premise for BS5 doesn't seem to change the mistakes at all, the only good think is that he is coming back to 2d.

    I don't know, having the mastermind leaving the boat during BS2 makes a whole lot of sense. This was discussed in the Broken Sword kickstarter thread, I would open up my wallet far and wide if I knew the original writers were on board. As it is I will wait for the game to be released before giving it a chance. Hell, I wouldn't even be optimistic with fears that they could ruin a BASS 2.
     
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  25. Jaesun Fabulous Moderator Patron

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    We can't do anything about the moderation queue. Just FYI.
     
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