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Decline What is the worst example of decline you have ever seen?

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by Thac0, May 10, 2020.

?

Which of these is the most decline?

  1. Witcher 3

    19 vote(s)
    10.6%
  2. Skyrim

    29 vote(s)
    16.1%
  3. Dragon Age Origins

    19 vote(s)
    10.6%
  4. Dragon Age 2

    70 vote(s)
    38.9%
  5. Oblivion

    73 vote(s)
    40.6%
  6. Outer Worlds

    31 vote(s)
    17.2%
  7. Fallout 3

    82 vote(s)
    45.6%
  8. Fallout 4

    54 vote(s)
    30.0%
  9. Gothic 4

    30 vote(s)
    16.7%
  10. Bards Tale Barrows Deep

    15 vote(s)
    8.3%
  11. Ultima IX

    25 vote(s)
    13.9%
  12. Might and Magic X

    10 vote(s)
    5.6%
  13. Gothic 3

    19 vote(s)
    10.6%
  14. Underworld Ascendant

    36 vote(s)
    20.0%
  15. Divinity Orginal Sin

    12 vote(s)
    6.7%
  16. Torment: Tides of Numenera

    30 vote(s)
    16.7%
  17. Pillars of Eternity

    22 vote(s)
    12.2%
  18. Bonus Round! Rpg adjacent games/Jrpgs/Arpgs below

    6 vote(s)
    3.3%
  19. Any Mass Effect

    22 vote(s)
    12.2%
  20. Any Final Fantasy

    15 vote(s)
    8.3%
  21. Heroes of Might and Magic VI or VII

    19 vote(s)
    10.6%
  22. Dark Souls 2

    8 vote(s)
    4.4%
  23. Diablo 3

    41 vote(s)
    22.8%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. jac8awol Learned

    jac8awol
    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2018
    Messages:
    124
    Did you just say you don't see any evidence of Obsidian pushing feminist agendas? I think I almost spat out my drink. Now I do chalk up a lot of their decline over the last decade to incompetence, but forced diversity has had a big impact too. I'm sure you keep an eye on the Sawyer thread on these forums. See what that guy tweets, who he surrounds himself with, his political affiliation... All of those things give you a pretty clear indication of where his headspace is, and I can only assume that holds true for his colleagues.
     
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  2. DraQ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    DraQ
    Joined:
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    Location:
    Chrząszczyżewoszyce, powiat Łękołody
    There hasn't been anything more declineful than Oblivion, except maybe FO3 (which I haven't played but the way story works...).

    You have misspelled '1'.
     
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  3. George Duroy Learned

    George Duroy
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2020
    Messages:
    309
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  4. lukaszek the determinator

    lukaszek
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2015
    Messages:
    6,566
    correct sir.
    At least oblivion itroduced some new mechanic over morrowind. Some of which I actually enjoyed.
    Now F3 is reskinned, dumbed down oblivion
     
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  5. George Duroy Learned

    George Duroy
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2020
    Messages:
    309
    :abyssgazer:
    Which mechanics ? lock picking mini game ? nope broken . dialogue mini game? boring and useless , sneaking? yes better but it's still shit, combat? nope even more boring and dull than morrowind without the rpg elements. Interactive items? useless, Bow's scope? meh could have been better . There is nothing redeeming in Oblivion.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2020
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  6. Falksi Arcane

    Falksi
    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    4,599
    Location:
    Nottingham
    Years ago I was at an AC/DC tribute gig, and this 6ft, 20 odd stone dude started kicking off & causing trouble with someone next to him. The bloke kicking off looked monstrous and Ogre-like, whereas the other chap was like a rake and primed for a pasting.

    On the doors were 3 bouncers who spotted it and made their way straight over. Of the 3 bouncers, 2 were typical 6ft well built blokes, but one was a fairly stocky woman around 5'10, a bit like the pic below.......

    [​IMG]

    I didn't expect her to do much, but she lead the line and dragged the Ogre man straight to the ground, pulling him across the dancefloor and stopping to uppercut him in the face every 4 or 5 steps. It was brutal and I was gobsmacked. She totally owned the mo fo.

    But she clearly had some weight & solidity to her. No way could a stick woman have dealt with that scenario as well, and you're point is spot on, it's a real hard sell to buy into female tanks unless they're essentially build like tough blokes.
     
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  7. Thac0 Maybe we have trash taste ... Patron

    Thac0
    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2020
    Messages:
    326
    Location:
    Between Elysium and Limbo
    Thats where I am not seeing the link. The world is overpopulated to the point where sheer mass off population is no longer the definining power factor. It is economics and technical advance. Nuclear weapons have eliminated the possibility of a classical all out war. Thats why Putins position to go deep into AI development and coding for the russian nation is a smart one, and communism is destined to fail.
    Skill Mastery Perks are cool. Also you can summon a lot more stuff in Oblivion, and summoning weapons is less broken. Much more unique dialogue, better than the generic dialogue keyterm system. Better fatigue system. The game has physics and arrows can be recovered. The game tries to emulate a day and night cycle for NPCs - daily routines which is neat. Also while Factions now force you to complete all their quests instead of cherry picking the good ones the general quest quality is higher. Horses exist.
    Also fast travel and quest marker are a thing. But wether those are a good thing or not is very questionable for the game.

    The game took two steps back for every step forward but it definitly made some steps forward.
     
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  8. lukaszek the determinator

    lukaszek
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2015
    Messages:
    6,566
     
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  9. Unorus Janco Lurker

    Unorus Janco
    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,175
    Location:
    Santa María del Buen Ayre
    It's Oblivion, of course.

    But Ultima VII deserves a special mention due to its early appearance and huge popularity even among Codexers. It was not a particularly bad game, and in fact I believe it's an OK sandbox adventure, but it was also a huge decline back when monocled games like Darklands, Realms of Arkania, Wizardry 7 or even Ultima Underworld were popular.

    The game had:
    • Chaotic and really pointless real-time combat replacing a fine turn-based system, where spells are no longer useful, and stats have no noticeable effects. Just equip yourself, activate combat mode, and be done with it after a few seconds of nonsense. At least it was fast.

    • Meaningless customization options, with no character creation nor classes. Despite combat being an afterthought and spending most of the game chatting with NPCs and moving objects around, stats don't influence these activities at all.

    • A dumbed-down dialogue system where you no longer type keywords so you don't have to think of what to say next, nor you can sequence break quests if you already know what to do next, forcing linearity and players just clicking all available options without even reading. Karma meters are also absent now, so NPCs no longer can surprise you with some small C&C like in prior Ultima games.

    • No more destructible vessels,no more naval battles against pirate ships with cannons and boarding stages, no more wind affecting navigation, and ships are completely worthless anyways thanks to the magic carpet that can be found at the beginning of the game (which, unlike in Ultima V, now it can cross vast oceans, making all other transport means pointless).

    • Headache-inducing perspective and inferior cinematic presentation, unlike prior Ultima games with a more appropriate abstract presentation for these kinds of simulationist games.

    • Companions need to be manually fed like they were fucking babies every couple of minutes. Who's idea was that? Buying tons of food does also make a mess of inventory organization, in a game with a really cumbersome inventory system. You will spend countless hours micro your inventory.

    • The plot, while not bad at all for its time, feels like a more generic good vs evil tale after the three prior games which had more unique stories about an inward fight.

    I can concede that Ultima VI shares some of the blame since much of what U7 axed were kind of pointless features there. But that was because U6 was a huge and kind of experimental step forward in world-building, which made them neglect much of what made Ultima IV and V special (in other words, the game got dumbed-down due to incompetence, not malice nor profit). Ultima VII on the other hand was clearly trying to cater to a new demographic. After that, disasters like Ultima VIII were kind of its logical conclusion.
     
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  10. Darkzone Arcane

    Darkzone
    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2013
    Messages:
    2,074
    Changes are necessary to adapt towards a changing environment to sustain the survivability of the individum and the nation. One of this necessities was equal rights for women and men. But some changes may lead to an dead end, especially if they lower the reproduction rate significantly. I'm not against necessary changes, but if intends to kill the system that produced me then i have to oppose it. Feminism is one of this changes that aims at changing the balance between the genders. We know that the extreme towards male dominance is functioning (see islamic world), while the change in the other direction will result in a demographic catastrophe. I'm against the demographic catastrophe, because one of the realities of this world is, that we get older and die, therefore we need replacement that will sustain this european system of culture and philosophy.

    The lesser of the two evil. But there are also other solutions, like Nationalsozialism. Which is also not better then the red horse and the green horse of the apocalypse.

    It seems your indoctrination into leftist agenda was successfully completed. [/Joke]
    You mistake is thinking of warfare in symmetric terms, but warfare has changed. And we fight in an asymmetric warfare, where the demographic bomb is worse than nuclear bombs and we are losing this conflict. All around the western europe the islamic fraction is growing in strength up to the point where they can even influence our policies by only their numbers and don't even need to rely on terrorism. And if their numbers increase then it is only a matter of time when they introduce sharia. First as a law system besides our courts and later it will replace the western court system. In warfare you do not need only to think how to win a battle, you need to know how to win the war. Some wars last more than one generation and this war was declared upon us some 1400 years ago.
    Putin knows this and therefore he uses much of the ressources to change their demographic development. Google Russia birth rate and see the changes between 2000-2019.
    Also the believe in Marxism is not getting weaker. Take a look at events in USA, it changed its form towards only the cultural form. Communism will remain dormant under the Cultural Marxism cover up, until it can be revived.
    If i begin to explain this then i will be writing for next week the treatises about grivens policy in universities and affirmative actions, hate speach laws or INGSOC Newspeak, critical theory and critical racial studies, postcolonialism, postmodernism and etc.. And therefore i will throw this ball into you corner with the remark, that you should inform yourself and that you should have this integrity towards yourself and your classical liberalism.
     
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  11. Sigourn Arcane

    Sigourn
    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2016
    Messages:
    4,525
    Location:
    Greater Buenos Aires, Argentina.
    Fallout 3 or "Gothic" 4, I'm guessing. Fallout 3 takes the reigns, though.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2020
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  12. Chippy Arcane

    Chippy
    Joined:
    May 5, 2018
    Messages:
    2,274
    Pillar Of Eternity.

    DA:O was meant to be a spiritual successor. DA:2 was just made by retards. Fallout 3 was made by another company. All the other games were the right of each developer to take in whatever direction they chose to go in; including Bioware with the ending to ME3. Planescape: Numenera (whatever the fuck, I was a gold backer and I still haven't played it) was an artistic attempt with too many artists in the kitchen.

    But Pillars of Eternity had one job: it was meant to be a return to form. A return to the games that they had originally made. And they fucked it up. They didn't seem to include MCA and Tim Cain. So in that sense, it was a specific failure, and all the more of a failure because of it.

    They didn't even have the excuse that Beamdog has in the sense that Beamdog didn't have access to the original writers with SOD, and then got MCA to tell us the story was good. It was worse because they more-or-less gave me the impression MCA and the original band would be working on it.

    So yeah, it was the most specific failure, and I don't quite know how the Codex's panties arn't pemanently tied into a knot over it. :majordecline:
     
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  13. Lawntoilet Arbiter Patron

    Lawntoilet
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    1,193
    I'd like to know the whys and wherefores as to why you would choose DA:I and not DA2?
     
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  14. S0rcererV1ct0r Liturgist

    S0rcererV1ct0r
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2019
    Messages:
    1,664
    DA:2 is trash game but at least have a interesting conflict between mages and templars. DA:I is a trash game extremely repetitive and doesn't even have a good story. Is just "demons invading, save the world in peril nº 56541654141"

    DA:I also took away blood magic for the worst iteration of necromancy ever. Not saying that blood magic on DA:O and DA:2 is that amazing. The best blood magic is VtMB IMO but at least was better than spiritualist "specialization without animate dead"
     
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  15. Lawntoilet Arbiter Patron

    Lawntoilet
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    1,193
    DA:2's story isn't interesting either, the conflict is ultimately meaningless because both factions are complete retardos.
    At least DA:I had the best part of DA2 (bro Varric) plus more than 3 locations and you got to ride around on a big elk through them. It was still too shitty for me to finish but more enjoyable than the Kirkwall Express Railroad Extravaganza.
     
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