Good Ol' Drog said:I currently have Quake installed with tons of custom SP maps alongside current-gen games such as Mirror's Edge and Divinity 2.
I honestly don't care how old a game is, as long as it's good.
So why are you playing Quake?
Good Ol' Drog said:I currently have Quake installed with tons of custom SP maps alongside current-gen games such as Mirror's Edge and Divinity 2.
I honestly don't care how old a game is, as long as it's good.
obediah said:You can think all you want, but you aren't getting anywhere with that hypothesis.
Game developers are the conservative force today. Like their political cousins, they have a checklist of 10 rules and every commercial game must meet 8 of them.
Us old codgers don't hate these games for being "new", they are anything but. We hate them because they are homogenized crap and we cut our teeth on a much more progressive gaming environment where developers could build whatever crazy idea popped into their head just by mortgaging their house or going into credit card debt to raise $50k.
doctor_kaz said:A major culprit in this deevolution is the decay of the games journalism business, which is a shadow of its former self. Games criticism is a complete joke nowadays. If you look at five or ten year old reviews on sites like Gamespot, you will find that they used to be way harsher on games and much more honest. If you want to see something hilarious, go to Gamespot and watch their video review for The Getaway. They rip on it for its lame attempts at "cinematic' gameplay and realism like having no HUD and regenerating health. Nowadays, games are praised endlessly for this shit. More and more I find myself playing games that get 10/10 A+++ scores and thinking that the reviewers must have taken an envelope of cash to hand out the score the game got.
obediah said:doctor_kaz said:A major culprit in this deevolution is the decay of the games journalism business, which is a shadow of its former self. Games criticism is a complete joke nowadays. If you look at five or ten year old reviews on sites like Gamespot, you will find that they used to be way harsher on games and much more honest. If you want to see something hilarious, go to Gamespot and watch their video review for The Getaway. They rip on it for its lame attempts at "cinematic' gameplay and realism like having no HUD and regenerating health. Nowadays, games are praised endlessly for this shit. More and more I find myself playing games that get 10/10 A+++ scores and thinking that the reviewers must have taken an envelope of cash to hand out the score the game got.
One quick contention, before I ramble. Developer pressure is not the only reason reviewers inflate scores. Popular reviewers aren't trying to educate consumers, they are trying to guess the consumer response. The days of reading professional reviews before deciding to buy a game (AAA hyped blockbusters, at least) are over. Just like modern journalism, reviewers process the facts and present them in a light that their readers want to hear.
doctor_kaz said:A major culprit in this deevolution is the decay of the games journalism business, which is a shadow of its former self. Games criticism is a complete joke nowadays. If you look at five or ten year old reviews on sites like Gamespot, you will find that they used to be way harsher on games and much more honest. If you want to see something hilarious, go to Gamespot and watch their video review for The Getaway. They rip on it for its lame attempts at "cinematic' gameplay and realism like having no HUD and regenerating health. Nowadays, games are praised endlessly for this shit. More and more I find myself playing games that get 10/10 A+++ scores and thinking that the reviewers must have taken an envelope of cash to hand out the score the game got.
It's one of the fastest FPSs ever made. It's great fun. I can't stand most of modern "realistic" shooters that move at a snail's pace and are constantly interrupted by cutscenes and QTEs. Quake never claims to be realistic, and its levels are surreal. Each mapper is free to interpret the setting in his own way, that's why there's such a diversity in maps.Panthera said:Good Ol' Drog said:I currently have Quake installed with tons of custom SP maps alongside current-gen games such as Mirror's Edge and Divinity 2.
I honestly don't care how old a game is, as long as it's good.
So why are you playing Quake?
Emotional Vampire said:I believe all genres gained a lot by moving to 3D. Except RPGs. So fuck progress I guess.
Elzair said:Meh. Action combat in an RPG is nothing new. I remember a game called Little Ninja Brothers on the NES that played very similarly to Jade Empire, but I never played Shenmue. This is because I abandoned Sega when it had clearly turned to shit.
Luzur said:the bottom line is that there is too much pleasing the console crowd/casual gamers.
I love advancements and innovations in gaming. The problem is, there have hardly been any in the last five years or so. What we have gotten in the last five years is not progress or innovation. It's dumbing down, stripping down, and gimping. Games like Bioshock have gotten undue credit for innovating and advancing gaming when all they have done is present gimped or stripped down versions of better games that came out years before on the PC. Since the PC titles were more niche titles, the majority of the gaming public is unaware that they are just being sold inferior remakes of old games. The major efforts in gaming since the middle of the X-Box era have not involved making games better. They have involved trying to figure out how to shoehorn staples of PC gaming like shooters and strategy games onto consoles without ruining them (my opinion -- they have failed miserably). There has also been a lot of sacrifice of gameplay to provide a "cinematic" experience, which usually means taking control out of the gamer's hands and turning all sorts of actions into glorified quick time events. Playing through interactive movies is not something that I want in gaming.
MetalCraze said:Stuff like FPRTS'es with 4X level overall management?
Kaanyrvhok said:MetalCraze said:Stuff like FPRTS'es with 4X level overall management?
With voice rec and gesture rec too.
doctor_kaz said:I love advancements and innovations in gaming. The problem is, there have hardly been any in the last five years or so. What we have gotten in the last five years is not progress or innovation. It's dumbing down, stripping down, and gimping. Games like Bioshock have gotten undue credit for innovating and advancing gaming when all they have done is present gimped or stripped down versions of better games that came out years before on the PC. Since the PC titles were more niche titles, the majority of the gaming public is unaware that they are just being sold inferior remakes of old games. The major efforts in gaming since the middle of the X-Box era have not involved making games better. They have involved trying to figure out how to shoehorn staples of PC gaming like shooters and strategy games onto consoles without ruining them (my opinion -- they have failed miserably). There has also been a lot of sacrifice of gameplay to provide a "cinematic" experience, which usually means taking control out of the gamer's hands and turning all sorts of actions into glorified quick time events. Playing through interactive movies is not something that I want in gaming.
This is not a question of "conservative" vs. "progressive". This is not old codgers clinging to an old way simply out of sentimental value. Progress is TV over radio, color TV over black and white, and HDTV over standard definition. CDs over cassettes, ipods over CDs. Anti-lock brakes and power steering vs non anti-lock brakes and non power steering. What's happening in gaming nowadays is not progress. It's more like the same deevolution phenomenon that has happened in music and movies. Once the XBox 360 and PS3 get motion controllers, I think that you are going to see this bad trend accelerate. If consolization ruined PC gaming, Wii-zation is going to ruin next gen console gaming.
A major culprit in this deevolution is the decay of the games journalism business, which is a shadow of its former self. Games criticism is a complete joke nowadays. If you look at five or ten year old reviews on sites like Gamespot, you will find that they used to be harsher on games and more honest. If you want to see something hilarious, go to Gamespot and watch their video review for The Getaway. They rip on it for its lame attempts at "cinematic' gameplay and realism like having no HUD and regenerating health. Nowadays, games are praised endlessly for this shit. More and more I find myself playing games that get 10/10 A+++ scores and thinking that the reviewers must have taken an envelope of cash to hand out the score the game got. The popularity of the Wii, the worst console of the last decade, is largely due to all of the glowing media coverage that it got even though the majority of the games on it are absolutely terrible and the motion control is awful.
There have been a few rays of hope lately like Risen and yes, Dragon Age despite some major flaws, but overall I have been getting a lot less enjoyment out of games in the past couple of years.
deuxhero said:Emotional Vampire said:I believe all genres gained a lot by moving to 3D. Except RPGs. So fuck progress I guess.
What did text based adventures gain from 3d?
Azrael the cat said:Hate to be the voice of optimism here, but your reference to movies and music gave me a thought.
Man, Zomg, how does a grown middle aged family man be so negative?Zomg said:Azrael the cat said:Hate to be the voice of optimism here, but your reference to movies and music gave me a thought.
Music is comically cheap to produce. The only bottleneck it ever had was radio/MTV play, which was mostly demonetized oligarchy backscratching stuff, and which is now gone. The correct analogy is the summer blockbuster and summer will never end. There will be minor "counterculture" games, which will be little meta-blockbusters, not real works unto themselves. Everything good is dead, kill yourselves.
obediah said:Kaanyrvhok said:Do you want to see anything new, whens the last time you appreciated something new?
Whats yer Ratatouille moment?
I think thats a good question with all the RPG conservative indieopians.
Here is the Yin and Yang. If you dont want to see anything new you are pretty much dead and at the same time a lot of whats new aint better. I got to think about it myself.
You can think all you want, but you aren't getting anywhere with that hypothesis.
Game developers are the conservative force today. Like their political cousins, they have a checklist of 10 rules and every commercial game must meet 8 of them.
Us old codgers don't hate these games for being "new", they are anything but. We hate them because they are homogenized crap and we cut our teeth on a much more progressive gaming environment where developers could build whatever crazy idea popped into their head just by mortgaging their house or going into credit card debt to raise $50k.