Obsidian got fucked by Bethesda

[Menckenstein]

@gaudaost

http://www.toledofreepress.com/2011/06/21/mcginnis-duke-nukem-pr-fiasco/THE REDNER GROUP

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Good! Some concrete information, which certainly strengthens the theory (would be even stronger if you had a link to all these allegations). If they are true, I can't argue against it, and I don't really have any interest in that either.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116360-Jeff-Gerstmann-Explains-His-Departure-From-Gamespot
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/20...veteran-reviewer-over-journalistic-ethics.htm
http://wire.ggl.com/news/kunochan-o...rnalists-are-not-journalists-there-i-said-it/

And also, threatening to pull ads on gaming sites for giving bad scores, is certainly on the border of shady business practice, but it is legit.

It's legit on the part of the publishers, but it's certainly not legit on the part of the gaming review sites. Reviews aren't supposed to be third party marketing for a company, they're supposed to tell you what the reviewer thinks of the game, both good and bad, so the consumer can make a semi-informed decision on the product. There's a reason why Consumer Reports magazine doesn't have advertising and only makes their money from subscriptions, and it's the same reason why they're the most trusted general product review magazine.

Now, you can argue that it's LEGAL, but legal and legitimate are two different things.

 

[RK47]

Just visit forums and stuff if you really want an honest review. People who paid for the game are actually more honest than those who needs to give glowing reviews to continue receiving free passes in the future. It's not rocket science. Which is why restaurant critiques went undercover, they want the real deal; not some set piece bullshit you saw on TV where the cook comes out with a violin and start serenading to the two food reviewers as they fake orgasm over a bowl of noodles.

 

[Infinitron]

Just visit forums and stuff if you really want an honest review. People who paid for the game are actually more honest than those who needs to give glowing reviews to continue receiving free passes in the future. It's not rocket science. Which is why restaurant critiques went undercover, they want the real deal; not some set piece bullshit you saw on TV where the cook comes out with a violin and start serenading to the two food reviewers as they fake orgasm over a bowl of noodles.

Reviews? Fuck, this is the age of Youtube. You can just go watch a video of somebody playing the first N hours of the game. Doesn't get any better than that.

 

[RK47]

Just visit forums and stuff if you really want an honest review. People who paid for the game are actually more honest than those who needs to give glowing reviews to continue receiving free passes in the future. It's not rocket science. Which is why restaurant critiques went undercover, they want the real deal; not some set piece bullshit you saw on TV where the cook comes out with a violin and start serenading to the two food reviewers as they fake orgasm over a bowl of noodles.

Reviews? Fuck, this is the age of Youtube. You can just go watch a video of somebody playing the first N hours of the game. Doesn't get any better than that.

Yeah, that too.

 

[aris]

Thank you Menckenstein and saint_proverbius for good solid links, they do indeed show cold hard facts, and I can't deny them.

Reviews? Fuck, this is the age of Youtube. You can just go watch a video of somebody playing the first N hours of the game. Doesn't get any better than that.

qft, I find myself mostly doing this these days.

 

[Menckenstein]

Mainstream games journalism can be summed up appropriately using this:

 

[Mastermind]

Some of the comments in the story are the usual hilarious stuff:

Exactly. That is completely what caused the lower score. It is an excellent game, but it was close to a year on some platforms before it was actually playable. That is not going to get you a good score. And for anyone bitching about the deal: Obsidian AGREED to it. Bethesda didn't force them at gunpoint into it. Their arrogance and inability to deliver a functioning product on time (or anywhere close to it), caused them to lose the bonus. Nothing else. Personally I hate to see them go. I loved KOTOR II, New Vegas, and Dungeon Siege III.

Like Fallout 3 didn't have bugs, but of course these people are incapable of thinking for themselves. The reviewers had to find problems to give sub-85 scores and they blamed Obsidian for Bethesda problems. Therefore, according to the fans, it's Obsidian's problem!

I bought Fallout 3. I also bought Fallout NV collectors' edition. I've put hundreds of hours in both of them. Fallout 3 did not come with a bug that overwrote recent saves right out the gate. The problem with NV wasn't that "it had bugs", it's that the bugs were noticeable, interfered with the game considerably, and in the case of the save killing one, inexcusable. This isn't the first time Obshitian pulled this either, I had my save ruined in NWN2 as well, and never ended up finishing the game as a result.

 

[Infinitron]

Some of the comments in the story are the usual hilarious stuff:

Exactly. That is completely what caused the lower score. It is an excellent game, but it was close to a year on some platforms before it was actually playable. That is not going to get you a good score. And for anyone bitching about the deal: Obsidian AGREED to it. Bethesda didn't force them at gunpoint into it. Their arrogance and inability to deliver a functioning product on time (or anywhere close to it), caused them to lose the bonus. Nothing else. Personally I hate to see them go. I loved KOTOR II, New Vegas, and Dungeon Siege III.

Like Fallout 3 didn't have bugs, but of course these people are incapable of thinking for themselves. The reviewers had to find problems to give sub-85 scores and they blamed Obsidian for Bethesda problems. Therefore, according to the fans, it's Obsidian's problem!

I bought Fallout 3. I also bought Fallout NV collectors' edition. I've put hundreds of hours in both of them. Fallout 3 did not come with a bug that overwrote recent saves right out the gate. The problem with NV wasn't that "it had bugs", it's that the bugs were noticeable, interfered with the game considerably, and in the case of the save killing one, inexcusable. This isn't the first time Obshitian pulled this either, I had my save ruined in NWN2 as well, and never ended up finishing the game as a result.

Inexcusable for Bethesda's QA.

 

[.Pixote.]

Developers never want to release a game with bugs, but the publishers are willing to - if they think they can meet some mysterious date that will ensure they sell an extra 1/2 a million units before the crowd catches on. Obsidian were caught between a rock and a hard place, F:NV brought in the money and kept people employed, but the tight deadline and ambitious build meant things were guaranteed to get sticky - not that Bethesda have a fuck.

As for corruption in gaming, its a sure thing, as it is in the banking industry, construction industry, policing industry, retail industry, religious industry, shall I go on...where there's money, there's dirt.

 

[dextermorgan]

Inexcusable for Bethesda's QA.

Heh

Also, Mastermind gonna Mastermind.

 

[Morkar Left]

Thank you Menckenstein and saint_proverbius for good solid links, they do indeed show cold hard facts, and I can't deny them.

Reviews? Fuck, this is the age of Youtube. You can just go watch a video of somebody playing the first N hours of the game. Doesn't get any better than that.

qft, I find myself mostly doing this these days.

Luibl - atari incident:
kotaku
german interview with him about publishers

The chat with the Joker-Verlag owner is gone, at least I couldn't find it. There is only a shortened excerpt of it available now.

 

[thesoup]

I used to write for an ambitious and the most popular gaming site in the region (not in English, ofc). Our editor forbade us to give scores to hits that deviated too much from their metacritic ranking, else all the retarded 15 year olds would stop reading and no hits = no ad revenue = no free stuff from publishers. I'm pretty sure it's even worse at bigger sites with even more traffic.

 

[Average Manatee]

Keep in mind that for every reviewer that comes out there are 100 others that have a mortgage to pay. Make too big of a stir and not only will you lose your job, no one else will hire you because both they and the publishers won't approve. Turns out that ex-game reviewers don't have many professional prospects outside of the fast food industry. Jeff Gerstmann was lucky enough that he got fired in such a flamboyantly media-covered fashion that he could use that short second of fame to jumpstart his own site.

 

[Infinitron]

Keep in mind that for every reviewer that comes out there are 100 others that have a mortgage to pay. Make too big of a stir and not only will you lose your job, no one else will hire you because both they and the publishers won't approve. Turns out that ex-game reviewers don't have many professional prospects outside of the fast food industry. Jeff Gerstmann was lucky enough that he got fired in such a flamboyantly media-covered fashion that he could use that short second of fame to jumpstart his own site.

Well, if you're good enough, I imagine Jeff Gerstmann could hire you.

 

[Mastermind]

Inexcusable for Bethesda's QA.

Was Bethesda's QA involved with NWN2 as well? Obshitian is renowned for its technical incompetence and it would appear it is finally going to bury them once and for all, at which point the codex rabble will blame "consoletards", "Bethesduh", "gaming journalism" and just about everybody else except the people who actually fucked up, just like they did with Troika.

 

[Infinitron]

Inexcusable for Bethesda's QA.

Was Bethesda's QA involved with NWN2 as well? Obshitian is renowned for its technical incompetence and it would appear it is finally going to bury them once and for all, at which point the codex rabble will blame "consoletards", "Bethesduh", "gaming journalism" and just about everybody else except the people who actually fucked up, just like they did with Troika.

2/10

 

[Mastermind]

 

[Roguey]

Inexcusable for Bethesda's QA.

Was Bethesda's QA involved with NWN2 as well? Obshitian is renowned for its technical incompetence and it would appear it is finally going to bury them once and for all, at which point the codex rabble will blame "consoletards", "Bethesduh", "gaming journalism" and just about everybody else except the people who actually fucked up, just like they did with Troika.

But their last one was technically competent??? I also believe South Park's going to be solid bugwise, considering it's going to be a jrpg with factions on their own engine. Also "not being fun" is a far greater problem than bugs, no one gives a fuck about Bethesda's bugs, not even the one that literally makes them unplayable on the PS3 if you play for too long.

 

[Mastermind]

But their last one was technically competent???

DS 3? I stopped playing that because of the shit camera. Running up a tree only being able to see a few feet in front of you and getting drilled from off screen is not my idea of fun. I don't remember if it had any technical problems, but I also haven't played it long enough to judge.

I also believe South Park's going to be solid bugwise, considering it's going to be a jrpg with factions on their own engine.

Maybe. Have no interest in the subject so I won't be playing it.

Also "not being fun" is a far greater problem than bugs, no one gives a fuck about Bethesda's bugs, not even the one that literally makes them unplayable on the PS3 if you play for too long.

The game was fun enough for an 85+ though, the bugs is what did them in, since they can ruin an otherwise good game.

 

[Average Manatee]

Never had bugs with any Obsidian game other than AP's ability to remove enemies upon reloading a save (which is more of a shitty feature anyway). That said, never had much of a problem with Bethesda games either.

 

[Roguey]

The game was fun enough for an 85+ though, the bugs is what did them in, since they can ruin an otherwise good game.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/the-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim/critic-reviews
Only one slightly negative review that mentions it doesn't work once you play long enough.

 

[Mastermind]

The game was fun enough for an 85+ though, the bugs is what did them in, since they can ruin an otherwise good game.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/the-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim/critic-reviews
Only one slightly negative review that mentions it doesn't work once you play long enough.

NV doesn't either.

 

[Roguey]

I know, it's a memory thing. But it's ridiculous that you have things like
PlayStation LifeStyle
Oct 24, 2010
70
In spite of Fallout: New Vegas being plagued with bugs, it still manages to take what is familiar and make it work. Sadly, I'm still not sure if putting in the hours is worth the effort just yet because of the random crashing that occurs, and that can really break your patience if you forgot to make that last important save file.
PlayStation LifeStyle
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The gamer in everyone will launch Skyrim in their PS3 and sit in awe at the masterpiece Bethesda Game Studios has created.
TotalPlayStation
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It hurts to not score this higher, especially considering the incredible writing and epic amount of well-varied quests, but the rampant bugs and gameplay that is getting stale really drag this down.
TotalPlayStation
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90
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Playstation Universe
Oct 25, 2010
80
Fallout: New Vegas needed more time in the oven to work out all the kinks and bugs, but it is still a terrific experience for anyone interested in re-experiencing one of the greatest action-RPG series of our time.
Playstation Universe
Nov 10, 2011
95
Skyrim is not perfect, but the flaws don't keep it from being an excellent game. If you measure enjoyment on sure obsession and addiction, Skyrim is easily one of the greatest games of the generation, perhaps of all time. Open-world RPG fans have every reason to be excited; Bethesda truly delivered an extraordinary game.

 

[Infinitron]