DX:HR - Worth a replay?

[sea]

There's definitely a lot of truth to this but I also think the fact that us DX players are now older and savvier makes us hyper-aware of these things. As Sacculina said, the original game has segments with obvious "routes" too, but we didn't notice them as much back then.

True, but consider stuff like the NSF warehouse in New York, where you have 5+ routes all with strength sand weaknesses, but none that explicitly owe themselves to certain playstyles. On a micro level sometimes there are obvious "stealth path" solutions etc. but they're not placed within a larger obvious "stealth path."

Same applies to augmentations. In the original game there were ones that were more predisposed to certain gameplay styles, but a lot of them were just generally useful for everyone. Run Silent wasn't something that was exclusively useful for stealthy players, same for the enhanced vision augs, spy drone, etc. Human Revolution's are much more focused on promoting playstyle archetypes rather than just being useful tools that could apply anywhere - it's just two options, stealth or loud.

 

[DraQ]

It doesn't. There are also those funny black boxes that do all kinds of arbitrary stuff.

I'm sorry, I don't know what this refers to. Please explain.

Then why bring up ghosting as a measure in the first place?

Good question - why start whining that the game is too easy to ghost?

Except Ford rescue mission is almost completely linear crawl which also happens to not include any features that aren't available in DX:HR apart from large swimmable pool of toxic sewage that is of no gameplay consequence.

Whatever it demonstrates it demonstrates poorly.

Please refer to my previous post in which I dispatched all enemies without being detected by using leaking barrels. What this seems to demonstrate is your lack of creativity in finding possible ways to play the game.

Sorry to burst your bubble but figuring out that barrels leaking toxic gas can be weaponized doesn't require much creativity. DX1 AI is also easier to direct around using distractions so there is no challenge to ghosting DX1 if you have minicrossbow. In HR NPCs at least got alerted while being distracted and started looking around.

Not to mention that breakable gas bottles are dime a dozen in HR.

Excuse me? You admitted that the MJ12 lab in the sewers was nigh-impossible to ghost.

With or without cheesing?

I merely stated that lab in sewers was essentially a corridor. If anything you should rag upon it for not giving the player much wiggle room as is otherwise customary in DX.

DX:HR analogue exists and it's upper TYM building after data core room.

So well-secured that it's almost as if the enemies were trying to be competent or something.

So very competent.

Yet it's ghosting DX:HR that is supposedly a joke.

But here's another example: The base of the statue on Liberty Island. The security set-up isn't bad, especially with a guard watching the prison door. And yet the rescue is ghostable without exploits. It's more challenging, yes, but that's only right and proper.

Yeah, but LI is one of my praised massive indoor+outdoor levels where you can dick around.

And ghosting LI isn't terribly difficult, about the only tight moment is two guards before NSF commander.

Read the post again. If you had actually paid attention to what I had written, you would have noticed that using the furniture alone added to the gameplay. Even moving the chair causes a difference in that situation. Or would you consider it less fun if something that added gameplay broke your immershun?

I would consider a game where AI is smart enough to not blissfully ignoring furniture bursting into pieces around them more interesting than one where it's not.

Okay, I'll break it down for you. In DX1, using speed running to kill people by falling on them involves creativity and using your brian. Using the Icarus landing system just follows the designers' intended purpose as described in the game.

Yet, the mechanical effect is similar.

Yeah, yeah, I get it - U1 engine was totally awesome in that it allowed falling massive objects of any type (even pawns) damage pawns, but when it comes to creativity I enjoyed bypassing laser tripwires with pepperspray more (warning, sometimes will trigger them instead!) in DX1.

True, but consider stuff like the NSF warehouse in New York, where you have 5+ routes all with strength sand weaknesses, but none that explicitly owe themselves to certain playstyles. On a micro level sometimes there are obvious "stealth path" solutions etc. but they're not placed within a larger obvious "stealth path."

True, levels are generally better designed in DX1 (engine, man), but I can counter with Derelict Row - also a pretty complex and non-linear location.

And DX1 had it's own fair share of cheesy HSV routes.

Also, damaged walls can be destroyed with any source of damage (including repeatedly throwing heavy stuff at them), but they are damage sponges and will take quite a few hits from ordinary guns. Explosives work much better, even expvolver takes them out in about two shots.

Lack of aug makes them easy to miss, though.

Run Silent wasn't something that was exclusively useful for stealthy players

Primarily because run silent wasn't something that was useful period. Exclusively or otherwise - why use run silent when the alternative allows you to run fast, jump high AND crawl as fast as you'd normally run?

same for the enhanced vision augs, spy drone, etc. Human Revolution's are much more focused on promoting playstyle archetypes rather than just being useful tools that could apply anywhere - it's just two options, stealth or loud.

Bullshit.

Enhanced vision - similar utility in HR as in DX1

Icarus - can be used to both make dynamic entries and simply exploiting unusual routes to better facilitate stealth

Heavy lifting - can be used to both throw stuff at people or arrange cover and to arrange box staircases near back entrances, or move heavy stuff blocking your way

EMP and gas shielding - can be used both in combat and when dealing with environmental hazards, also both are useful unlike DX1 versions

high jumping - can facilitate both stealth entry and combat mobility,

Double takedown - both stealth and thinning out anyone coming close

Hacking - information and both shutting down security, opening stuff and turning the automated defenses on the enemy.

Ballistic shielding - same as DX.

Silent running - same as DX, but doesn't compete with more useful augs

Typhoon - exclusively combat, but same can be said of DX1 aggressive defence

Aim assist - similar as in DX1, although DX1 aug had more functionality

Cloak - same as in DX1.

what.

 

[Gord]

Man DraQ, severe case of "stop disliking what I like"?

Personally I found DX:HR to be a pretty good game, but not perfect (but what is?).
While I somehow still consider the original the better game DX:HR was a very welcome anomaly in modern gaming and certainly fun to play for me.

But yeah, both games have cheesy moments, exploits, bad design decisions, you name it. Still fun games.

 

[sea]

Bullshit.

Enhanced vision - similar utility in HR as in DX1

Icarus - can be used to both make dynamic entries and simply exploiting unusual routes to better facilitate stealth

Heavy lifting - can be used to both throw stuff at people or arrange cover and to arrange box staircases near back entrances, or move heavy stuff blocking your way

EMP and gas shielding - can be used both in combat and when dealing with environmental hazards, also both are useful unlike DX1 versions

high jumping - can facilitate both stealth entry and combat mobility,

Double takedown - both stealth and thinning out anyone coming close

Hacking - information and both shutting down security, opening stuff and turning the automated defenses on the enemy.

Ballistic shielding - same as DX.

Silent running - same as DX, but doesn't compete with more useful augs

Typhoon - exclusively combat, but same can be said of DX1 aggressive defence

Aim assist - similar as in DX1, although DX1 aug had more functionality

Cloak - same as in DX1.

I'm not sure I agree. Let's go down the Deus Ex list. Note that I'm only concerned about the *theoretical* applications of these skills, not whether or not the level design actually makes them useful.

• Speed Enhancement - Brokenly good, value both to stealth (new routes, can dodge guards more easily) and combat (new tactics, mobility).
• Run Silent - Not as good obviously, but still very effective for stealth players and can work to set up ambushes, run up behind enemies and smack them up, etc.
• Microfibral Muscle - Opens up new routes and can stack objects for combat purposes, can also throw heavy objects to kill enemies
• Combat Strength - significantly enhanced melee damage in combat, can also be used to get more loot or bypass locks (destroying doors, containers etc.)
• Environmental Resistance - Useful against certain types of enemies as well as environmental hazards later in the game
• Energy Shield - Not very good, but in theory it's also a good option for the same reasons as Environmental Resistance
• Aqualung - excellent for exploration and finding extra loot - there are many secrets hidden underwater throughout the game, including augmentation upgrades, therefore it can nearly pay for itself. Provides additional entry points into levels, useful both for stealth and combat approaches.
• Regeneration - Duh. Truth be told this should have been an upgrade in Human Revolution, not the default, but in any case this is good for everyone in the original game.
• Synthetic Heart - Really cool idea made completely useless in the sequel. Lets you operate above normal capacity for increased cost, also allows more effective combinations of augmentation for players who like to use lots at once.
• Power Recirculator - Useful for all characters. Get more life out of your augmentations.
• Cloak - Useful both for combat and non-combat approaches, much more so than in the sequel due to longer duration.
• Radar Transparency - Same as above, but you have to make a trade-off whether you want to be invisible to humans or robots (early vs. late game consideration).
• Ballistic Protection - Useful for any characters, especially on higher difficulties and if you're not a fan of abusing quickload.
• EMP Shield - Okay, useless, but theoretically important to anyone both during exploration (mines) and combat (EMP attacks).
• Vision Enhancement - Not as useful as it sounds, but can still be very handy for scouting out locations in advance (both stealth and combat).
• Targeting - Useful for anyone because stealth players rely on accuracy unless they are trying to ghost the game. Can also free up skill points by situationally improving weapon performance.
• Aggressive Defence System - While not entirely relevant to stealth players, can theoretically provide an interesting indirect combat path against enemies that use explosives (mostly relevant to late game).
• Spy Drone - Crap, yes, but theoretically makes a great scouter and can disable robots without directly exposing yourself, effectively exchanging specialized ammo for energy.

As you can see, in theory the vast majority of those fit into any play-style. Whether you want to do stealth, force or something in-between, all of those can be very effective in the right hands. Again, real-game situations change that because some augmentations are just useless, but speaking in terms of options available, all augmentations are attractive choices regardless of how you want to play.

Now, let's talk about Human Revolution augmentations:

• Social Enhancer - Conversations are important for just about anyone, though in-game they are kind of irrelevant other than for storyfag reasons since there are always alternatives open, and you don't need the social enhancer to ace conversations.
• Stealth Enhancer - i.e. the "Splinter Cell tree", basically worthless for anyone interested in combat. Even with stealth players this is a very tough sell unless you really want the (nearly useless) UI extras.
• Hacking: Capture - Useful for everyone because hacking is a huge XP farm and for storyfag reasons.
• Hacking: Analyze - Theoretically useful for everyone, in-game completely worthless.
• Hacking: Fortify - Same as above.
• Hacking: Stealth - Useful if you want to hack.
• Energy Converter - Useful for stealthy players, not so much for combat players unless you want to abuse the Typhoon.
• Implanted Rebreather - Useful for everyone, can open up new routes in a few parts throughout the game.
• Typhoon Explosive System - Useful for combat-oriented players, not really for stealth players.
• Cybernetic Arm Prosthesis - Very balanced tree that opens up a lot of options both in combat and out of it.
• Aim Stabilizer - Good for combat, useless for stealth because it only really applies to hip firing.
• Smart Vision - Useful for all players in theory, made almost entirely obsolete by radar upgrade.
• Radar System - Useful for everyone, almost brokenly good when upgraded due to providing psychic knowledge of all enemy positions.
• Retinal Prosthesis - Flash Suppressant upgrade is only really relevant to combat players.
• Reflex Booster - Useful for both combat and stealth, though as there is no "true" melee option it is highly geared towards stealthy players. For combat players, it's outclassed by the Typhoon.
• Icarus Landing System - Fully exploration-driven augment, useful for everyone. In practice the stun-attack option is useful at best once or twice in the game due to the small levels and lack of non-exploration-related places to use Icarus.
• Dermal Armor - Only really useful for combat players, except EMP Shielding upgrade which is good for everyone.
• Cloaking System - Stealth-oriented, but can be used for violent players in that it opens new tactical options (though I'd argue in effect it's much less useful than the cloak from the first game for combat roles).
• Cybernetic Leg Prosthesis - Exceptionally useful for everyone. Upgrades are either relevant for combat or stealth depending on selection, but not really both archetypes at least in practice.

As you demonstrated, it's still pretty good... but there are a lot of augmentations that are clearly targeted towards certain types of players to the point where they are almost useless for anyone else. Deus Ex had maybe one or two that weren't useful for anyone (in theory); Human Revolution has several more, and many upgrades are weighted heavily towards archetypes.

One reason Human Revolution also loses out, in my opinion, is because augmentations and skills were blended. In the first game, augmentations were around more or less to provide you with temporary super-powers which could be used more or less however you wanted. Skills, meanwhile, actually defined the way you wanted to play. In the prequel, augmentations define play-style significantly more because there are no skills to counter-balance them.

Another thing to consider is, practically speaking, combat in Human Revolution is generally slower, more lethal, and cover-driven. Even if it had huge open and free levels with tons of tactical choices, I think mobility options especially aren't anywhere near as useful. Similarly, the lack of true melee combat (or melee's utility value in the game world) simplifies decision-making when it comes to character-building, because whereas in the first game, melee was a legitimate play-style with a lot of perks (who needs lockpicks when you can just smash doors down?), in Human Revolution it's more an embellishment, and any exploration-related elements are attached to other augmentations entirely (such as punching through walls).

 

[Sacculina]

It doesn't. There are also those funny black boxes that do all kinds of arbitrary stuff.

I'm sorry, I don't know what this refers to. Please explain.

/snip

I'll concede this because I can't be arsed to reinstall the game to verify whether there is a similar level of functionality.

Good question - why start whining that the game is too easy to ghost?

Go back and review the thread. You brought up the ghosting, not I. I pointed out that it was not a fair measure considering the level design in both games.

Sorry to burst your bubble but figuring out that barrels leaking toxic gas can be weaponized doesn't require much creativity. DX1 AI is also easier to direct around using distractions so there is no challenge to ghosting DX1 if you have minicrossbow. In HR NPCs at least got alerted while being distracted and started looking around.

All I can take from your responses is that it's easier to ghost in DX1 than DX:HR, except when it's not. I'd be foolish to claim some elements in DX:HR (superior AI and cameras) don't lend themselves to a more interesting stealth experience than DX1 can offer in theory. In effect, however, as the level design is clearly designed to allow easy ghosting just about everywhere (aside from the stupid boss battles, of course), stealth is rarely challenging. The only part I remember as being particularly difficult to ghost is the aftermath of the first Zhao meeting. Players whose eyes and brians are atrophied due to modern gaming and are incapable of finding the obvious stealth paths can turn on the cover prompts and the item highlighting. Edit: They could also make use of the always-on radar.

Not to mention that breakable gas bottles are dime a dozen in HR.

You still don't seem to get it. Destroying barrels alerts enemies and releases gas that dissipates. Slightly damaged barrel means continuously leaking gas, which can hurt enemies without alerting them. Enemies who take too much damage try to sound an alarm. To prevent that, I barricaded the exits with those barrels, thus also ensuring that they don't leave the area of effect of the leaking gas. If this use of two simple elements to accomplish an objective is not sufficiently impressive for you, I would welcome an example from DX:HR that displays a similar degree of creativity.

Excuse me? You admitted that the MJ12 lab in the sewers was nigh-impossible to ghost.

With or without cheesing?

I merely stated that lab in sewers was essentially a corridor. If anything you should rag upon it for not giving the player much wiggle room as is otherwise customary in DX.

It seems that you're castigating DX1 for not having an alternate route as DX:HR would have. Alternative routes are not an essential requirement for playing DX1 in different ways. Please read the posts following the one you quoted from.

DX:HR analogue exists and it's upper TYM building after data core room.

I don't remember that as being particularly challenging, unless you're referring to the aftermath of the first Zhao meeting. Which in DX1 would have been the aftermath of the Zhao killing (see Maggie Chow). And no, it's not nigh-impossible to ghost. With or without cheesing.

So well-secured that it's almost as if the enemies were trying to be competent or something.

/Youtube snip

Are you training for the Missing-the-Point Olympics? You're quite good at it.

Read the post again. If you had actually paid attention to what I had written, you would have noticed that using the furniture alone added to the gameplay. Even moving the chair causes a difference in that situation. Or would you consider it less fun if something that added gameplay broke your immershun?

I would consider a game where AI is smart enough to not blissfully ignoring furniture bursting into pieces around them more interesting than one where it's not.

Yeah, let's continue not focusing on how one minor element can have an impact on gameplay that the developer had probably not anticipated, and which does not break the game. If you want to see the game really broken, I highly recommend this excellent site: http://it-he.org/deus3.htm. If you're so offended by AI not raising the alarm at disintegrating furniture (edit: they do notice it, by the way; they just don't automatically assume that the player is the cause), you can steal the chair instead and dump it in the area at the far end of the vent, thus framing the escaped greasel there for all your misdeeds. That should satisfy your inner larper.

 

[Sacculina]

Actually, that gives me an idea for my next playthrough:

JC Denton, Redistributor of Wealth (and furniture and potted plants)

It shall be involve prodigious poltergeisting and will conclude with the hidden ending. For when JC the Redistributor rejects the rule of God (Helios ending), of kings (Illuminati ending) and men (collapse ending),...

Spoiler

...the Party shall rule.

 

[toro]

This thread exemplify autistic communication.

Best anti HR post I've seen on the Codex. This is how you make a point without seeming butthurt

...

 

[bminorkey]

Was Deus Ex replayable? IIRC it was mostly a very clever illusion of plot branching and choice. But still just an illusion. I guess the levels are replayable gameplay-wise.

 

[Malakal]

I am playing this game for the first time right now - I bought a new PC and its good enough to run it flawlessly. But I wont replay it EVER. Not because the game sucks or anything like that, because loading times are killing me.

I waste too much time looking at loading screens, playing on the highest difficulty level doesnt help, especially with boss fights.

 

[Infinitron]

I am playing this game for the first time right now - I bought a new PC and its good enough to run it flawlessly. But I wont replay it EVER. Not because the game sucks or anything like that, because loading times are killing me.

I waste too much time looking at loading screens, playing on the highest difficulty level doesnt help, especially with boss fights.

The loading times are not so bad, something's wrong with your box or your installation

I guess the levels are replayable gameplay-wise.

That's what we're talking about.

 

[Forest Dweller]

And playstyles based on different skills and augmentations and the weapons you choose to carry.

 

[Yoshiyyahu]

I had the game on my SSD and the loading times were still terrible (well, not THAT bad compared to other games, but the SSD didnt make any difference at all rofl)

 

[Gord]

Strange that you should have problems with load times.
There aren't that many interruptions due to loading and they have usually been over in a few seconds for me (10-20 max).
And I'm not using an SSD either.

 

[Kaol]

Only issue i had with waiting was the fucking intro that went on forever and had no interaction.

 

[Yoshiyyahu]

Im exaggerating, they aren't bad compared to other new games. I guess I was just expecting too much of the SSD. It did work very well with VtM:B though, since I have a habit of spamming quicksave which made saving/loading really slow when i had stacked heaps of save files. You're right, the only loading times I really get are moving between areas or reloading saves, which I'm doing alot of because I'm trying to maximise XP

 

[Raghar]

Not because the game sucks or anything like that, because loading times are killing me.

Use patch. They decoupled loading from loading animation a while ago. (Or did they disabled loading animation and used the spare time for loading...)
On my computer it was fast even with original version. It was under 30 s.

I waste too much time looking at loading screens, playing on the highest difficulty level doesnt help, especially with boss fights.

Why did you use highest difficulty? Your choice, enjoy it. In second playtrought you know all convenient ducts, and you know what augumentations you must activate first.

 

[Yoshiyyahu]

30 seconds? mine never took that long, maybe between 5-10

 

[DraQ]

I'm not sure I agree. Let's go down the Deus Ex list. Note that I'm only concerned about the *theoretical* applications of these skills, not whether or not the level design actually makes them useful.

• Speed Enhancement - Brokenly good, value both to stealth (new routes, can dodge guards more easily) and combat (new tactics, mobility).
• Run Silent - Not as good obviously, but still very effective for stealth players and can work to set up ambushes, run up behind enemies and smack them up, etc.
• Microfibral Muscle - Opens up new routes and can stack objects for combat purposes, can also throw heavy objects to kill enemies
• Combat Strength - significantly enhanced melee damage in combat, can also be used to get more loot or bypass locks (destroying doors, containers etc.)
• Environmental Resistance - Useful against certain types of enemies as well as environmental hazards later in the game
• Energy Shield - Not very good, but in theory it's also a good option for the same reasons as Environmental Resistance
• Aqualung - excellent for exploration and finding extra loot - there are many secrets hidden underwater throughout the game, including augmentation upgrades, therefore it can nearly pay for itself. Provides additional entry points into levels, useful both for stealth and combat approaches.
• Regeneration - Duh. Truth be told this should have been an upgrade in Human Revolution, not the default, but in any case this is good for everyone in the original game.
• Synthetic Heart - Really cool idea made completely useless in the sequel. Lets you operate above normal capacity for increased cost, also allows more effective combinations of augmentation for players who like to use lots at once.
• Power Recirculator - Useful for all characters. Get more life out of your augmentations.
• Cloak - Useful both for combat and non-combat approaches, much more so than in the sequel due to longer duration.
• Radar Transparency - Same as above, but you have to make a trade-off whether you want to be invisible to humans or robots (early vs. late game consideration).
• Ballistic Protection - Useful for any characters, especially on higher difficulties and if you're not a fan of abusing quickload.
• EMP Shield - Okay, useless, but theoretically important to anyone both during exploration (mines) and combat (EMP attacks).
• Vision Enhancement - Not as useful as it sounds, but can still be very handy for scouting out locations in advance (both stealth and combat).
• Targeting - Useful for anyone because stealth players rely on accuracy unless they are trying to ghost the game. Can also free up skill points by situationally improving weapon performance.
• Aggressive Defence System - While not entirely relevant to stealth players, can theoretically provide an interesting indirect combat path against enemies that use explosives (mostly relevant to late game).
• Spy Drone - Crap, yes, but theoretically makes a great scouter and can disable robots without directly exposing yourself, effectively exchanging specialized ammo for energy.

As you can see, in theory the vast majority of those fit into any play-style. Whether you want to do stealth, force or something in-between, all of those can be very effective in the right hands. Again, real-game situations change that because some augmentations are just useless, but speaking in terms of options available, all augmentations are attractive choices regardless of how you want to play.

Now, let's talk about Human Revolution augmentations:

• Social Enhancer - Conversations are important for just about anyone, though in-game they are kind of irrelevant other than for storyfag reasons since there are always alternatives open, and you don't need the social enhancer to ace conversations.
• Stealth Enhancer - i.e. the "Splinter Cell tree", basically worthless for anyone interested in combat. Even with stealth players this is a very tough sell unless you really want the (nearly useless) UI extras.
• Hacking: Capture - Useful for everyone because hacking is a huge XP farm and for storyfag reasons.
• Hacking: Analyze - Theoretically useful for everyone, in-game completely worthless.
• Hacking: Fortify - Same as above.
• Hacking: Stealth - Useful if you want to hack.
• Energy Converter - Useful for stealthy players, not so much for combat players unless you want to abuse the Typhoon.
• Implanted Rebreather - Useful for everyone, can open up new routes in a few parts throughout the game.
• Typhoon Explosive System - Useful for combat-oriented players, not really for stealth players.
• Cybernetic Arm Prosthesis - Very balanced tree that opens up a lot of options both in combat and out of it.
• Aim Stabilizer - Good for combat, useless for stealth because it only really applies to hip firing.
• Smart Vision - Useful for all players in theory, made almost entirely obsolete by radar upgrade.
• Radar System - Useful for everyone, almost brokenly good when upgraded due to providing psychic knowledge of all enemy positions.
• Retinal Prosthesis - Flash Suppressant upgrade is only really relevant to combat players.
• Reflex Booster - Useful for both combat and stealth, though as there is no "true" melee option it is highly geared towards stealthy players. For combat players, it's outclassed by the Typhoon.
• Icarus Landing System - Fully exploration-driven augment, useful for everyone. In practice the stun-attack option is useful at best once or twice in the game due to the small levels and lack of non-exploration-related places to use Icarus.
• Dermal Armor - Only really useful for combat players, except EMP Shielding upgrade which is good for everyone.
• Cloaking System - Stealth-oriented, but can be used for violent players in that it opens new tactical options (though I'd argue in effect it's much less useful than the cloak from the first game for combat roles).
• Cybernetic Leg Prosthesis - Exceptionally useful for everyone. Upgrades are either relevant for combat or stealth depending on selection, but not really both archetypes at least in practice.

As you demonstrated, it's still pretty good... but there are a lot of augmentations that are clearly targeted towards certain types of players to the point where they are almost useless for anyone else. Deus Ex had maybe one or two that weren't useful for anyone (in theory); Human Revolution has several more, and many upgrades are weighted heavily towards archetypes.

One reason Human Revolution also loses out, in my opinion, is because augmentations and skills were blended. In the first game, augmentations were around more or less to provide you with temporary super-powers which could be used more or less however you wanted. Skills, meanwhile, actually defined the way you wanted to play. In the prequel, augmentations define play-style significantly more because there are no skills to counter-balance them.

Another thing to consider is, practically speaking, combat in Human Revolution is generally slower, more lethal, and cover-driven. Even if it had huge open and free levels with tons of tactical choices, I think mobility options especially aren't anywhere near as useful. Similarly, the lack of true melee combat (or melee's utility value in the game world) simplifies decision-making when it comes to character-building, because whereas in the first game, melee was a legitimate play-style with a lot of perks (who needs lockpicks when you can just smash doors down?), in Human Revolution it's more an embellishment, and any exploration-related elements are attached to other augmentations entirely (such as punching through walls).

1. Wait. How is ballistic protection in DX1 useful to everyone while dermal armour in HR is strictly combat? That's bullshit. In both games armour augs are strictly combat centered, if anything DX:HR makes dermal armour more useful to a stealth specialists because if they get into combat, they will be killed far more easily than in DX1.
Of course, there is separate issue of everyone and their mother picking ballistic protection in DX1 regardless of their playstyle, because EMP shielding was so damn useless, but that hints at issues with DX1 aug system that aren't present in HR, not at DX1 aug being more flexible.

2. EMP protection was not useful during exploration in DX1, because not noticing mines wasn't something a self respecting explorer would do, and outside of combat energy was cheap. It was also useless in combat since very few enemies used EMP attacks and they could be destroyed fairly easily without using augs. Compare DX:HR version which protected against electricity (an important environmental hazard and a potential environmental weapon), and forced aug reboot which could really fuck you up in combat.

3. Run silent is worthless in DX1, because with speed enhancement you can crawl ultra fast in addition to jumping and running at hurricane speed while also reducing fall damage.

4. Cloak in HR was generally an improvement over DX1 alternatives. Again, DX1 pretty much forced one of the stealth augs on you, logic behind separating robotic and organic cloak was flimsy at best and short duration is generally a good thing behind something as powerful as invisibility. Radar transparency was also a letdown due to automated defences being generally more forgiving due to their rigidity, plus they presented no pacifist dilemma. HR cloak is arguably more useful for combat than DX1 one, because you can use it in conjunction with Typhoon or takedowns, though I guess that cloakcharging MJ12 mooks with Dragon Tooth could be powerful too.

5. Synthetic heart was neat, but the implementation was botched due to augs capping off at lvl4. Both it and power recirculator, as well as several additional augs suffered from what I see as DX1 fundamental interface problem - all augs were active and consumed energy, managing them all in real time, using function keys located away from your main controls was a major clusterfuck. HR's reliance on mostly passive augs was an improvement and you still had to manage your resources, for example not using cloak or typhoon in combat in order to conserve energy retain tactical awareness provided by smart vision (especially important when using laser, gatling, homing flechettes or any slow precise weapon you can't afford to waste shots with when you don't have time to aim properly).

6. Aim stabilizer is even more important for stealth than combat because it also prevents weapon sway from fucking up with aiming using sights or scope. Accurate hip firing is best facilitated with laser sight anyway.

7. Aqualung isn't terribly useful in DX1, because you rarely have to spend that long underwater. Then again, neither is environmental protection.

8. Additional function of combat strength is roughly analogous to punch through walls, in both games you can just as well just bust through obstacles with weapon fire.

9. Stealth enhancements are admittedly crap, radar system is theoretically neat, but it's limited in its desirability in that it doesn't do anything, so you won't be getting it early. It would be better if in basic version it was just a minimap, while in advanced version it would work like the basic one in original game plus maybe extra range.

10. Aggressive defence isn't useful for stealth, period. If you're getting shot at you aren't stealthing. Spy drone is mostly useful for at least temporary stealth - you can't use it in the midst of action so it's a scouter, anti-bot cruise missile and remote security disabler.

11. High level hacking fortify might actually be useful, because it's surefire method of increasing track time to beyond what's needed, but stealth is usually preferable, if only because for effective use of fortify it's good to have some nodes captured already.

(reply to Sacculina pending)

 

[sea]

Thanks for your reply, but note that I was talking about theory (i.e. if level design allowed for all possible opportunities to have equal value) vs. in actual practice (i.e. EMP Shielding is useless because you encounter electricity like 2 times in the game).

You're right, I kinda broke my rule when I brought up Ballistic Shielding vs. Dermal Armor - didn't catch that when I was writing it. They're about equally useful in both games.

One thing regarding Aggressive Defense Drone - my suggestion was that it could be used for an indirect combat option to take out certain enemies (i.e. their own missiles and grenades blowing up in their faces) and not strictly as something for someone who wants to ghost. The closest thing Human Revolution has is the Typhoon, I guess.

A reason I don't really like passive augmentations is that they tend to break down the wall between skills and augs further. I liked, verisimilitude-wise, the way that augs drained energy when activated because it created a strong distinction between what were basically superpowers and your own skills. It cheapens them a bit too much for my liking and makes what should be extraordinary (I can recover from all damage in seconds! I can jump 20 feet in the air!) to something that feels a bit more routine and, for lack of a better term, normal. Speaking conceptually, the energy requirement for everything gives a sense of consequence to using those abilities that Human Revolution usually lacks.