CKII is released.

[Commissar Draco]

Hernan Cortez doesn't conqured Mexico based from Spain but from Cuba and he had 150 Spaniards with him at the start, even with absorbed penal expedition from Velasquez, 600 hundred men with steel blades, horses and guns would not win this war without massive local aid. 100 000 stack of doom landing on the coast? laughable Paradox wants to be edgy and show some serious invading? Make game about the rise of Islam or VI century Roman-Persian wars.

 

[Fens]

...took a while but now i know what this dlc reminded me of: Kings of the Sun
(mayan exiles land in north america, start building a new city, get into trouble with natives and finally join up with them against the evil maya usurper who followed them across the sea)

actually... i think it would have been a lot better if that was the scope, instead of crossing the atlantic... but that would've meant an expanded or extra map

 

[sser]

I'd say the main problem with the Mongorians was that either they never got enough momentum (this was the case in CK1, where Mongorians show up and are promptly roflstomped), or they would have nigh-undefeatable doomstack armies for the rest of the game (how things were in CK2 the last time I played a campaign up to Mongorians arriving).

Well, to be fair, the Mongolians kinda were real-life doomstacks. The only reason they bailed in the first place was because their leadership went AFK thousands of miles away.

 

[mondblut]

Well, to be fair, the Mongolians kinda were real-life doomstacks.

They weren't. Absolute majority of troops they advanced into Rus and beyond with were conscripted from their previous conquests: namely, Turkestan and Desht-i-Kipchak. There were hardly 20-30k "true" mongols in those armies. And since they begin with actually arriving on the edge of Turkestan rather than spawning right outside Kiev, how about honestly recruiting their horde from the local subjugated populace, just like IRL, as everyone else has to do?

Not to mention the retarded no attrition cheat. If they had no attrition, they wouldn't have a single reason to expand in the first place. Really, aliens or nazis from future make way more sense than those majickal invashuns.

 

[Sranchammer]

Aztecs developed a vaccine for smallpox too. Impressive!

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I'd say the attrition cheat with the Mongols becomes problematic when it DOESN'T GO AWAY. I'd say it should be there for ~10 years (or whatever the average is for them to be almost through conquering their way past the Urals), and then they should have to conform to normal rules.

 

[ironyuri]

Aztecs developed a vaccine for smallpox too. Impressive!

No, they brought their own diseases and are infecting the Europeans and killing them off with straw blankets.

 

[newcomer]

I'd say the attrition cheat with the Mongols becomes problematic when it DOESN'T GO AWAY. I'd say it should be there for ~10 years (or whatever the average is for them to be almost through conquering their way past the Urals), and then they should have to conform to normal rules.

I'd say rather than a time limit, we can implement something like a realm size limit (~80 counties), and then an event fires which saps around half of the doomstack . Then if the Mongols are losing foothold / fails to gain enough of them, we'll grant them additional doomstacks (and call them back once the Mongols regain their lost holdings). We'll pamper them like that for at least 40 years, then another event (regardless of their foothold) fires which saps their doomstack completely

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I'd say the attrition cheat with the Mongols becomes problematic when it DOESN'T GO AWAY. I'd say it should be there for ~10 years (or whatever the average is for them to be almost through conquering their way past the Urals), and then they should have to conform to normal rules.

I'd say rather than a time limit, we can implement something like a realm size limit (~80 counties), and then an event fires which saps around half of the doomstack . Then if the Mongols are losing foothold / fails to gain enough of them, we'll grant them additional doomstacks (and call them back once the Mongols regain their lost holdings). We'll pamper them like that for at least 40 years, then another event (regardless of their foothold) fires which saps their doomstack completely

Can be done. Once I get around to updating my mod, I'll be sure to look up the attrition cheat and then apply certain limiters to it.

 

[newcomer]

Can be done. Once I get around to updating my mod, I'll be sure to look up the attrition cheat and then apply certain limiters to it.

Oh, and regarding that ridiculous independence / crown law hellstack, I suggest that the amount of soldiers is not reduced, but they're split among all revolters. And put a certain limiter if the amount (and size) of revolters is too small, say only 10 minor counts or less (but if it's 10 vassal kings it's alright if they get 50k stack each)

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Can be done. Once I get around to updating my mod, I'll be sure to look up the attrition cheat and then apply certain limiters to it.

Oh, and regarding that ridiculous independence / crown law hellstack, I suggest that the amount of soldiers is not reduced, but they're split among all revolters. And put a certain limiter if the amount (and size) of revolters is too small, say only 10 minor counts or less (but if it's 10 vassal kings it's alright if they get 50k stack each)

I'll have to get around trying out that mechanic before making any judgments about it. Since previously revolts were mostly just pathetic.

 

[JarlFrank]

Not to mention the retarded no attrition cheat. If they had no attrition, they wouldn't have a single reason to expand in the first place.

They did. Genghis wanted to conquer the entire world and show everyone how powerful his Mongols are. That's reason enough.

 

[newcomer]

I'll have to get around trying out that mechanic before making any judgments about it. Since previously revolts were mostly just pathetic.

In the forum there are pics of a 200k stack generated from a small count / duke revolter like Cyprus, and same like the mongols / dedacence revolters they do not suffer attrition. Problem with this is that... well, successfully defending a revolt as a gigantic realm is impossible (the doomstack is scaled according to the total levy of the liege, so if I can summon 100k soldier all across my realm, most likely the independence revolter will get a 90k no-attrition doomstack spawning on the capital of revolt leader. If I have 1m soldier... well... a 900k no-attrition doomstack?)

And I myself have never witness this, because I took great measures to ensure such revolts never happen in the first place

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I'll have to get around trying out that mechanic before making any judgments about it. Since previously revolts were mostly just pathetic.

In the forum there are pics of a 200k stack generated from a small count / duke revolter like Cyprus, and same like the mongols / dedacence revolters they do not suffer attrition. Problem with this is that... well, successfully defending a revolt as a gigantic realm is impossible (the doomstack is scaled according to the total levy of the liege, so if I can summon 100k soldier all across my realm, most likely the independence revolter will get a 90k no-attrition doomstack spawning on the capital of revolt leader. If I have 1m soldier... well... a 900k no-attrition doomstack?)

And I myself have never witness this, because I took great measures to ensure such revolts never happen in the first place

Well, if it starts pissing me off I'll take a look at it.

 

[sser]

Well, to be fair, the Mongolians kinda were real-life doomstacks.

They weren't. Absolute majority of troops they advanced into Rus and beyond with were conscripted from their previous conquests: namely, Turkestan and Desht-i-Kipchak. There were hardly 20-30k "true" mongols in those armies. And since they begin with actually arriving on the edge of Turkestan rather than spawning right outside Kiev, how about honestly recruiting their horde from the local subjugated populace, just like IRL, as everyone else has to do?

Not to mention the retarded no attrition cheat. If they had no attrition, they wouldn't have a single reason to expand in the first place. Really, aliens or nazis from future make way more sense than those majickal invashuns.

Hahaha.

20-30k "true" Mongolians were enough to destroy the Hungarian and Polish armies in the span of two days, bro.

 

[mondblut]

20-30k "true" Mongolians were enough to destroy the Hungarian and Polish armies in the span of two days, bro.

Your point being?

 

[Whisky]

This is not what I expected for a new DLC.

 

[sser]

20-30k "true" Mongolians were enough to destroy the Hungarian and Polish armies in the span of two days, bro.

Your point being?

Sounds like a doomstack to me. Not to mention fears of the unknown horde had been well spread throughout Europe. Unless you meant something else by doomstack, I dunno.

 

[oscar]

The Mongols also had a respectable amount of defeats and draws though. They should be a big threat yes, but not invincible.

 

[mondblut]

Sounds like a doomstack to me. Not to mention fears of the unknown horde had been well spread throughout Europe. Unless you meant something else by doomstack, I dunno.

I meant the 100 thousand doomstack that doesn't have to eat.

 

[Kattze]

The Mongols also had a respectable amount of defeats and draws though. They should be a big threat yes, but not invincible.

They only had one real defeat at their prime though: Ain Jalut.

 

[Sranchammer]

The Mongols also had a respectable amount of defeats and draws though. They should be a big threat yes, but not invincible.

They only had one real defeat at their prime though: Ain Jalut.

Yet even that battle was against the leftovers of Hulagu's army.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I'd say the real problem is still that the Mongolian doomstacks are permanent. Eventually they should have to conform to the normal rules, this being around the time when they're knocking at the doors of Poland and Hungary. Doomstacks ensure that they conquer everything on their way there. By that point the Mongols will be a terrible threat just with normal rules (a good idea would be to make sure that for the most part subjugated areas stay subjugated, so the Mongol states remain a sort of dangerous Mordor on the Eastern end of the map).

 

[Sranchammer]

The Mongol states remain a sort of dangerous Mordor on the Eastern end of the map).

I smell a great idea for a DLC!

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I wonder if Mongols still get culturally subverted all the time. I saw Mongols turning into Russians TWICE before Sword of Andhaira.

Also, I've started groundwork. First job is grabbing and setting up BLC and building on top of it.