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Final Fantasy 8 is a bad game

kingcomrade

Kingcomrade
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I was re-playing FF6 on an emulator when I summoned Alexander and thought to myself: You know what, the summon animation for this, my favorite FF summon dude, was really cool in FF8. I ought to play that game again. I remembered liking it.

The biggest impediment to enjoyment is loading times. You have to change scenery so much in this game, and so quickly, and with such slow load times that you spend so much time looking at a black screen while the PS hums and chirps. Not to mention that the random battle rate is somewhere around 80%. One of the Guardian Forces has a No Random Battle ability which frankly makes the game much better. Because of level scaling this doesn't really bother me at all.

The game mechanics need to be mentioned. I think the junction system combined with the enemy level-scaling system is possibly the worst system of combat/character mechanics ever. It's ridiculously powergamer-oriented. I discovered that you could refine Curaga (the highest level of cure) from cheap, common Tents and then junction it to the HP state for 3000+ hit points at around level 10. Basically I've not faced a challenge yet as level 17 Squall with 4500+ hit points who does 2-3000+ damage per attack due to strength junctions from refining other high level spells. I can defeat bosses in two or three "rounds." When I switch junctions from one character to another their current HP (around 600, typically) stays the same while their maxHP goes through the roof so I can use the Limit Breaks at effectively normal HP nonstop.

The Magic Draw system is also terrible. You would think that level scaling would eliminate the whole "levelling-up" issue but instead you have to farm magic from enemies in order to junction them to become powerful. I don't like it but you feel like you're being sold short if you don't. The same with the card game, since cards are easy to get in large numbers once you have a few powerful cards to win every match with I've played that silly minigame over and over to refine cards into items and magic.

Then there is the issue of "secrets." Frankly there is no way in the world some of this would be discovered without official guides released. I read stuff on GameFAQs where I think to myself, "Now how in the hell was I supposed to know to do that. Not even a hint was dropped."

The story so far (I don't remember it from when I last played it) has been blah. I think FF8 is the one where Square really decided to be as obnoxious and retarded as possible when it came to characters. I do get a kick out of having the only two characters you can name (Squall and Rinoa) being AssFace and PaStwrt. Gunblades are stupid. I don't know who came up with this idea but I hope they're ashamed of themselves. Of course, most FF games after 5 ought to be fought out with guns, but there's the Japanese for you. On the other hand, one main character does use a submachinegun and looks fairly cool doing it.

The CGI, of course, is great, as are almost all the special effects and animations. I haven't gotten to Alexander yet but most of the summons are cool, however I rarely use them at all since they take forever (a theme in this game) and uber-junctioned AssFace can deal with everything. He doesn't even need healbots.

I'm going to stick with until I get to see the Alexander animation. Grfxhore yes. Then I'll probably quit and try Chrono Cross.

PS wtf is a fatsistochalon?
 

Jasede

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It has a good ending and a nice final boss... also, try getting the secret summon. 5 minute summoning animation ftw! Also, if you view it from a certain perspective, it has an ingenious plot. But you'd have to remember the ending for this. The music also is rather excellent and the game itself quite lengthy. It's actually my favourite FF in terms of combat: The junction system is that overpowered that combat is a breeze. Do what I did: NEVER level up a character; instead, run around with permanent 0% encounters. What else...? Orichalcon is an ancient, mythic metal, rumoured to have been used in Atlantis, if I am not wrong.
 

kingcomrade

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Ah, I did forget to mention the music. I should have. FF8 has the best music of any of the FF games I've played (which excludes FF10 which I didn't play enough to know the music and later. I do remember the Zanarkand piano bit which I thought was really great and I have the mp3 and listen to it). I bought the orchestrated sound track a long time ago and I still listen to it. You can get the mp3s from that Blue Lagoon website on the Freeware sticky (both OST and orchestrated versions) in General Discussion. I really enjoy the classical/whatever-more-appropriate-term bent that they took with this one after the techno of FF7 and the tribal music of FF9 and 10. Didn't I just take an appreciation of music class (i.e. music history)...? Shows you how instructive it was.

Blue Fields, Dance with the Balambfish, Fragments of Memories, and The Oath are the ones I listen to, but the Fithos Lusec whatnot is probably one of the most appropriate "theme" musics of any game I've played. Fishermans' Horizon is one most of you would like, as well.

Orichalcon is an ancient, mythic metal, rumoured to have been used in Atlantis, if I am not wrong.
Ah, thanks that's actually interesting. In the game the fatsistochalons are sand fish things, so Atlantis is probably a good place to look.

Since I'm talking about FF music...how come nobody remembers The Magic House from FF6? It's got to be one of those tracks that gets overshadowed by better music even though it's good in its own right.
 

vazquez595654

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Whenever anyone starts spouting off "good music" from games I have to give it a try. Keep em coming.
 

Volourn

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FF8 is awesome. Anyone who doesn't like this game is stupid. Stupid, stupid, stupid.


"Then there is the issue of "secrets." Frankly there is no way in the world some of this would be discovered without official guides released. I read stuff on GameFAQs where I think to myself, "Now how in the hell was I supposed to know to do that. Not even a hint was dropped."

Boo hoo. You want dumbed down games. FF games - espiically the later ones - are all about nearly impossible to figure out secrets. Dumbass.

I had one major beef with the story, and it's oen that anyone who has played the game should know.

Biggest problem with the gameplay system is the magic draw. Not because it's bad in theory; but because liek you say too much time is wasted just drawing. The card game is fun, and is one of the best mini games ever. If you think it's 'easy'; wait 'til you get to the later versions of it. WOWSERS!!!
 

kingcomrade

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So I was just supposed to happen upon that before the end of the first disc I should've gotten the Minimog card from one of the generic NPCs populating the Garden then played a game where I lost that specific card (that is, played a game where it was my most valuable card) to another NPC then went to a third location and then I would be able to get a new and better card (the benefit being that the card refines to good items, for those of you who are wondering why anyone would do this)? When there is no hint or indication that this would happen, no links between any of the characters involved, etc? That's your idea of compelling gameplay?

The card game is easy. The later versions' rules are easy to take advantage of.
 

Zomg

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I guess it would be stating the obvious that JRPGs are made with the idea that the player will refer to a glossy strategy guide as he plays. I'm always amazed by how high the production values for those books are - they're magazine sized with solid spine binding, with glossy photographs on every page and with piles of tables in the back.

There's a Playstation action JRPG called Star Ocean, which has this elaborate crafting system, where each character can make maybe one hundred out of five hundred possible items, with every little item creatable by at least one of the dozen or so characters. The game has no information at all about any of the crafting, nor is there any way to look at a list of creatable items. It would probably take a few hundred hours of trial and error to determine it all experimentally. You're supposed to have a cheat (spread)sheet.
 

KreideBein

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Volourn said:
The card game is fun, and is one of the best mini games ever. If you think it's 'easy'; wait 'til you get to the later versions of it. WOWSERS!!!

Volourn is right here - the only problems with the card game is that it's pretty easy at the begining and there's no multiplayer for it. Once the plus and same rules get into play, though, the first of those problems dissapears. The AI can get pretty tricky with its plays; you realy have to pay attention in order to win. Square Enix should release a standalone Triple Triad game that can be played over the Internet.
 
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aweigh

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They released an online version with their PlayOnline service, i.e. Final Fantasy 11/Online. You play it through PlayOnline with other subscribers.
 

KreideBein

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I thought that that was just the shitty FF9 card game. Is Triple Triad really online now?
 

Jasede

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Don't be an idiot. Even if you utterly hate jRPGs (and I dislike them for the most part), you should still give FF credit for the /amazing/ music and the artful CGI.
 

Greenskin13

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That sounds about right. The gameplay style of Japanese RPGs rubs me the wrong way, but I'd be lying if I said the mako reactors in FF7 didn't give a wicked image of industrial dystopianism.
 

Major_Blackhart

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Volourn what was your major beef? I remember playing it, and I actually kinda enjoyed it alot. But then again I was a dumbass highschooler so I didn't know much, as it was before I learned of Fallout. Overall, it was still good. My all time favorite is still FF6 tho.
 

Volourn

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The fact many of the characters all came from the same lame orphanage. It seemed way too m uch like an unneeded crutch. Othger than that, i loved the story; but that puts a big damper on it. In fact. from what i've seen when people whine about FF8 the two big complaints ar ethe junction system 9which, while I like it, I agree it has some problems), and the orphanage thang.

Other than that, FF8 is my fave FF 9though FF6 is very good too). In fact, FF8 is one of my fave RPGs ever even though it's the same kind of role-playing as, say, a bio/bis/troika/obsidian game.
 
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aweigh

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Earthbound????????????????????????????????????????
ebonett.gif
 

kingcomrade

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The best Final Fantasy is Tactics, the best Square game really. Doesn't have any incredible CGI, just a passable intro, but the game itself is great and the story is one of the best.

I barely remember FF9. I played it to the end and I only remember a few parts like something about a giant tree and a sidequest at the end inside a mountain town. And a part where you run on walls. Oh, and Alexander being a 'character' instead of a summon which was a disappointment.

FF10 I think I got until just after some part where you have to fight those panther people and then there was a boss fight against Seymore that I couldn't beat and I didn't care enough about the story to waste time levelling-up. I did like that fight system, though, turn based and interesting even though it was basically rock paper scissors pitting your characters against specific types of enemies.

Is it so hard to create interesting characters without being ridiculous, that's what FF games make me think.
 

kingcomrade

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Oh, sure. Get an emulator (I use SNES9x but I think ZNES is more popular) and try out FF6 and maybe Chrono Trigger, if you haven't played it. DGemu.com is a good place for roms.
This is artwork:
6kefka-b3.jpg
 

Jasede

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut I'm very into cock and ball torture
Good old Kefka. It was a very refreshing change from most jRPGs' to meet the big foozle right at the beginning, and watch how he becomes more mad all the time. When I was younger, I was genuinely touched when he ruined the world.

That said: as much as I dislike the gameplay of most jRPGs - I can't repeat often enough how much skill I can spot in most of the music and artwork. Maybe they should have made cartoons instead of games....?
 

TheGreatGodPan

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Jasede said:
Don't be an idiot. Even if you utterly hate jRPGs (and I dislike them for the most part), you should still give FF credit for the /amazing/ music and the artful CGI.
I don't give any game credit for music or CGI. That's not what I'm looking for in games.
 

kingcomrade

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It turns out I was spelling it wrong. A fastitocalon is, via Google, a monster Tolkien created. A giant sea monster that some people mistake for an island.
There are many monsters in the Sea,
But none so perilous as HE,
Old horny Fastitocalon,
Whose mighty kindred all have gone,
The last of the old Turtle-fish.

tolkien said:
The poem on Fastitocalon is not like Cat and Oliphaunt my own invention entirely but a reduced and rewritten form, to suit hobbit fancy, of an item in old 'bestiaries'. I think it was remarkable that you perceived the Greekness of the name through its corruptions. This I took in fact from a fragment of an Anglo-Saxon bestiary that has survived, thinking that it sounded comic and absurd enough to serve as a hobbit alteration of something more learned and elvish – according to [a] system whereby as English replaces the Shire-speech so Latin and Greek replace the High-elven tongue in names. The learned name in this case seems to have been Aspido-chelōne 'turtle with a round shield (of hide)'. Of that astitocalon is a corruption no worse than many of the time; but I am afraid the F was put on by the versifier simply to make the name alliterate, as was compulsory for poets in his day, with the other words in his line. Shocking, or charming freedom, according to taste.

He says: þam is noma cenned/fyrnstreama geflotan Fastitocalon, 'to him is a name appointed, to the floater in the ancient tides, Fastitocalon'. The notion of the treacherous island that is really a monster seems to derive from the East: the marine turtles enlarged by myth-making fancy; and I left it at that. But in Europe the monster becomes mixed up with whales, and already in the Anglo-Saxon? version he is given whale characteristics, such as feeding by trawling with an open mouth. In moralized bestiaries he is, of course, an allegory of the Devil, and is so used by Milton.
 

Jasede

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut I'm very into cock and ball torture
vazquez595654 said:
Whenever anyone starts spouting off "good music" from games I have to give it a try. Keep em coming.

If you know you'll hate somewhat cliche anime stories and jRPG gameplay you really should know in advance that you'll surely not like them. Most of the best music can be found online. No need to play a game you might not like just to hear it. If you like, I am sure KC and me and the other covert Codex jRPG players can compile a list of great tunes.

Edit:

Chrono Trigger - Wind Scene *
FF 6 - The Magic House
FF 6 - Relm
FF 6 - Forever Rachel
FF 6 - Searching For Friends *
FF 8 - The Extreme *
FF 9 - Dark Messenger
Secret of Mana - Fear of Heaven (Fear of Angels) *
Silent Hill 4 - Room of Angel *
Wild Arms - Into The Wilderness *
 

Volourn

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"The best Final Fantasy is Tactics,"

HAHHA! Leave it to you to start a threa dto bash the FF ever; and then claim that one of the worst FF games ever is 'the best'. HAHAHAHAHA!
 

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