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Just finished VTM: Redemption.

Broseph

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SO after recently coming off of my first playthrough of Bloodlines and wanting to play another vampire RPG I decided I'd check out VTM: Redemption. I'd heard mixed things about it, and the only person who even gave it a single point in the last Codex best RPGs poll was hiver, so I was hesitant about playing it. So after 3 days of very long gamin' sessions I finished the game and I thought I would offer up some thoughts on it now before I forgot all about this thing.

The game has some cool ideas but reeks of wasted potential. It's a linear hack-n-slash dungeon crawl with absolutely no sidequests or optional objectives. Unlike Bloodlines, you don't have a whole lot of roleplaying options here. You are Christof Romuald and the only thing that you have control over is influencing your humanity meter through some dialogue choices (there are 3 different endings based on Christof's humanity meter). The writing ranges from competent at best to pure cringe at worst, and aside from the protagonist himself there aren't any interesting or well-developed characters to be found here.

About that protagonist... he manages to be a genuine fucking badass crusader for the LAWD while also being kind of annoying in his undying devotion for his hot nun girlfriend Anezka. He's a hero in the classical sense of the term, and it's honestly pretty refreshing seeing the hero trope played so straight in this day and age after decades of everyone trying to do everything but.

For 2000, the game has excellent graphics. Art direction and atmosphere are superb and the soundtrack is fantastic. These are by far the best aspects of the experience.

I can't think of another RPG which transitions to another time period halfway through, and some of the game's better moments come from the bewilderment Christof experiences in waking up in 1999. I've read before that the game gets considerably worse in the modern era, but that really isn't the case. The game DOES tempt you with a ton of cool guns and modern weapons, and most of them are shit in practice. If you stick to meleeing and mostly disregard the guns, content-wise it isn't any better or worse than Prague and Vienna.

The game is mostly very easy all the way through, but the final boss in both of his forms is basically unbeatable unless you have a very specific character build and arsenal of weapons. Save yourself the frustration and use cheats. Enable the console, and whenever one of your characters goes into torpor pause the game and type 'revive.'

Gameplay is like 3D Diablo with up to four party members. It's clunky as fuck and your party AI is fucked. If you don't want to constantly be ripping your hair out over the retarded AI, here's two things you MUST do:

1) Go in the controls menu and disable all party AI except auto-casting healing disciplines. If you don't do this, your characters will constantly be wasting precious blood casting disciplines on trivial encounters. This causes them to frenzy more and generally makes the gameplay experience 100x more annoying.

2) Go in solo mode when navigating through tight spaces. Seriously. When you get to the part in Vienna where you have to dodge the sunlight, guide your party members through one by one. Don't move them as a unit.

The gameplay can get awfully dull at times, but I will say that it never got as actively unpleasant as the sewers or the Hollowbrook Hotel in Bloodlines, and for as much flack as the second half of this game gets, it holds up a lot better in comparison to its first half than Hollywood and Chinatown do to Santa Montica and Downtown. Despite the monotonous gameplay and juvenile writing I actually enjoyed Redemption a lot. It isn't a particularly good game by any means, but it's an interesting one, which is a lot more than can be said for recent nu shit like Shadowrun Returns, let alone all the consolized popamole trash to come out in the 2000s. Sadly, the studio behind this game, Nihilistic Software, went on to make a bunch of shovelware console titles including a recent critically panned COD game for PSVita.

Seriously Codex, what the fuck. This game deserved a mention on our top 70. I mean, Arcanum consistently makes the top 5 and that game is shittier than this one. :troll:

:5/5::1/5:
 
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Broseph

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How did you find the second half of the game? London and NY?
Broseph said:
I've read before that the game gets considerably worse in the modern era, but that really isn't the case. The game DOES tempt you with a ton of cool guns and modern weapons, and most of them are shit in practice. If you stick to meleeing and mostly disregard the guns, content-wise it isn't any better or worse than Prague and Vienna.
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
This boy quit Divinity: Original Sins to play it.

:updatedmytxt::shunthenonbeliever:
 
Self-Ejected

Excidium

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This game is fucking awful, I gave up on Vienna. Reading the prologue in the manual was more fun than playing it
 

J_C

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Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
The game is mostly very easy all the way through, but the final boss in both of his forms is basically unbeatable unless you have a very specific character build and arsenal of weapons. Save yourself the frustration and use cheats. Enable the console, and whenever one of your characters goes into torpor pause the game and type 'revive.'
Pussy. You can kill the final boss withiout cheats, except if you screw up the build of all of your characters. Which is quiet a feat, congratulations. :troll:

Seriously, I agree, this game deserves more praise and less shit than it gets on the Codex. Sure, it is not an excellent cRPG, but the atmosphere, graphics, sound alone deserves a playthrough. And let's not forget that it translates the pen and paper ruleset much better than Bloodlines, which is dumbed down in this regard.
 

VentilatorOfDoom

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The game is mostly very easy all the way through, but the final boss in both of his forms is basically unbeatable unless you have a very specific character build and arsenal of weapons. Save yourself the frustration and use cheats. Enable the console, and whenever one of your characters goes into torpor pause the game and type 'revive.'
whats wrong noobseph, ignored the path of blood and the lure of flames?
 

Borelli

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I killed the final boss by equipping the stake gun and then waiting for critical chance which paralyses vampires. I agree with the overall assessment, a Diablo clone, while not a bad one, is not a proper way to make a Vampire game.
 

ZagorTeNej

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Prison of Ice and Firestorm make the last boss (and everything else in the game) a cakewalk but it's certainly possible to take him down with the usual Potence+Celerity+Feral Claws+Fortitude combo, it's just a lot harder. I find his 2nd form to be a lot less dangerous (not in the least because it doesn't deal aggravated damage but bashing IIRC), in his first one he can rip through your party like it's nothing.

Overall yeah, an underrated game and a testament to how important art direction/design is, even though it's from "blocky" 3D era the game still looks fantastic compared to most modern games. Already mentioned great atmosphere (that fades away quite a bit in "modern era" part of the game for me) and I would add interesting character development system, there are a lot of disciplines to mock around with (though some are obviously much more powerful than others), you have more freedom in regards to building your char than in Bloodlines even though you can't choose a clan at the start.
 

Broseph

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And let's not forget that it translates the pen and paper ruleset much better than Bloodlines, which is dumbed down in this regard.

This. Fucking this. Redemption is one of the best p&p translations to a crpg ever. The character sheet looks beautiful. All disciplines were transferred over. Bloodlines horrifically failed in that regard.

If Redemption had been turnbased, it would have been one of the best crpgs of all time, hands down. But I am p. sure fucking publishers are what ruined it and made it real time with pause. I would not be surprised if this decision was made halfway through development, that's the only way to explain the retarded A.I. as A.I. would not have been a priority in a T.B. game.
 

VentilatorOfDoom

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The pause feature was only added in the patch. before that you couldn't pause at all, which, of course, makes controlling 4 characters super effective.
 

clemens

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Codex 2014 Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
This game was glorious on multiplayer. How fondly I remember those long WON.net sessions... :(
Will we ever get another crpgs with a DM or storyteller feature ?
 

J_C

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This game was glorious on multiplayer. How fondly I remember those long WON.net sessions... :(
Will we ever get another crpgs with a DM or storyteller feature ?
OMG that was amazing. It was a revolutionary feature which wasn't used ever since, sadly. The perfect tool for recreating the live pen and paper sessions in a videogame. How cool it was that there was a DM, who could host the session in real time, playing the roles of NPCs, creating its own module.

Does anybody still play the multiplayer I wonder?
 

Jvegi

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Fair Anezka is the main reason I want to get back to this game. What a gal.

Played it for like 2 hours, got to the first party mission and then my saves got fucked up. The mechanics were clearly underwhelming, but I very much enjoyed the setting and the storytelling. Didn't mind the graphics that much, I think there is an HD mod out there.
 

clemens

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Codex 2014 Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
This game was glorious on multiplayer. How fondly I remember those long WON.net sessions... :(
Will we ever get another crpgs with a DM or storyteller feature ?
OMG that was amazing. It was a revolutionary feature which wasn't used ever since, sadly. The perfect tool for recreating the live pen and paper sessions in a videogame. How cool it was that there was a DM, who could host the session in real time, playing the roles of NPCs, creating its own module.

Does anybody still play the multiplayer I wonder?

I have, in LAN, a few times, with p&p friends, for pure nostalgia's sake...
Pretty sure you could still host a game through internet with a small vpn like hamachi. You would first need to unearth the good mods though. Some of them added a crazy amount of skins, disciplines, clans, etc. There was also a lot of huge custom maps. Good shit.
 

Broseph

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This game was glorious on multiplayer. How fondly I remember those long WON.net sessions... :(
Will we ever get another crpgs with a DM or storyteller feature ?
OMG that was amazing. It was a revolutionary feature which wasn't used ever since, sadly. The perfect tool for recreating the live pen and paper sessions in a videogame. How cool it was that there was a DM, who could host the session in real time, playing the roles of NPCs, creating its own module.

Does anybody still play the multiplayer I wonder?

Neverwinter Nights came out a couple years later using a similar MP formula. Funny thing though, not only was this 2 years ahead, it probably still looks better than NWN vanilla aside from spell effects.

Oh and Protean actually makes you shapeshift. This game has such a great translation of the disciplines.
 
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clemens

Cipher
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Codex 2014 Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
This game was glorious on multiplayer. How fondly I remember those long WON.net sessions... :(
Will we ever get another crpgs with a DM or storyteller feature ?
OMG that was amazing. It was a revolutionary feature which wasn't used ever since, sadly. The perfect tool for recreating the live pen and paper sessions in a videogame. How cool it was that there was a DM, who could host the session in real time, playing the roles of NPCs, creating its own module.

Does anybody still play the multiplayer I wonder?

Neverwinter Nights came out a couple years later using a similar MP formula. Funny thing though, not only was this 4 years ahead, it probably still looks better than NWN vanilla aside from spell effects.

Oh and Protean actually makes you shapeshift. This game has such a great translation of the disciplines.

There was a DM in multiplayer NWN ? Never noticed this in NWN2 (never played 1).
 

Azalin

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Prison of Ice and Firestorm make the last boss (and everything else in the game) a cakewalk .

This,these powers are so unbalanced they could be considered cheats,once you get them it's game over.
 

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