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Good jRPGs to play after Mother 3?

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Drog Black Tooth

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Played through Mother 3 recently, was my first real jRPG, surprisingly enjoyable, little to no grinding, reactive world, diverse party members, very enjoyable writing. Too bad about the horrendous non-ending though. Guess it's just your standard Japanese cop out a la Evangelion/Akira.

Anyway, what should be my next game in the wonderful world of Japanese escapism? Tried Mother 2 aka Earthbound and it kinda sucked. I'd like something with a good story, interesting setting and detailed world. Not just go to a town to buy shit, grind some overworld encounters, go through a boring dungeon, rinse and repeat.

Would Chrono Trigger or Persona 3 be good choices?
 

Phage

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Chrono Trigger is very traditional in the sense that you go on an adventure, kill a bunch of dudes, and save the world. It's a fun, light-hearted little romp, but don't expect much in the way of story. If you do play Chrono Trigger and like it, after that Final Fantasy 6 is a good bet. FF6 has a bit of the 'overworld grinding until the next town' design bullshit, but the second half opens up in a very fun non-linear fashion.

Persona 3 is vastly overrated. I tried playing it for 40 hours, but simply could not bring myself to finish it (I was apparently only 60% through). It has some of the worst pacing I have ever seen in a game. Even the non-combat parts drag on as you literally play through a light school/social-sim, grinding through days of activities waiting for the next monthly event. Of course some codexer is going to call me a pleb and claim it's great.

As for other games:

Undertale isn't Japanese, but it's very well made. Few combat encounters, lots of C+C (tons of permutations and different endings), extremely whimsical writing (this is hit or miss). LISA is also in this boat, but not quite as good. LISA is more grimdark post-apoc wrestling humor, with worse combat.

Final Fantasy Tactics has some decent writing for the genre. Drags on really hardcore though since the battles are so long.

Shin Megami Tensei Nocturne is very highly praised, even here. That said, the game isn't about the story at all, it's about the edgy aesthetic and great combat; so probably not what you want.

I've been told that:
- Lost Oddysey
- Suikoden 1+2
- Xenogears

Are all monocle in relation to the genre. I haven't actually played any of them though (They're all on my backlog of games to play)

Lost Oddysey in particular is basically weaboo PS:T from what I can tell - you play as an immortal who learns about his past lives or some shit.
 

Ash

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Bear in mind my tastes prioritize gameplay:

Dark Souls, of course.
Final Fantasy 6, plus the others from the '90s such as Tactics.
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night plus others in the series such as Order of Occlesia.
Onimusha: Dawn of Dreams is a pretty underrated action JRPG. The plot is trashy (yet still kinda fun), but the gameplay is solid.
Vagrant Story. Hardcore RTwP combat that's actually interesting.
Golden Sun 1 & 2 are worth a shot. The combat & supporting systems are average but everything else about them is great, such as exploration, puzzles, music, art style and plot.

One random little JRPG I once played was Koudelka, which was somewhat interesting. Can't say I'd recommend it to newcomers to JRPGs but it had a certain charm.

I haven't played many others, but those I did play I did not like, such as Breath of Fire and Chrono Trigger (I went there).
 

zwanzig_zwoelf

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'sup Drog.

I'd like something with a good story, interesting setting and detailed world.
Devil Summoner series (Saturn original and Soul Hackers). Pretty nice setting, the story is not bad, and some details are pretty neat (coin locker babies in the original DS). Don't touch the PSP port of the original DS - it's shit.
Hybrid Heaven (N64) - grab some popcorn too.
Jade Cocoon (PS1) is also a good choice.
Also... Hoshi wo Miru Hito (NES).

If you need a good Japanese game regardless of genre and shit, try King's Field, Evergrace and Shadow Tower series.

If you don't care about the language barrier or origin of the game and simply want some good TB combat, try Magna Carta: Phantom of Avalanche and the rest of the War of Genesis series.

Would Chrono Trigger or Persona 3 be good choices?
Avoid Persona 3 or any Persona game after it.
If you're so eager to get into the series, try the PSX versions of P1 and both P2. Just make sure you grab the Japanese (!) version of the first game (the plot is nothing special anyway) and avoid PSP versions like fire.
 

Haraldur

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I am currently nearing the end (or so it feels) of Phantasy Star 4. The only grinding I have done is accidental, as a result of exploration (nothing amazing, but better than average for a JRPG, with the possibility to visit towns earlier than the plot demands (and getting some harder battles)). Without grinding, the combat can be challenging at times (in a 'just right' way), though there are trash encounters too (helped by the macro system, which can be used to prepare combination attacks). The main plus of Phantasy Star 4, though, is that it is fast: the normal movement speed on the world map and in town is just a bit slower than the running speed in Chrono Trigger (though there is no running in Phantasy Star 4) and much faster than the snail's pace of Fina Fantasy 6; also, though all attacks by player characters and enemies are animated, the animations are rather quick, so there is much less time wasted watching stuff happen, compared with other JRPGs (which is good, as random encounters are frequent).

Phantasy Star 4 is also fast in another important way: the plot. I got frustrated by the low 'density' of the plot in Final Fantasy 6 (lots of walking around, slowly, with nothing much happening), but in Phantasy Star 4 there is usually something interesting going on, with transport between planets an artifical satellites in addition to overland travel, with plenty of plot twists, attacks on the party and othe complications coming up. The setting is also pretty interesting -- it is almost mature, even! It is a solar-system-wide post-apocalypse with abandoned robots and spaceships lying around, alien characters and genetically engineered people. And magic, just because.

And the characters aren't annoying. he main annoyance is remembering (or working out) what the spells and abilities do, as there are no tooltip descriptions for them (some of them are explained in the manual). So, in short, I would recommend Phantasy Star 4. It is the best JRPG I have played so far. There is very little bullshit.

Chrono Trigger is decent all-around. It contains quite a few cool things. I would prefer it if it was not quite so targeted at children, and if the motivation was a little stronger (though perhaps I misremember it). The battle system is decent, with nice combination attacks, but suffers from having an "Active Time Battle" system -- i.e. wait for a while before you get to take your turn, every turn (without even enemy attack animations, necessarily). As far as I am concerned, making the player wait (with no thinking or new information) is a terrible sin for a game.

Golden Sun 1 and 2 have some interesting environments (including a giant tree one climbs that is also an enemy boss), puzzles that change the pace nicely and a decent purely turn-based combat system. I like the music, too.

The standard RPGCodex recommendation would be Anachronox, but I watched the film version as I could not stand the combat system, nor the terribly slow walking speed and transition animations (10 seconds for every lift, every time) combined with backtracking. It really would benefit from a source port or mod that sped everything up.

I have not gone far into Sigma Star Saga, but it is interesting as its battle system is a side-scrolling shooter. It is rather silly, though.

Final Fantasy 10 has a good combat system, but most of the rest of it is horrible. The premise of a water dominated world with a lot of swimming may have been done better by a different company -- that is, there are some interesting bits, but most of it, including the story and all of the player characters and villains, is schlock.

I find Final Fantasy 6 overrated, with slow walking, slow battles with a lot of waiting ("Active Time Battle", plus a character whose special attack involves waiting :roll:) and whimsically abstract elements (in a bad way, including a character whose attacks involve gambling(!!)). The story is also nothing special (essentially the same sort of themes my ten-year-old self would make-believe, but I am now an adult). It may be that I was unreasonably impatient at the time (earlier this year) when I played this, though.
 

zwanzig_zwoelf

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The standard RPGCodex recommendation would be Anachronox, but I watched the film version as I could not stand the combat system, nor the terribly slow walking speed and transition animations (10 seconds for every lift, every time) combined with backtracking. It really would benefit from a source port or mod that sped everything up.
Use the "\" key, Luke. "Movie" version omits tons of good stuff.
And you would benefit from reading some patch notes. Taxi cabs and the speed up key were implemented for a reason.
 

RuySan

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I second Phantasy Star 4, or even Phantasy Star 1 on the master System. They have a low profile story and aestetic that's great for most of us that can't stomach those Anime clichés. Too bad Sega started to make spin offs instead of making new games in the main series (they pulled the same shit with Shining Force).

Xenoblade Chronicles has an huge world to explore, which is a big plus, but the combat is too much MMO.

If you like dungeon crawlers you can try the Etrian Odyssey games. Their fun, but very grinding.

I also really enjoy the Fire Emblem series. They're more SRPG, but the anime style is tolerable, and it has permadeath.
 

4249

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Devil Survivor might work. Lots of C&C, great combat and the usual SMT stuff with demons and shit. Doesn't require much grinding if any.
 
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Drog Black Tooth

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I second Phantasy Star 4, or even Phantasy Star 1 on the master System. They have a low profile story and aestetic that's great for most of us that can't stomach those Anime clichés.
Phantasy.Star.Series.full.1398364.jpg
 

RuySan

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Is that an in game screenshot ?

:0-13:
I don't even recognize those characters, it doesn't have anything to do with the game's aesthetic.
 

Damned Registrations

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Yeah, dunno where the comment about PS4's aesthetic came from. Tons of weird anime shit in there, from the weapons to the physical characteristics of the cast. I do think it has a great look and atmosphere though- the monsters are awesome looking, and the plot is handled through these sort of comic book style slide show things. And the music is some fucking awesome midi's techno rock shit!

That said, I'd put my recommendation towards one of the following three:

Undertale isn't exactly a jrpg, but it is short and a great game in terms of reactivity. It also pokes fun at the genre the same way the Mother series did and is generally rather amusing. And it has a solid story as well (albeit a rather bizarre one.)

Chrono Trigger is a classic for a reason. Game's music is top notch, and the world has lots of neat ways it can react to you, both in terms of small details and larger side quests. And the combat scarcely feels old because you're constantly getting new abilities and wanting to find out what all the different combo-techs are like. I'd say at least play up until the trial; if that doesn't get you hooked look elsewhere.

Lufia 2 is one of my all time favourites. It has a somewhat cliche'd story in some regards, but it has some great points too. What really makes it fun is the dungeon crawling- it mixes in a bunch of different special items ala Zelda games, so you can do things like hit switches or blow up damaged walls and such. You can also avoid a lot of the combat by clever movement; the gameplay is never real time, so no need to worry about dodging jump-scare monsters. The combat itself is decent as well, with some solidly challenging parts and a lot of cool elements regarding the special abilities granted while wearing equipment.
 
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Lufia 2 really does have amazing itemization, for a JRPG especially. It did Limit Breaks before FF7 did, and better. Some items are statistically weaker than others, but have better Rage abilities that make them valuable even later into the game.

Plus it has a pretty fun monster-raising system.

And a randomized dungeon sidequest that you can waste hours upon hours playing.

The only thing I don't care for is the in-battle graphics. Other than that, Lufia 2 is one of the best JRPGs ever made imo.
 
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Drog Black Tooth

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Seriously dudes, all I want is a strong story/setting/fleshed out party over nonlinearity and tactical combat. If I wanted the latter, I'd just play a Western game. Also, stop suggesting action games and animu waifus, wtf.

Otherwise, I'll just go ahead and play Chronically Triggered, it's supposedly the PS:T of jRPGs. The frog dude supposedly has some of the best writing in video games ever.
 

Siveon

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Seriously dudes, all I want is a strong story/setting/fleshed out party over nonlinearity and tactical combat. If I wanted the latter, I'd just play a Western game. Also, stop suggesting action games and animu waifus, wtf.
Hey, you're the one that was gonna play Persona 3, otherwise known as: SMT for babbies.

Otherwise, I'll just go ahead and play Chronically Triggered, it's supposedly the PS:T of jRPGs. The frog dude supposedly has some of the best writing in video games ever.
You totally should, but the game is not the PS:T of JRPGs. In that context, Chrono Trigger would have a heavy emphasis on writing and dialogue instead of combat, which is simply not the case. Like what Phage said, Chrono Trigger is just a fun game. And whoever told you that Frog has some of the best writing ever, probably only played CT when they were young and he still had a Shakespearean accent.

Final Fantasy Tactics has a really good story and setting, I'd say you should consider playing that too.
 

Haraldur

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I find Final Fantasy 6 overrated, with slow walking...

Wut? You can run, and even get a fast boots relic to run at super speed.

I am aware of the boot relics, and I disapprove: the game should just be faster, rather than forcing me to use an in game item, at the expense of other items, just to make the game less boring. I am not aware of there being a run key: in Chrono Trigger it was the cancel button (B?), while I could not find one for FF6.

Fake edit: I have checked the manuals for the SNES version (which I played, as it seemed to be the most recommended one) and the PS1 version. The PS1 version does appear to have X as the run button, but there is no similar function in evidence for the B button in the SNES version's manual. No running in the SNES version.

I second Phantasy Star 4, or even Phantasy Star 1 on the master System. They have a low profile story and aestetic that's great for most of us that can't stomach those Anime clichés.
Phantasy.Star.Series.full.1398364.jpg

Ugh, no. While the comic-book-like sections of the game are clearly in an anime art-style, it is not this one. Not all anime is in the clichéd moé-crap style, as this picture is.

As far as art style and clichés go, it would be possible to be annoyed if trying to be, but I was never particularly bothered ("oh, this character is ever-so-slightly cutesy -- well, I suppose it is understandable given that she is a genetically engineered being, alive for only one year, who has never seen the outside world").

Otherwise, I'll just go ahead and play Chronically Triggered, it's supposedly the PS:T of jRPGs. The frog dude supposedly has some of the best writing in video games ever.

I would more readily compare it with Baldur's Gate 2: while the concept is more impressive than BG2's (being closer to PS:T's level), the execution is similar. The battle system is good, the graphics and music are good, the characters are quite likeable etc., but it felt, to me, just to have the "let's have an adventure" vibe, rather than having PS:T's pretensions and weird elements. I do not remember anythin, in particular, about the writing. It did the job. Perhaps something was lost in the translation (constrained by the capacity of the cartridges), but I can only judge the SNES translation.

Frog was fun, but I would not say "best writing in video games ever".
 

Phage

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Seriously dudes, all I want is a strong story/setting/fleshed out party over nonlinearity and tactical combat. If I wanted the latter, I'd just play a Western game. Also, stop suggesting action games and animu waifus, wtf.

Otherwise, I'll just go ahead and play Chronically Triggered, it's supposedly the PS:T of jRPGs. The frog dude supposedly has some of the best writing in video games ever.

You didn't actually read my post, so have fun with that, lmao


:thumbsup:
 

rrc2soft

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Seriously dudes, all I want is a strong story/setting/fleshed out party over nonlinearity and tactical combat. If I wanted the latter, I'd just play a Western game. Also, stop suggesting action games and animu waifus, wtf

  • Chrono Trigger. Strong story that starts in a generic fantasy world, but goes beyond that thanks to the magic of time travel. Multiple settings (time), strong characters with personal stories, good plot twists, small nonlinearity.
  • Phantasy Star 4. As haraldur said, solar system-wide post-apoc world, multiple planets with their own feeling, characters that talk and grow during the course of the game, no anime waifus.
  • Suikoden 2. Political intrigue, backstabbing, and magic. +100 characters, but the core group is really strong.
  • Undertale: Starts like a cliche but becomes one of the best JRPGs ever :-P. Interesting characters, lots of C&C, short game (~10 hours).
 

Rahdulan

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Seriously dudes, all I want is a strong story/setting/fleshed out party over nonlinearity and tactical combat. If I wanted the latter, I'd just play a Western game.

You would actually play Romancing SaGa, but let's not split hairs here. Well, at least for non-linearity.
 

Ivan

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I'm playing through Mother 3 right now. I miss the non-linearity of Earthbound, but the greater emphasis on story is nice.

I would recommend you keep going with Earthbound. It opens up a lot more as you get into it and expand your party.
 
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Drog Black Tooth

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I would recommend you keep going with Earthbound. It opens up a lot more as you get into it and expand your party.

There was a thread on NeoGAF for people trying Earthbound after Mother 3, and the general advice was "keep at it for 15-20 hours and you're going to like the rest of the game". How about no. This sounds like Stockholm syndrome to me.
 

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