Yet Another Half-Life 2 Discussion

[an Administrator]

Dumbs down combat options and make combat generic and horrible.

Agreed.

Far worse atmosphere and setting

No. Outdoor atmosphere feels more fresh and alive.

Cringeworthy dialog

agreed

Shits over lore

Which part of the lore was shit?

Horrible AI that the devs want to convince us is revolutionary.

AI was retarded comparing to HL1 . agreed.

 

[buzz]

The majority of posts say the game was dissapointing, mediocre or way overrated.

Half Life 2 fanboys interpret that as saying it was the worst thing since Hitler.

 

[Akratus]

-Dumbs down combat options and make combat generic and horrible.

I agree that there aren't nearly as many guns as cool as the alien weapons in half life 1 or the particle beams and whatnot, but I don't think Half Life 2 had that bad a selection. Still, got a point.

-Far worse atmosphere and setting

For one this is mostly subjective and for two this is way off in my opinion. Half Life 2 will hold up for ever, and in my opinion looks amazing. Half Life 1 looks good, but decidedly cheesy and 90's. Of course, it's all subjective.

-Cringeworthy dialog

Nigga please.

-Shits over lore

Give me some examples. In my opinion the combine, vortigaunts and general story were great.

-Horrible AI that the devs want to convince us is revolutionary.

I guess. I'm no expert on this.

 

[an Administrator]

I guess. I'm no expert on this.

I remember in Half Life 1 marines used grenades to flank you and they fought really tactical.

 

[agentorange]

the incredible half-life 1 lore that featured such brilliance as a giant, psychic, floating baby that must be killed by throwing C4 into its exposed brain.

 

[buzz]

As opposed to giant, psychic, fat floating babies that can suck your brain out with their tongues.

 

[Akratus]

As opposed to giant, psychic, fat floating babies that can suck your brain out with their tongues.

VS

WHICH IS BETTER AND WHY?​

 

[buzz]

The first one is a boss fight.
The second one is a thing that wrestles the control of the game away from you and kills some dude and it's supposed to make you sad.

 

[Akratus]

The first one is a boss fight.
The second one is a thing that wrestles the control of the game away from you and kills some dude and it's supposed to make you sad.

The second is a much more impressive advisary, you kill the big alien boss baby by destroying his yellow crystals and lobbing grenades at his head, the advisor you have no power over, while it's portrusion manhandles your brainmeat. You have plenty of strong enemies in half life 2 that are fun to fight, this creates a stronger story moment. Especially for the combine which must be portrayed as very strong, otherwise their galactic empire aspect and near complete domination of mankind falls flat.

 

[Average Manatee]

No. Outdoor atmosphere feels more fresh and alive.

One game is about a bunch of science geeks, security guards and one guy in a hazard suit fighting off a simultaneous alien invasion and government conspiracy cleanup army unit.

The other is about having a nice sunday drive through sewers and across the highway for half the game.

-Cringeworthy dialog

Nigga please.

Every wink wink nod nod to HL1 is horrible. See the video that was posted last page.

-Shits over lore

Give me some examples. In my opinion the combine, vortigaunts and general story were great.

Completely new race out of nowhere with reality-warping magic and the G-Man goes from being powerful to an omnipotent entity and there's seriously no reason that a guy with a gun should be able to at any point a worthwhile character in terms of affecting either.

Half Life was fairly grounded sci fi while HL2 runs wild everywhere.

-Horrible AI that the devs want to convince us is revolutionary.

I guess. I'm no expert on this.

I was wrong, Half Life 2's advanced AI would remain unmatched by Bethesda until Skyrim. Oops.

 

[Akratus]

-Shits over lore

Give me some examples. In my opinion the combine, vortigaunts and general story were great.

Completely new race out of nowhere with reality-warping magic and the G-Man goes from being powerful to an omnipotent entity and there's seriously no reason that a guy with a gun should be able to at any point a worthwhile character in terms of affecting either.

Nigga what? Reality-warping magic is jarring to you? Have you PLAYED half life 1?

Half Life was fairly grounded sci fi while HL2 runs wild everywhere.

They're both unrealistic to an extent. Half Life 2 has realistic art design. Half life 1 has blocky models with circus colors.
Hey they're both great in their own right but the aesthetic of Half Life 2 is either at least great to someone or they are blind.

 

[buzz]

The second is a much more impressive advisary

He's a glorified cutscene.

you kill the big alien boss baby by destroying his yellow crystals and lobbing grenades at his head

And you destroy the "very strong" Combine fortress by shooting energy ball in a bigger energy ball. Wow, so galactic, such dominant.

 

[Average Manatee]

Nigga what? Reality-warping magic is jarring to you? Have you PLAYED half life 1?

Half Life has teleportation, accomplished through technology (the aliens can do it through some kind of bio-mechanical stuff of their own). There's no reason to suspect the G-Man has any special powers at all beyond a working teleporter, and most of the enemies have believable (or at least plausible) abilities. It makes logical sense that a single person with a special armored suit and a good knowledge of guns can fight these things and come out ahead. Gordon is treated like a good soldier because that's pretty much what he is, a good soldier who can shoot enemies and get things done.

In HL2 characters stop time, become ghosts, and the advisor is like fucking Cthulu or something. We're literally informed that Earth's entire military was defeated in less than half a day. There's absolutely zero reason that Gordon is considered a viable player to affect this universe at all, considering he actually has less guns and abilities than in HL1. Yet Gordon is hailed as some kind of fucking messiah who will take back earth along with his quirky science buddies, a waifu bait, and his exemplary knowledge of how to utilize levers.

They're both unrealistic to an extent. Half Life 2 has realistic art design. Half life 1 has blocky models with circus colors.
Hey they're both great in their own right but the aesthetic of Half Life 2 is either at least great to someone or they are blind.

I'm not saying anything about HL2 looking bad (it looks nice), just that the tone of game's atmosphere shifts wildly from "oppressed earth" to "sunday drive".

 

[racofer]

Hey look, it's this thread again.

Seriously what's this thing about the Codex and hating HL2? I can understand hating PoE (stiff-necked oldfags hate everything new, falloutards hate everything that isn't Fallout or exactly like Fallout and insecure newfags jump on the bandwagon desperately trying to fit in) but why HL2? /confused

Joined: Feb 16, 2015

 

[Ash]

HL2 Level design while not terrible is pretty bland too. That highway level for example, it's just an opportunity to drive a buggy around for an hour, there's little else to it.

Also: http://imgur.com/4Coqmne

Commendable approach to level design, guys

 

[Daemongar]

The majority of posts say the game was dissapointing, mediocre or way overrated.

Half Life 2 fanboys interpret that as saying it was the worst thing since Hitler.

Read the first post in this thread. That's not saying the game was disappointing, mediocre, or overrated. Someone said it was shit. Some say its not shit. Your summary above is poor.

 

[buzz]

Read the second post in this thread replying to the first one. That's me replying to the first post. How about you go fuck yourself.

 

[Campion]

This conversation told me me everything I need to know about some of you the moment Xen was called great with a straight face. It's cute that you think you have any grandiose taste after that point.

Conceptually Xen is a great idea, but so are a lot of things. What matters most for a game is execution and Xen misses the mark entirely. HL1 was never good as a platformer and that's what Xen is trying to be. Then, you're forced into a mandatory, boring boss fight with a testicle creature before the fantastic finally with a fetus who has the ability to shoot portals that spawn you away from the fight.

HL1 is a magnificent game, but Xen is acknowledged as shit part for a reason.

-Far worse atmosphere and setting
-Shits over lore

You have no idea what you're talking about. HL1's plot and setting are inspired by Doom verbatim (Outside of taking place on Earth, and the bad guys being aliens). It takes place entirely in a research facility, and that's almost all you'll see in the entire game. It's nothing particularly deep. Furthermore, there was no lore for HL1 because HL1 is the lore. It's the start of everything, and that everything is the same shit we had seen before.

Meanwhile, HL2's setting takes inspiration from a number of sources, particularly 1984. It doesn't find it simply suffice to just take place in a war torn city or some shit like COD, you literally see the effects the combine have induced over the world and civilization as you continue. On the subject of lore, HL2 actually has it and gives you numerous hints of what transpired between the time of HL1 and HL2, from snippets about a seven hour war to info you can overhear from Breen and the other characters. Half life 2 never had a good story but what it does have is masterful storytelling, much the same as HL1. It just had the tech to tell it in better ways that the first couldn't.

On the subject that the teenager brings up about gordon, it's not unfeasible for Gordon to be considered messianic since most of the survivors met him in person and found out he fulfilled their objectives. Even though the alien invasion got worse, it's obvious that this person is of great importance to be able to achieve that, HEV suit or no. It's just common sense. Also, pauses during speech are actually a real thing that happens in real conversation. I doubt a teenage nerd would know much about that though. Shit, I don't even know how conversations work.

BTW, I find it hilarious for people on a board dedicated to RPG games to not let HL2 live down it's bad shooting. RPGs are typically games with the worst core gameplay around, but a lot of us are able to get over these things because certain aspects of a game can more than make up for the some of their parts. Morrowind is one of my absolute favorite games, but it has so many issues and the combat is so crap at the start that it's immediately understandable why people would avoid it at first glance.

I'm not going to argue with you about HL1 being superior to HL2, because IMHO it is. It has better shooting, better AI, more memorable weapons and such. But to call HL2 shit or some such hyperbolic phrase is being outright unreasonable, and I have a feeling that you know it.

 

[Average Manatee]

Joined: Friday

This conversation told me me everything I need to know about some of you the moment Xen was called great with a straight face. It's cute that you think you have any grandiose taste after that point.

Conceptually Xen is a great idea, but so are a lot of things. What matters most for a game is execution and Xen misses the mark entirely. HL1 was never good as a platformer and that's what Xen is trying to be. Then, you're forced into a mandatory, boring boss fight with a testicle creature before the fantastic finally with a fetus who has the ability to shoot portals that spawn you away from the fight.

HL1 is a magnificent game, but Xen is acknowledged as shit part for a reason.

Platforming is fine in Xen. L2P you fucking noob. Some of us played FPSs back when movement was actually important and every game had a unique style that needed to be mastered. You know, good games like Quake, which is the engine HL1 uses.

The boss fights are lame but that's literally every FPS boss fight ever. HL2's is so bad its beyond belief.

You have no idea what you're talking about. HL1's plot and setting are inspired by Doom verbatim (Outside of taking place on Earth, and the bad guys being aliens). It takes place entirely in a research facility, and that's almost all you'll see in the entire game. It's nothing particularly deep. Furthermore, there was no lore for HL1 because HL1 is the lore. It's the start of everything, and that everything is the same shit we had seen before.

No on said HL1 was deep, but it is good. HL2 is both not deep and horrible.

HL1 manages to have a consistent storyline. What happens in later parts of the game make sense based on the logical developments from what has happened earlier. This is a basic quality of good storytelling, something which HL2 utterly lacks.

Meanwhile, HL2's setting takes inspiration from a number of sources, particularly 1984. It doesn't find it simply suffice to just take place in a war torn city or some shit like COD, you literally see the effects the combine have induced over the world and civilization as you continue. On the subject of lore, HL2 actually has it and gives you numerous hints of what transpired between the time of HL1 and HL2, from snippets about a seven hour war to info you can overhear from Breen and the other characters. Half life 2 never had a good story but what it does have is masterful storytelling, much the same as HL1. It just had the tech to tell it in better ways that the first couldn't.

HL2's storytelling is the highest level of shit. You can clearly see that Valve had no idea where the plot is going at every step of the way.

On the subject that the teenager brings up about gordon, it's not unfeasible for Gordon to be considered messianic since most of the survivors met him in person and found out he fulfilled their objectives. Even though the alien invasion got worse, it's obvious that this person is of great importance to be able to achieve that, HEV suit or no. It's just common sense. Also, pauses during speech are actually a real thing that happens in real conversation. I doubt a teenage nerd would know much about that though. Shit, I don't even know how conversations work.

No it's actually just a bunch of bullshit. And HL2's conversations are literally sitcom-level crap that lacks a laugh track.

BTW, I find it hilarious for people on a board dedicated to RPG games to not let HL2 live down it's bad shooting. RPGs are typically games with the worst core gameplay around, but a lot of us are able to get over these things because certain aspects of a game can more than make up for the some of their parts. Morrowind is one of my absolute favorite games, but it has so many issues and the combat is so crap at the start that it's immediately understandable why people would avoid it at first glance.

First off
>RPG games
>Role Playing Game games

Second, there is nothing redeemable about HL2. Gunplay and shooting things sucks, so that's out. Storyline is made up junk, that's out. Characters are constantly outdoing themselves in trying to make you cringe with their dialog. It's a good thing Valve decided to make the Portal series because the quirky puzzles in HL2 are about the only thing notable.

I'm not going to argue with you about HL1 being superior to HL2, because IMHO it is. It has better shooting, better AI, more memorable weapons and such. But to call HL2 shit or some such hyperbolic phrase is being outright unreasonable, and I have a feeling that you know it.

meh, I didn't call it shit. It's pretty bad though. I'll give Valve a 6/10 for effort and being able to, against all odds, make a half decent bit of gameplay to end Ep 2 on.

 

[Campion]

"Some of us played FPSs back when movement was actually important and every game had a unique style that needed to be mastered. You know, good games like Quake, which is the engine HL1 uses."

That's great and everything, but Half Life isn't Quake. They partically had to give you the long jump modual just to try and compensate for just how slow your character moves while platforming. Also notice that none of the platforms in the game are above your character, they're often below. Your character doesn't jump that high.

"The boss fights are lame but that's literally every FPS boss fight ever."

I'll give you that, but those two boss battles make up a large percentage of Xen outside of the shitty platforming. You guys are trying to sell that as great.

"HL1 manages to have a consistent storyline. What happens in later parts of the game make sense based on the logical developments from what has happened earlier. This is a basic quality of good storytelling, something which HL2 utterly lacks."

You seem to be confusing the story with storytelling in this context. What happens isn't the focus, it's how it happens. If you think HL1's story is good, you're fooling yourself. Aliens are invading Black Mesa, military doesn't like it, pull some switches and kill them. It's how those events fold out in front of you that's special, and HL2 simply has more avenues to explore that. Realize that if you're saying HL2 has bad storytelling, then you're also talking about HL1.

The rest of what you said were opinionated, hyperbolic statements without much to back them up. It's like you think that if you call something bullshit enough times without explaining yourself, people will just roll with it. You're entitled to say what you're saying, but that isn't how that works.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Conceptually Xen is a great idea, but so are a lot of things. What matters most for a game is execution and Xen misses the mark entirely. HL1 was never good as a platformer and that's what Xen is trying to be.

It is an alien world, and that's what they were trying to convey. Xen being so incredibly horribru is just some canard that gets passed around by people who want to pretend they are such great connoisseurs for repeating what everybody else has been saying about the game ad nauseam.

And the last boss being boring and underwhelming lol. Name one single FPS where that isn't the case, starting with Doom and Quake.

HL1 is a magnificent game, but Xen is acknowledged as shit part for a reason.

The reason being everybody is unable to think for themselves and must always follow the herd.

 

[Average Manatee]

"Some of us played FPSs back when movement was actually important and every game had a unique style that needed to be mastered. You know, good games like Quake, which is the engine HL1 uses."

That's great and everything, but Half Life isn't Quake. They partically had to give you the long jump modual just to try and compensate for just how slow your character moves while platforming. Also notice that none of the platforms in the game are above your character, they're often below. Your character doesn't jump that high.

Half Life really is pretty much quake in its movement. Have you actually played Half Life, not the neutered remakes? It's very fast. Go compare a speed run of HL1 and Quake 1.

I'll give you that, but those two boss battles make up a large percentage of Xen outside of the shitty platforming. You guys are trying to sell that as great.

A large percentage? Like 5-10% of your time?

Yes, a completely unique area never seen before in FPSs is great even if a small percentage of it is sub-par. Even still the boss levels have plenty of uniqueness in them that you have to navigate while fighting the boss itself.

You seem to be confusing the story with storytelling in this context. What happens isn't the focus, it's how it happens. If you think HL1's story is good, you're fooling yourself. Aliens are invading Black Mesa, military doesn't like it, pull some switches and kill them. It's how those events fold out in front of you that's special, and HL2 simply has more avenues to explore that. Realize that if you're saying HL2 has bad storytelling, then you're also talking about HL1.

You seem to making up asinine definitions of words instead of giving evidence why HL2 doesn't have an incredibly poor story. Then you go to mix up your own terminology immediately afterwards.

The rest of what you said were opinionated, hyperbolic statements without much to back them up. It's like you think that if you call something bullshit enough times without explaining yourself, people will just roll with it. You're entitled to say what you're saying, but that isn't how that works.

Evidence has already been given to those statements. If you want a specific, in-depth explanation of one of them, just ask.

 

[Campion]

Speedruns are not a very good way to gauge how fast paced both games are in comparison to one another.

"A large percentage? Like 5-10% of your time? Yes, a completely unique area never seen before in FPSs is great even if a small percentage of it is sub-par."

No, a large percentage. There are about four maps (Maybe five, I can't remember.) of Xen and Bosses take up two of them. Then you have to take into account the Testicle's high HP and the Fetuses portal projectiles. Maps focusing on shitty platforming, no matter the theme, are nothing unique to the FPS genre.

You seem to making up asinine definitions of words instead of giving evidence why HL2 doesn't have an incredibly poor story.

Half life 2 never had a good story

Also, the usage of storytelling to describe how a story is told is more than adequate here.

I assure you, Lyric Suite, that these are the thoughts I've gathered from beating the game multiple times. I love the game, after all. I just can't see anything being all that positive about Xen for the reasons I gave.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Lol, this again. Some people, like LS, seem to have personal vendetta against HL2. probably because of all the hype before it's release, which in the hindsight was a harbinger of today's gaming zhournalizm and dorrito popes. Don't think any game before it ever had that much pre-release coverage and marketing as HL2.
As a game it was good. It's pointless to use words like ''great'' or ''shit'', because FPS is a shit genre to begin with - you're a floating gun that points at things for them to die. The end. I could understand dissatisfaction from some fps-dawgs, who play these shit games on ''pro'' level and couldn't get much challenge out of it, but as a story driven, single player campaign HL2 was quality entertainment. After that generally forgettable, though a bit less, because of great art design as was already mentioned.

Saying it's ''shit'' is just Suite suiting. No middle ground, i get it. Don't get why you're playing a low brow genre like this to begin with, LS. ALL FPSs are fucking shite, dumbass. People are using words as ''twitcher'' as generic term for shitty action rpgs, while laughing at them, and are still playing FPOSes hoping that they would provide great gameplay for your sophisticated sensibilities? Really?

 

[you know what time it is]

I Liked HL2 (not enough to bother with them episodes or whatever the fuck that was), but I didn't like original HL (single player that is, MP was tight).