FFG's Star Wars RPG

[Irenaeus II]

There's cool art. But too much inspired by prequels, EU and video-games, which are non-canonical. Anyway, I was expecting something out of the late 70s/early 80s, completely deluded.

 

[Excidium II]

There's cool art. But too much inspired by prequels, EU and video-games, which are non-canonical. Anyway, I was expecting something out of the late 70s/early 80s, completely deluded.

I see. Yeah that'd be cooler.

 

[JamesDixon]

The game itself uses the all of the EU, which is both Legends line and the new canon. Up to you if you want to stick with the new canon or use the old EU or both.

 

[Night Goat]

 

[Excidium II]

 

[Azalin]

 

[TigerKnee]

You see I prefer systems that utilize a bell curve instead of a linear system. The reason why is that a bell curve has more consistency over a linear system because it has more dice. The dice favor the players. A linear system like D20 means that no matter the number the same percentage chance to hit that number is the same. In the case of a D20 it's 5%. On a bell curve like 3D6, it's variable between 16% to 55% roughly on a given number. Numbers like 9-12 are more likely to appear than say a 3 or an 18.

edit: Ignore this post, I'm stupid

 

[Crichton]

You see I prefer systems that utilize a bell curve instead of a linear system. The reason why is that a bell curve has more consistency over a linear system because it has more dice. The dice favor the players. A linear system like D20 means that no matter the number the same percentage chance to hit that number is the same. In the case of a D20 it's 5%. On a bell curve like 3D6, it's variable between 16% to 55% roughly on a given number. Numbers like 9-12 are more likely to appear than say a 3 or an 18.

Late to the party but I just want to comment on this.

Bell Curve really only matters if the specific number you roll matters - e.g for rolling stats, 10 is distinct from 14 is distinct from 18.

If you're only rolling dice to "beat a target number" (usually in order to accomplish a task), there's actually no difference in your success rate using bell curve methods. That is to say, given a DC of 10 to succeed on a task, a 3d6 and a 1d16 + 2 (which will produce a value between 3-18) both have a 50% chance of succeeding.

It does cut down on how many fumbles and crits trigger though, since those DO insist on very specific numbers being rolled

So you're saying my odds of passing a DC17 skill check are the same whether I roll 3d6 or roll one d16 and add 2?

 

[TigerKnee]

So you're saying my odds of passing a DC17 skill check are the same whether I roll 3d6 or roll one d16 and add 2?

Ah, I forgot to test the extremes. Guess I'll have to take back what I said

edit: Actually, though I fucked up the math, I think I still have something going on there - the claim was that Bell Curve "favors the player", but it's more like it makes easier tasks likely to succeed more often while tough tasks harder to succeed at - if we assume that the GM is tossing you a roughly even number of easy and hard tasks, then the end results in terms of pass/fails will probably not be that different... it'll only favor the player if the GM does nothing but doing easy tasks

 

[JamesDixon]

So you're saying my odds of passing a DC17 skill check are the same whether I roll 3d6 or roll one d16 and add 2?

Ah, I forgot to test the extremes. Guess I'll have to take back what I said

edit: Actually, though I fucked up the math, I think I still have something going on there - the claim was that Bell Curve "favors the player", but it's more like it makes easier tasks likely to succeed more often while tough tasks harder to succeed at - if we assume that the GM is tossing you a roughly even number of easy and hard tasks, then the end results in terms of pass/fails will probably not be that different... it'll only favor the player if the GM does nothing but doing easy tasks

Your statement is incorrect. Check out the results for an actual bell curve using 3D6.

The blue line is a linear distribution for 1D20 and the green line is the distribution for 3D6. Every 3d6 system I've seen uses a roll under method, so if the player needs 11 or less the dice favors them. You total up the percentages for every number between 3 and 11 to give you the total base chance of success. A modifier of +/-1 changes the odds by .93% at the extremes and 12.5% in the middle, so the modifiers will make a bigger impact in the median of the distribution while the modifier has little effect at the extremes.

For the 1d20, each +/-1 adds a flat 5%, so to get the same effect of the modifiers you need to stack more of them. Now each number on the 1d20 has an equal chance of showing up as well. This is regardless of using a roll under or roll over system.

The reason why the difference and why the 3d6 favors the player is that each number on 1d6 has an equal chance of 16.6% of showing up. Add the other 2d6 and each number has a 50% chance of appearing. This is why a 3d6 system favors the player over single or even dual die systems.

 

[Andhaira]

Andhaira, you act like I'm an idiot when it comes to FFG. I'm not and I contributed a lot to Warhammer 40K Dark Heresy with a couple of fan supplements. One was written wholly by myself and the other was done with a full team. You're claim about the dice is meritless since FFG gives away a free dice rolling app for Android OS.

You're relying upon the words of people that are biased and have no experience with the system. Hmm maybe I would take your opinion seriously if you had actual experience with the system. I'd rather want a narrativist game since I spent decades playing simulation games. It is a different want that is there. Yes, I have been playing pen and paper RPGs a lot longer than you've been alive and I've played almost all of the major systems, including D&D up till 3.5E. I don't want to play D&D in Space which means no levels and no d20. You see I prefer systems that utilize a bell curve instead of a linear system. The reason why is that a bell curve has more consistency over a linear system because it has more dice. The dice favor the players. A linear system like D20 means that no matter the number the same percentage chance to hit that number is the same. In the case of a D20 it's 5%. On a bell curve like 3D6, it's variable between 16% to 55% roughly on a given number. Numbers like 9-12 are more likely to appear than say a 3 or an 18.

As far as Saga, sorry but it's D&D in Space and the same problems that happen with D&D occurred with SW Saga. The only game that even came close to the full Star Wars experience, that I've played, has been WEG Star Wars. It had zero levels and it was very simple to learn and run, but ran into problems at high level of play.

As I said I don't really have any experience with the system, as of yet. Though I have been researching it when I have time and one of the appeals of it is actually the narravatist dice results; that is, something always happens when the dice results come up that require the GM and/or players to narrate changing circumstances (ex: You shoot at a storm-trooper and roll no success thus you miss. However you also rolled an advantage on one of the weird dice, so maybe the blaster shot hits a pipe that lets out a burst of steam that grants you cover from the trooper imposing penalty to his attack) It seems fun, but I do wish they had chosen some other way of doing it instead of using the weird dice.

Regarding SW Saga you don't know what you are talking about at all. It is certainly not D&D in space; that could have been said to some extent about the OCR or the RCR d20 versions, but Saga is a rebuilt ground up with the best d20 system iteration to better reflect Star Wars. I am not saying it is perfect by any means, hardly any system is. But things like the condition track coupled with the high damage from blasters allow PCs to always be threatened in a fight. High level PCs will always be threatened by lower level enemies due to the auto fire rules. Heck with the right talents and feats an enemy can fell a PC of any level with a single shot due to the condition track system. The large amount of feats and talents give players a lot of choice to customize their characters.

Speaking of feats and talents, these things allow players to modify their dice bell curves beneficially, allowing them better chances to hit, break the system for a turn, etc.

 

[JamesDixon]

As I said I don't really have any experience with the system, as of yet. Though I have been researching it when I have time and one of the appeals of it is actually the narravatist dice results; that is, something always happens when the dice results come up that require the GM and/or players to narrate changing circumstances (ex: You shoot at a storm-trooper and roll no success thus you miss. However you also rolled an advantage on one of the weird dice, so maybe the blaster shot hits a pipe that lets out a burst of steam that grants you cover from the trooper imposing penalty to his attack) It seems fun, but I do wish they had chosen some other way of doing it instead of using the weird dice.

Regarding SW Saga you don't know what you are talking about at all. It is certainly not D&D in space; that could have been said to some extent about the OCR or the RCR d20 versions, but Saga is a rebuilt ground up with the best d20 system iteration to better reflect Star Wars. I am not saying it is perfect by any means, hardly any system is. But things like the condition track coupled with the high damage from blasters allow PCs to always be threatened in a fight. High level PCs will always be threatened by lower level enemies due to the auto fire rules. Heck with the right talents and feats an enemy can fell a PC of any level with a single shot due to the condition track system. The large amount of feats and talents give players a lot of choice to customize their characters.

Speaking of feats and talents, these things allow players to modify their dice bell curves beneficially, allowing them better chances to hit, break the system for a turn, etc.

I just looked at it and it is the same as D&D 3.5 down to a Tee. Thus, it is D&D in space.

D&D and its derivatives do not have a bell curve. They have a gaussian linear distribution. Single and some double dice do not generate a bell curve. The difference is that a bell curve requires a minimum of 2 of the same dice to generate a total of the lowest number or the highest number. Here's why, 3 or more dice have a better chance on every number to show up on every die. In my prior post, I show that at the extreme edges of the dice scale it's .93% chance for a 3 or an 18 to show up. The number 1 and 6 have an equal chance of showing up as the other numbers at a rate of 16.6% on a single die, but with 3d6 the chance for a number to show up has been increased to 50%.

Now for 1d20 gaussian linear distribution, each side has an equal chance of show up at a rate of 5%. This low chance for a specific number tends to generate a lot of extremes as there is nothing constant. The only constant in a single die system are the modifiers as they are there to attempt to balance out the randomness, but it generally fails due to that a number on the die is still set at 5%.

1d100 systems that use 2d10 for resolution is a bit better due to the distribution. On a 1d100, each side has a 1% chance of appearing, but on 1d10 each side has a 10% chance. However, since 2d10 system specifies which of the two dice is the Tens place die and the other is the Ones place. The chance of rolling a single number is still at 10% because the Tens and Ones die do not combine.

2d8 would generate a bell curve if the lowest total is 2 and the highest total is 16. Each side on a d8 has a 12.5% chance of showing up and on 2d8 it doubles to 25% for a single number to show up on both dice. The downside is that it doesn't have the fine graduation that 3d6 systems does and the chances to hit the number needed is half in comparison.

Isn't math fun? :D

 

[JamesDixon]

Well the past sessions has been really awesome. In the first one we managed to free Incom scientists from a bounty hunter working for the Empire. The next one was to travel to Tython the home of the Je'daii Order and begin the trials to become Je'daii Rangers. On the way to the planet we ran into a pirate ship and managed to convince them to join with us. The party now has two freighters under our command. We found an old Je'daii training droid and took on a couple of flesh eaters. We managed to reprogram the droid and he joined the group.

Today's adventure was really cool because the Empire sent an Emperor's Hand and a squad of stormtroopers to attack these refugees that escaped. Due to some fabulous rolls, we managed to disable the Emperor's Hand by cutting off her leg and convinced her to join the group. We found out her name was Mara Jade and we severed her connection to the Emperor, so now she's free of his control. At the end, she ended up becoming a padawan to my character and is pursuing a life as a Je'daii.

We gave the refugees the stormtrooper transport and Mara's shuttle in exchange for an atmospheric processor. The plan is to use it to purchase a modified CR92a Assassin Class Corvette, hire a crew for it, and build a new Je'daii Temple. We haven't decided to build the temple on Tython or out in the Outer Rim/Unexplored Territories.

Kudos to Bren for making a great game.

 

[Excidium II]

Classic FFG.

 

[Xathrodox86]

FFG specialises in this kind of shit. They have some of the laziest, fucking rules in the industry.

 

[Fairfax]

I think the biggest ripoff is having most of the different races, class specializatiosn, enemies, items, ships, etc split between all modules they're selling. It's pretty stupid, because it only takes value away from the core books and encourages piracy.

Worst of all, it's not just within the same game. It's all spread over Edge of the Empire, Age of Rebellion and Force and Destiny. So the race you want might be in an AOR module, while the ship is in the EOTE rulebook, the class specialization is in a new F&D module, and the enemy type the DM wants to add is in some AOR book.

 

[Xathrodox86]

FFG specialises in this kind of shit. They have some of the laziest, fucking rules in the industry.

No, not really. I think that plum goes to any of the Rules-Lite systems. I know we all have a giga-hate boner for FFG for some autistic reason, but they're just jewing like everyone else does

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention their ludicrous prices. I don't mind their board games (just ordered the Warhammer Quest one), but their RPG's are too badly written for too high a price.