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EvOCHRON FFS!

Nedrah

Erudite
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
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Location
Germany
Hay,

so, why the fuck is no one talking about <A HREF="http://www.gameshark.com/reviews/2659/Evochron-Alliance-Review.htm">Evochron</a>?

It's a spacesim in the same vein as X3, but with several twists. You can switch between free-form non-linear gaming mode and a campaign (that really requires you to earn your spoils in free form before you even think about starting it). It has trading, fighting, faction fighting, you name it.

The game started as a one-man indie effort, but has gathered a small but devoted fanbase in the US and has recently made the jump to Europe. A recent Patch 2.0 upgraded everything, from graphics to various huge gameplay tweaks and enhancements.

How did I notice the game?
Well, not thanks to anyone pointing me to it. In fact, I found it in the Bargain Bin for a ridicolously low price, so I just had a look at the screenshots and decided to bring it home.
I can't believe no one knows about the game apparently.

Get a <A HREF="http://www.starwraith.com/EA20promo2.avi">Trailer</a> here.

Oh, you can also download an older spacesim at that site, too - it (the older game) is freeware.

Edit: Looks like it also has a "kind of sequel", which is essentially the same game but with many added features and new content.
 

Nedrah

Erudite
Joined
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Messages
1,693
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Germany
Meh, no spacesim people around? Think the game sucks? Too cheap to get the demo? What?
 

Psilon

Erudite
Joined
Feb 15, 2003
Messages
2,018
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Codex retirement
Actually I just saw your post. All spacesims are welcome on the hard drive of Psilon.

Looks pretty spiffy, especially the inertial navigation. I just hope combat doesn't suck if it's prevalent. After the disappointments that were X3 and Darkstar One, I'm not optimistic.
 

Nedrah

Erudite
Joined
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Messages
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Germany
Psilon said:
Actually I just saw your post. All spacesims are welcome on the hard drive of Psilon.

Looks pretty spiffy, especially the inertial navigation. I just hope combat doesn't suck if it's prevalent. After the disappointments that were X3 and Darkstar One, I'm not optimistic.

I assumed that some people might actually have overseen it, hence the bump.

The game is pretty hard and might kick your ass a lot in the begining, but it becomes pretty rewarding once you learn the ropes - that's what I hear, at least.
 

YourConscience

Scholar
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Messages
537
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In your head, obviously
I'm a spacesim fan as well. However, Evochron ist just kind of strange. Yes, it does have this and that very cool feature, such as seamless landings on planets, freeform trading, and even owning stations.

But the artistic side of things is what makes it strange. All Hud elements are made such that they are increadibly bright and glowing, while at the same time everything else in the game (i.e. the other ships, stations etc.) sometimes are even entirely invisible because of the lighting, often just barely visible. I once tried to bring that issue up on their forums, but the very rabid fans there nearly instantly made an idiot out of me. (Claiming that I'm just defending X3 which I brought in as examples or that I should just go and play another game) By now the corresponding thread has even been deleted.

Other things are strange too - you can own only your ship, hire a few mercs and possibly even buy an existing station. But unlike X3 that's pretty much it. You can't have a fleet, you cannot really wage full-blown wars or anything like that. Also, the upgrades are very unimaginative: It's Laser 1, 2, 3, ... 10. It's Shield 1, 2, 3, ... 10. And so on. Therefore the fun wears thin after a while, because even in the first half-hour of the game you know pretty much exactly what the best ship and loadout there is that can be bought. However, there are a few surprises, such as being able to find a super-weapon. Or the story line that's evolving around finding clues (I'm talking about allience 2.0 here) somewhere.

Space rangers 2 showed how upgrading a ship can be made interesting...

Oh, and yes, Darkstar One was a big disappointment. Have you tried spaceforce Rogue universe? http://www.spaceforce-game.com/news2.aspx

I haven't tried it yet, but it looks interesting.

I also have tarr chronicles sitting here, but due to it's non-freeform gameplay I haven't yet 'found the time' to install it.
 

Nedrah

Erudite
Joined
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Messages
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Germany
Hm, you make it sound like the game experience might wear thin after a while, indeed. Don't know about it, I was just extremely positively surprised by the game and wondered why no one ever talked about it - probably because noone knows it, or so I thought.
 

Jack_Deth

Augur
Patron
Joined
Dec 13, 2002
Messages
266
Insert Title Here
I spent my fair share of hours in X3, I like the game I just feel that it is really dry and time consuming, almost similar to an MMO but only single player.

I like the idea of seamless landing on planets but what does it really add to the gameplay? Are the planets really any different than a station?
 

Trash

Pointing and laughing.
Joined
Dec 12, 2002
Messages
29,683
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About 8 meters beneath sea level.
Space sims are cool. Remember that space wolves rts/rpg/space sim thingie? Well, it was pretty cool for its day. There was some talk of a sequell, but I never heard anything solid untill a few weeks ago. Found it at the mediamarket, it has an incredibly tacky box and was in the bargain bin. Still, it's a pretty cool game so far.

Basically just star wolves with a galaxy map. The voice acting is as bad as before and gameplay is just the same. Can't play it now, my x1950 is dying on me. But I'd guess some of you might like it if you enjoyed the first.
 

Nedrah

Erudite
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You know, I have been looking for a really decent game experience similar to elite+ or even Privateer since... well, ever. Somehow I don't dig the vegastrike based remakes, though. So, a game like Evochron is always very much appreciated...
 

YourConscience

Scholar
Joined
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Messages
537
Location
In your head, obviously
Jack_Deth said:
I like the idea of seamless landing on planets but what does it really add to the gameplay? Are the planets really any different than a station?

That's the point. Here seamless landing doesn't mean anything. Basically it makes those 'stations' (cities on the planet) just harder to reach because it takes longer because you have to fly slowlier due to the atmosphere. The only thing it influences positively is fights - it is a viable tactic to try to get away from a fight by dipping into the atmoshpere and then out of it again with the chasers still caught in it. Usually I die faster than that though.

Unfortunately, similar to X3big stations or ships are just that - big. They don't have different functions to parts of them. You don't have to land on the lower decks for repairs and on the middle decks for trading or something like that. (Hardwar had something like that with the different bays and their different functions)

You should certainly try at least the demo - it gives you one hour or so of play of the full version.

About X3: Yes, everyone agrees that it gets a chore at some point. I claim that it's because of the increadibly bad interface design which means that sending a group of fighters to some distant sector requires you to make no less than 40 keystrokes or much more instead of just lassoing them and clicking on the destination.

Also the fighting and flying model is bad: Unlike X-Wing you just bounce-lance instead of dog-fight (complete with chasing, trying to get someone off your tail and all what made X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter so awesome). At least the fighting is slightly more interesting in Evochron.

By the way, if you're looking for a more X-wingish experience in terms of combat, you might want to try the Starshatter: The Gathering Storm http://www.matrixgames.com/games/game.asp?gid=334

This one is very much fun and no one knows it. It is no free-form play, but the campaigns are dynamically generated. Basically you start out as a smallish figher pilot in a fleet that is pitted against another fleet. The campaign then consists of the AI duking it out with each other and you being the pilot on one of the two sides and the AI generates explicit missions for you in real-time.
 

YourConscience

Scholar
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In your head, obviously
Nedrah said:
You know, I have been looking for a really decent game experience similar to elite+ or even Privateer since... well, ever. Somehow I don't dig the vegastrike based remakes, though. So, a game like Evochron is always very much appreciated...

You might be interested in the fact that Elite 4 is being made right now. :)

And yes, I'm looking for something like that for ages now, too.

Edit: Before the arrival of Elite 4 you might want to give this a go: http://a-astra.com/
 

Trash

Pointing and laughing.
Joined
Dec 12, 2002
Messages
29,683
Location
About 8 meters beneath sea level.
You might be interested in the fact that Elite 4 is being made right now

You've got to be fucking kidding me? I've played these games to death in the old days (yup, even the original elite) and thought that after the bugstorm that was frontier the elite's just disappeared forever. This is great news. Is the sequel made by Braben again?
 

YourConscience

Scholar
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Messages
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In your head, obviously
I'm not kidding you. According to this German source: http://www.golem.de/0711/56084.html

which had an interview recently with Braben, there is the following citation from the writer of the interview:

Elite 4 konnte er bei seiner Präsentation auf dem Festival Gamecity Nottingham 2007 jedoch nur sagen, dass es "noch in dieser Konsolengeneration" erscheint.

which translates to: During his presentation on the Festival Gamecity Nottingham 2007 about Elite 4 he could only say that it will appear 'during the current concole generation'.

This, however, sounds very bad to me. Like, what, 'console generation'?? Will it be a console game?!

Never mind, go grab Ad Astra and tell me what you think about it. :)
 

Section8

Cipher
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
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Wardenclyffe
Hmm, I've given it a bit of a run, and I'm just not seeing anything to make it a must have. It's all very slick and competent, but I've spent most of my demo time limit on docking/landing, and that seems too much like work to me. I'd rather spend my time doing the fun stuff. Flying full throttle in a straight line for minutes at a time just isn't that exciting.

And I guess that is an artifact of the genre itself, since you have to make the player invest something into a trade route that is always going to be profitable, and the most logical investment is time - but for fuck's sake, it's a game, and it shouldn't drive me to play my Nintendo DS while I'm waiting for my space bus to dock.
 

DefJam101

Arcane
Joined
Nov 11, 2007
Messages
8,047
Location
Cybernegro HQ
Evochron isn't bad.. it's just that X2/X3 with a lot of mods tacked on is MUCH better.

Evochron is better than vanilla X3/X2, though... -toss in some mods and they are superb.
 

Nedrah

Erudite
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
1,693
Location
Germany
You know, a somewhat tedious start seems to be a common complaint about the game. They say it becomes very rewarding later. That being said, this game has the best fucking support ever.

See, I got the german version of the game, which comes without a cd key and can therefore not be upgraded to the digital only release 2.0 of the game. However, after posting at their forums and sending the developer of the game some pictures of the receipt and the box as proof of purchase, he personally sent me a cd key for the full digital version. Now, try doing something like that with EA. He also seems to be very devoted to his cause, maintaining and updating his games even after a successor is released.

So, yeah, the game may have its problems, but you are clearly supporting the good guy.
 

Kos_Koa

Iron Tower Studio
Developer
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Messages
315
I never got into space sims before. What games would be considered the best of the genre (including mods)? I heard about Freespace 2. Is that any good?
 

DraQ

Arcane
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Chrząszczyżewoszyce, powiat Łękołody
Kos_Koa said:
I never got into space sims before. What games would be considered the best of the genre (including mods)? I heard about Freespace 2. Is that any good?
The best of the genre:

Frontier: Elite 2.
And it's rushed and buggy, but still great successor - Frontier: First Encounters.
 

Nedrah

Erudite
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Messages
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Well, no, I wouldn't say it is any good.
I'd say it is fucking brilliant and one of the most shining examples of what the genre is capable of. Get the scp update (source code project, google it) and go have a blast! It's neither freeform nor non-linear though, just a really good story and some of the best space fights you are ever going to play.

Now, x2/x3 are good games, no doubt about it. However, the campaigns pretty much suck and they badly need some mods to handle some of the bigger annoyances. They are the right games if you dream of becoming some kind of space mogul, having your own fleets, running factorys, even waging war against whole races with the rights mods. Get ready for a lot of gruntwork and a daunting learning curve. I played X3 extensively, but sadly lost interest after I had finished the campaign. I plan to give it a go once I get my new hardware just for the gorgeous, shiney eyecandy I had to turn off before. Speaking of which, make sure you have a good CPU and graphics card by 2005/2006 standards if you want to run it like it was envisioned to be played. Even then, prepare for some issues when really obscenely huge fights occure.

If you feel oldschool, give Wing Commander 3 and 4 a go, if you feel ancient try Elite.
 

Nael

Arcane
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Messages
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Indy
I-War 1/2 are my personal favorites. The scale of the areas you explore are done better than any other "action-oriented" space-sims I've played. I-War 2 specifically is really very good. There's a bigger learning curve in the I-War games than most, but once you get the hang of it nothing else will be anywhere near as entertaining, I promise you :D
 

Nedrah

Erudite
Joined
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Messages
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Germany
So,
I pointed Evochrons Dev to this thread. His reply was a very diplomatic/PR'ish one, so I assume it should be ok to quote it here:

Thanks for the plug. EA often gets mixed reactions, it was the older, mid-level developed version of the concept that still needed a lot of fine tuning and enhancements for many players. Renegades is the latest version and provides many of the features players have requested and asked to have changed/added to EA. If anyone would like to check out this latest version, www.evochronrenegades.com is the game's official website.

So, yeah, if anyone feels like trying that one, let us know how much of a step forward it is.
 

YourConscience

Scholar
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Feb 9, 2006
Messages
537
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In your head, obviously
Well, just buy it and give us an account at which point you either gave up or it became rewarding. :)

Actually, I think that probably the demo isn't helping here, because the one hour limit aggravates the annoyance about the tedious parts of the game - the long landings and the long flying (sometimes). It aggravates because you know you only have so and so many minutes left and so many of them are spent - just landing. And especially if you are new to this game you don't know yet how to speed up the process.

A different kind of demo - one which lets you play unlimited, but contains only the first two-three systems would probably do a better job at converting new players. During that time limit you anyway don't have a chance to see more, even if you know what you're doing.

Oh, and turning around the visuals - making the space much more visible and the hud much less visible would help too, probably. Look at homeworld for a perfect example. But then again this might turn off the present fan-base which made it very clear to me that they do like it the way it is now.

But, of course, that's only my very subjective opinions. :)

@Nael: I-War and 2, of course is a classic. It is *such* a pity that it is essentially discontinued and that I-War2 wasn't as free-form as it was planned to be. It's also a pity that the Torn Stars, unstable space and edge of chaos mods have not been finished. However, the new team might actually finish it: http://www.torn-stars.com/
(that site seems nearly broken)
 

Nedrah

Erudite
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Germany
Well, see, I can't play Evocbhron: Renegades right now. I am pretty sure that it would be pretty hard to go back to (my full version of) Alliance afterwards, which would mean I'd have to spend money again on the new game.

Thank you for mentioning that I-Wars mod. Another game that will collect Dust until someone decides his mod is finished - reminds me of Kotor2 and Team Gizka (Hurry up, damn it).
 

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