Grimoire Thread

[Roguey]

It's terrible compared to Might and Magic 3-5, but JVC was always cutting edge when it came to dumbing down (featuring automaps, minimaps, journals, and visible monsters far before Wizardry ever did).

FTFY.

Grimoire also features a journal (that can have hints disabled for a slight xp bonus sure) and automapping (which could serve as a minimap if not for the fact that it's hidden away and takes away your viewspace when enabled). The lack of visible monsters are a technical limitation (I mean ideally you'd at least be able to see friendlies wandering about in the world before you step on their square, though their absence in pre-6 M&M was in fact a technical limitation).

 

[Celerity]

Deep Freeze does a save vs death or shatter or whatever.

If it passes the enemy still takes a lot of cold damage.

I thought of that in 0.1337 seconds. Thank me later.

 

[jfunk]

So you prefer combat that is random to combat that is strategic?

That is an opinion, not an argument.

Err, strategic does not mean static results to decisions. Not sure why you would even try to suggest that.

Of course it's an opinion, I even stated as much, thanks for repeating that. Your opinion is stupid horseshit. IMO.

You're literally arguing that every time a soldier pulls the trigger on his weapon, he should hit his target. Otherwise, there's no strategy. Really sound reasoning there. I suppose when generals are gathered in the war room trying to decide how to proceed in a campaign, they know with 100% certainty that every order they hand down will be will return specific results, because strategy. Damn life and its stupid RNG.

By the way, there's a difference between strategy and tactics. Deciding whether or not your X-COM solider tries a difficult long-range shot or runs for cover isn't a strategic decision, it's a tactical one. Which mission you deployed the squad to and which rooms you build in your base are strategic decisions.

You know, now that you mention it the missions in X-COM shouldn't even exist. Why would they, when the strategic map should tell you precisely what the outcome of the decision to send them on the mission is? I mean, if the results of the decision are not predetermined then there's no strategy at all, it's just randomness and that's poor design. When I am deciding on a mission, it should tell me which soldiers will be injured, how many hostages will be rescued, and what loot it will return. Then I just click on it and it happens. You know, because that's how strategy works.

I expect you will actually provide some logical insight to your position in your next response, rather than simply name a game that doesn't have RNG (which by the way I already did for you in my original response so that's not really new input).

 

[Lady_Error]

There is nothing wrong with Grimoire's UI, in particular not if you compare to 1993 games.

It's terrible compared to Might and Magic 3-5, but JVC was always cutting edge when it came to accessibility (featuring automaps, minimaps, journals, and visible monsters far before Wizardry ever did).

Grimoire has an automap and even autowalking, and it also has a journal. Visible wandering monsters is not a part of the UI.

 

[udm]

What difficulty are you all playing on?

On master right now. I would have gone for superhero but somehow i think this may be a troll difficulty level.

what does the difficulty setting do? Give enemies more hps? Anything else? Anybody knows?

More (wandering?) monsters per encounter, and it also seems like they deal more damage and have higher chance to hit at Superhero difficulty.

Of course this was surmised from 5 minutes of testing (Superhero vs Novice), so take it with a pinch of salt.

 

[Irenaeus]

Better yet: I bought your game on steam but with every patch you release I reinstall, copy the Grimoire folder to somewhere else and start the game from there. That way the steam clock is frozen at my 26 minutes and I still get to profit from your upcoming week's update efforts before I hit the refund button.
very consumer-friendly <3

You are such an insufferable faggot that I will follow Cleve's lead and thrust you in the Hall of Shame along with the other losers and parasites that drag this community down.

[IGNORE]

 

[Reapa]

just killed the 3 suckers in the woods. with just 2 fairies. how exactly is this a hard game again? i'm thinking of dropping my self made fairy and running an all npc party.

 

[Trash Player]

Almost there, guys.

Btw, how high are your levels?

 

[CarlWinslow]

Does anyone know a good magnifier? Windows magnifier doesn't work well for playing games. I can't see this game without one but if I play in fullscreen I cant use any other programs because the game won't minimize.

 

[Winslow]

More (wandering?) monsters per encounter, and it also seems like they deal more damage and have higher chance to hit at Superhero difficulty.

Of course this was surmised from 5 minutes of testing (Superhero vs Novice), so take it with a pinch of salt.

They deal the same damage but groups at superhero can have up to 5 times the amount of enemies as they do on rookie, so 5 times the chances for hitting you. Some monsters always come as single unit though and they're exactly the same on both difficulties.

 

[Trash Player]

just killed the 3 suckers in the woods. with just 2 fairies. how exactly is this a hard game again? i'm thinking of dropping my self made fairy and running an all npc party.

RPCs range from "similar to generated pcs" to "seems like beaten the game twice already". Rosy is a clutch character that can easily trivialize the early part of the game, so it is kinda normal.

 

[Irenaeus]

I define finish as done everything in the game. Which is what I'm doing, everything that is possible in a single run.

Maybe by 600 hours Cleve means doing all the different endings. For instance, if there are 4 different endings and one playthrough might take 125 hours, if you do them all you will take 600 hours. I'm just guessing here.

 

[udm]

They deal the same damage but groups at superhero can have up to 5 times the amount of enemies as they do on rookie, so 5 times the chances for hitting you. Some monsters always come as single unit though and they're exactly the same on both difficulties.

Good to know, thanks. Leaving difficulty at Superhero then

Also:

Infinitron knowing all the right places to look into, as usual

 

[Viata]

I define finish as done everything in the game. Which is what I'm doing, everything that is possible in a single run.

Maybe by 600 hours Cleve means doing all the different endings. For instance, if there are 4 different endings and one playthrough might take 125 hours, if you do them all you will take 600 hours. I'm just guessing here.

Let's not forget that Cleve also had to remove things to release V1. Can't wait until final version is released.

Almost there, guys.

Btw, how high are your levels?

9.

 

[Vrab]

So you prefer combat that is random to combat that is strategic?

It requires a sweet spot really. I was driven nuts in 2012 Xcom because at the beginning you only have 4 soldiers who can each only shoot once. This means that once you do everything in your power to get the highest possible chance to hit and allow lowest possible chance for the enemy to do the same, you can still have your guys miss and then get one shot in return. Later on when number of soldiers and number of times they can fire as well as amount of hitpoints increase, this problem is largely eliminated and it's more... tactical, and less about luck. Terror from the Deep, which is the Xcom game I played back then, was different because number of soldiers was higher and they could typically fire several times. Hence you could usually compensate for those jinxed misses.

But there has to be some unpredictability (yes, an opinion!), otherwise things get too bland. In Age of Wonders 3 hits are guaranteed, but damage values still vary and of course there is still chance based system to resisting various effects. And this is really as little rng as I'd be prepared to deal with. Battle Brothers on the other hand, with it's traditional chance to hit system, struck a fine balance with number of characters and number of attempts making outcomes of your attempts sufficiently stable and predictable to feel like you're not being cheated. Either way works, and both ways retain some level of unpredictability.

 

[Trash Player]

Almost there, guys.

Btw, how high are your levels?

9.

Wow, so class change is pretty much irrelevant.

 

[Viata]

Almost there, guys.

Btw, how high are your levels?

9.

Wow, so class change is pretty much irrelevant.

Well, I'd not say that. I'll play it again when Cleve balance the game, then every exploit may not work anymore and class change will become relevant, or I hope so.

 

[Irenaeus]

Almost there, guys.

Btw, how high are your levels?

9.

Wow, so class change is pretty much irrelevant.

Looks like there is tons of balancing to do yet.

 

[Brozef]

Damn. I need to take a minute and express just how amazing this game is. I just can't fathom that something like it exists.
After all these years, Cleve actually delivered. Not only that, but he actually made a game that is exceeding all possible expectations. All this time he has spent shitposting on the codex, he actually had this game sitting there, growing in his vault. Every wild boast, about making the most awesome game of all time. It was all true...

I literally can not remember when I have ever been this happy with a game. The last thing that came close was Dwarf Fortress (btw, why can't I use my DF avatar! DECLINE!), but that mainly due to the pure blissful autism. I never dared to hope I'll ever enjoy a real cRPG again. I thought the best thing I could hope for was another MMX. A heavily flawed game which at least retains some semblance of the good old times. But now this? This massive INCLINE? How is this possible? This truly is the best timeline.

I just hope he doesn't succumb to the cries of the masses and gives in to further popamoleification. Enabling Auto-Updates in Steam is already questionable imho and the massive reduction in encounters is another step in the wrong direction (I have to play on Master+Onslaught to have the same experience I had on Novice+Rare), but I hope the Thal will stand his ground from now on. I hope he takes his time with any meaningful new content, maybe aside from the crafting since Metallurgy, Nature Lore and Mephistics are useless atm. Everything on top he should bundle up and sell as DLC. The game is far too cheap for what it is. Grimoire should not be compared to all the feeble turds that clog the digestive track of Steam. It is much more comparable to high brow pursuits for monocled gentlemen and should be priced accordingly. Seriously, think Wargaming. Most of the titles are 100$. This would also help keep the usual riff-raff of Steamtards, Inidies, and NEETs out.

Thank you Cleveland Messiah Blakemore


Oh, and two things I haven't seen mentioned earlier.

• It seems Fatal Blow doesn't proc on Metalsmiths. I have a party with a Berserker, Ranger and Metalsmith. At appr. 20 it started proccing reliably for the other two, but the Smith is shit outta luck. Could it be a bug or is there some interaction with other stats?
• Hide and Backstab are completely useless. Even with 100 Stealth my Thief can only hide if all enemies are CC'ed. If Backstab procs it also only does double damage, which seems pretty underwhelming. Maybe it will improve with levels (only around 20ish atm), but comparing it to the Serker it seems laughably bad.

 

[Invictus]

Learn the difference between OR and AND

What is wrong with you guys? Dyslexia?

...That way the steam clock is frozen at my 26 minutes...

...still get to profit from your upcoming week's updates...

..if the request is made within fourteen days of purchase, and the title has been played for less than two hours...

Bought the game sunday, have another 6 days time before the refund timer runs out. Both fucking conditions met. Your point was...?

Can someone put this idiot out of his misery? Gloating over wanting to refund the game, general smartassery and "I win" attitude... somebody ban his ass at least

 

[Lady_Error]

Looks like there is tons of balancing to do yet.

And Cleve knows that. You can still have an excellent Jester, a pretty good Templar and probably also the other prestige classes by recruiting NPC's.

just killed the 3 suckers in the woods. with just 2 fairies. how exactly is this a hard game again? i'm thinking of dropping my self made fairy and running an all npc party.

If you really want to show off, don't pick up Little Rosy.

 

[Roguey]

Grimoire has an automap and even autowalking, and it also has a journal. Visible wandering monsters is not a part of the UI.

It doesn't have an always-present minimap, and as I recall, M&M's journal and inventory don't require near as many clicks. I don't feel like digging it out and reinstalling to confirm.

 

[buru5]

Cleve could've been factoring in replayability. You can't play every class on one playthrough. You can't use every race on one playthrough. You probably can't even hit max level by the end of the game, so you have to factor in grinding into the max playtime as well. Also, you can't steal a quest item on one playthrough while simultaneously getting it legitimately, so there's even more replayability. You can't murder Little Rosy and also take her with you, etc etc.

Or it could be that there is a lot of backtracking during the endgame.

 

[Winslow]

• It seems Fatal Blow doesn't proc on Metalsmiths. I have a party with a Berserker, Ranger and Metalsmith. At appr. 20 it started proccing reliably for the other two, but the Smith is shit outta luck. Could it be a bug or is there some interaction with other stats?

While Cleve claims that critical strikes can occur from either using a weapon with *lethal* tag OR having the Lethalblow skill, in my experience you need both on the same character to ever have it happen.

 

[Lady_Error]

Cleve could've been factoring in replayability. You can't play every class on one playthrough. You can't use every race on one playthrough. You probably can't even hit max level by the end of the game, so you have to factor in grinding into the max playtime as well. Also, you can't steal a quest item on one playthrough while simultaneously getting it legitimately, so there's even more replayability. You can't murder Little Rosy and also take her with you, etc etc.

Or it could be that there is a lot of backtracking during the endgame.

I'm sure the game has up to 600 hours on hardest setting with onslaught wandering monsters. The backtracking takes no time at all, by the way - there is autowalk and there are Moongate teleporters later.