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KickStarter Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption - adventure-RPG from the creators of Quest for Glory

MRY

Wormwood Studios
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I have a great deal of respect for their stubbornness. Very few artists have the integrity to really stick to their guns. Even in it meant losing their home, they'd never make a QFG-like game. Before long it'll be Hoyle card games where you play against cowladins.
 

Hellion

Arcane
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A story-driven Dr. Brain clone in a more "mature" setting sounds much more interesting than Summer Daze. But then again so does a steaming pile of cowladin shit, so the bar isn't that high.

I would check out their demo/prototype, at the very least.
 

MRY

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ITT, people still think that a "Dr. Brain clone" would be a "Dr. Brain clone"! New Project : Dr. Brain :: Hero-U : QFG.
 
Last edited:

DeepOcean

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It is a pity, Hero U had serious issues but I had fun with it and played non stop until the end (even if I got disappointed by the end), I liked that it felt like a Persona game and I got entertained by it, unfortunately, it is a Persona game with zero complexity and very short at that, the puzzles are easy mode all the way, the main plot is just background and barely there (the characters are well written though) and the combat needed ALOT of work but I liked the Harry Potter style school. With a few tweaks, it could be the start of a really good series.

I think the most controversial decision they made was with the 3d art and I think that, in the end, really limited the appeal for the game, the art of the game isnt that bad when you play the game but to sell on Steam, even if your game is cheap, it shouldnt LOOK cheap (a good artist with a good taste on art direction isnt that easy to find though), the animations and character models were really weak and the enviroment art was also lacking on many places. 3d art makes sense as low poly art is easier to make but it is undeniable that it lacks the charm of a QfG game and I disagree with Corey that they wouldnt be able to make a new QfG style game as Quest for Infamy is proof.

I would buy a sequel, no doubt about that, it is a pity that by the looks of it, it wont materialize.
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
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Three separate groups of amateur developers made QFG clones on minimal budgets (QFI, Heroine's Quest, Mage's Initiation). You would think that adding the prestige and experience of the Coles, you could make an even better game for less money.
 

ghostdog

Arcane
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Three separate groups of amateur developers made QFG clones on minimal budgets (QFI, Heroine's Quest, Mage's Initiation). You would think that adding the prestige and experience of the Coles, you could make an even better game for less money.
The problem is that many of these big-shot developers of the yesteryear don't really want to make clones of their earlier games, because they're not the fans of those games --they're the creators-- so they try to make something different and maybe overambitious, to show they still got it (or something like that).
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
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Yes, I've said that myself many times (in this thread, I think!), but they should be candid about that.
 

fantadomat

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Yes, I've said that myself many times (in this thread, I think!), but they should be candid about that.
Still doesn't explain how they managed to burn trough that much money and deliver nothing of value.

Is your company california based? Is adventure game development that expensive? From what you had said about it,it sounds like it should be pretty reasonable.
 

MRY

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There's no company, really, and the group of us who work on adventure games just work for future royalties, so I can't really say.
 

fantadomat

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There's no company, really, and the group of us who work on adventure games just work for future royalties, so I can't really say.
:nocountryforshitposters:
Don't be so anal lol,you got what i was asking. You are as much company as two married boomers are. Also you are registered,thus you are a company.
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
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Registered?

California is expensive. I have no idea how much I'd need to make in game development if I didn't have a day job, but I do have a day job, so I don't care what I make in game development. The idea of hazarding my home and my family's well-being on an adventure game could not be more antithetical to my values, so I'm the wrong person to ask here. The only reason I do game development is because of the satisfaction it brings me; that is a luxury good that I would sacrifice long before I'd jeopardize things. So if you said, "MRY, quit your dayjob and become a game developer, what would I have to pay you?" the price would be way higher than what the Coles paid. A very successful company once tried to tempt me with (a likely illusory or "in the future?") $250k/year to go into game design professionally, and it held no interest.
 

Morpheus Kitami

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I have fond memories of both Dr Brain games and would gladly play a clone. I'm sure I would enjoy it more than I enjoyed Hero U tbqh.
There's more than two. Lost Mind and Time Warp were also pretty good, albeit more puzzley games. I'm sure if you grew up with the first two they'd be heresy. I grew up with Time Warp, so I don't care as much for the first two. There are even ones not made by Sierra. Knowledge Adventure made three or four. The action-adventure one was pretty good to my 10-year-old mind centuries ago, but it resists attempts to play it on most emulators I tried. There's also a new one, a Jumpstart game, wrap your mind around that one.
Three separate groups of amateur developers made QFG clones on minimal budgets (QFI, Heroine's Quest, Mage's Initiation). You would think that adding the prestige and experience of the Coles, you could make an even better game for less money.
Someone in the Summer Daze thread said it best, they're shit at managing money. Without someone like Ken Williams keeping a firm schedule there's no reason why they can't do whatever the hell they want. You know, except never releasing a game.
The problem is that many of these big-shot developers of the yesteryear don't really want to make clones of their earlier games, because they're not the fans of those games --they're the creators-- so they try to make something different and maybe overambitious, to show they still got it (or something like that).
Hmm, this reminds me of Akira Kurosawa. Now, let me be clear, not because the Coles are in any way comparable to him quality-wise. Kurosawa made some...okay films in his later career. Ran being the best of the bunch and the rest being...eh. Kurosawa made a bunch of similarly off-the-wall stuff later in his career, like the Coles are just now doing. Come to think of it, no one said no to Kurosawa and he was funded by his fans...History repeats itself I guess.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I don't think "shit at managing money' captures the scope of the Coles' issues. They're eccentrics, plain and simple. It's clear that they don't want to learn the things that they'd have to learn and deal with the people that they'd have to deal with in order to produce a QFG-like game.
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
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They were pretty explicit that the QFG games were compromises and that Hero-U is the game they always wanted to make. Maybe that’s a distorted perspective for them, but it’s entirely possible that as with, say, Lucas, there was a wild greatness that needed someone else to shape it. Not to manage the money. To manage the design and concept.
 

fantadomat

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They were pretty explicit that the QFG games were compromises and that Hero-U is the game they always wanted to make. Maybe that’s a distorted perspective for them, but it’s entirely possible that as with, say, Lucas, there was a wild greatness that needed someone else to shape it. Not to manage the money. To manage the design and concept.
Ahhh as any good game,it is a team accomplishment. We had seen plenty of times by now how game dev "legends" ending up creating shit games. I don't remember a single old dev that delivered on his promise. When games are made,people do throw ideas out and end up rubbing it in the game,it not something that a single dev creates.
 

Morpheus Kitami

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I don't think "shit at managing money' captures the scope of the Coles' issues. They're eccentrics, plain and simple. It's clear that they don't want to learn the things that they'd have to learn and deal with the people that they'd have to deal with in order to produce a QFG-like game.
Maybe you're right. Needing a Ken Williams is perhaps the key point, someone to rein in the bullshit.
Ahhh as any good game,it is a team accomplishment. We had seen plenty of times by now how game dev "legends" ending up creating shit games. I don't remember a single old dev that delivered on his promise. When games are made,people do throw ideas out and end up rubbing it in the game,it not something that a single dev creates.
Uh...Jane Jensen's game? I've only heard good things about it. The studio failed, but that was simply because nobody buys adventure games anymore...so people say.
Three separate groups of amateur developers made QFG clones on minimal budgets (QFI, Heroine's Quest, Mage's Initiation). You would think that adding the prestige and experience of the Coles, you could make an even better game for less money.
Didn't they have the musician from Mage's Initiation on Hero-U? I know they had him on Summer Daze. Sure, its the musician, but even the bassist has something to contribute. +M
 

Viata

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When things like this happens I always wonder if the original team was really great or it was pure luck from the game designer/director. I mean, how many times have we seen this same thing?
Hello guys, I'm the creator of X game (series), yes that amazing game(series) that you loved a lot decades ago, and I'm making this new game I'd love if you guys could support us(me) on kickstarter
Months later, the game is released and it's shit. It's horrible. So bad you guys move on to another kickstarter from someone that also made a old game someone here loved. And this happens again.
Kickstarter taught me that I'll never trust in a guy that made a game I love unless the original team(yes, the whole team, all programmers that were able to create that guy's vision) is making this new game.
 

MRY

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I think maybe the thing is to really listen hard as they explain concretely what it is about the old game they want to recreate. What it means to them might be different.
 
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The Coles are pretty much the embodiment of every meme about boomers you can think of. They seem like nice, ingenuous people, but they’re clearly living in a world that no longer exists, and their weird intransigence about what their fan base actually wants versus what they’re providing is bizarre.

A Dr. Brain clone could be fun I guess, but I have zero faith that’s what would be made. From what Corey says it sounds like the best case scenario would be a Professor Layton clone, probably with much worse art and a 4-6 year development time.

By the way what’s up with the Dr. Brain rights? They’re one of the more notable omissions from Sierra’s catalogue on the digital storefronts.
 

Morpheus Kitami

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By the way what’s up with the Dr. Brain rights? They’re one of the more notable omissions from Sierra’s catalogue on the digital storefronts.
Jumpstart. Jumpstart owns him now. I'm guessing they don't believe in rereleasing their old games. I don't believe any old edutainment games they've snapped up over the years have appeared on any store. Probably don't want to do customer service for them.
https://www.jumpstart.com/customercare/game-manual/adventures-of-dr-brain#
 
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By the way what’s up with the Dr. Brain rights? They’re one of the more notable omissions from Sierra’s catalogue on the digital storefronts.
Jumpstart. Jumpstart owns him now. I'm guessing they don't believe in rereleasing their old games. I don't believe any old edutainment games they've snapped up over the years have appeared on any store. Probably don't want to do customer service for them.
https://www.jumpstart.com/customercare/game-manual/adventures-of-dr-brain#


Reading up on them, this seems like a fascinating company that I know nothing about, despite having a longstanding interest in edutainment (I'm about 8 years too old to have interacted with their very specific demographic targeting). Based on what I've been able to glean it seems more like they don't realize they hold anything of value rather than they don't want to support a back-catalogue. This is a company founded by an apparent altruist that then (the company, not the altruist) very quickly pivoted towards being a cashcow after stumbling on unexpected and outsized success. This in turn led them to explore the F2P MMO edutainment market (which is apparently a thing?) before ultimately being bought up by a Chinese megacorp.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying anyone is going to rake in millions selling copies of The Island of Dr. Brain at $10 a pop, but the front end cost of making it run on modern machines is negligible; it works great on DosBox already (afaik, haven't actually tested it, but every other Sierra game of the era does and they all use the same engine so I can't imagine it's any different), and paying someone to make a wrapper for the launcher is a couple day's work tops. It feels much more like they just don't realize they could make a couple thousand bucks on it OR *dons tinfoil hat* they're not actually sure that their acquisition of the IP entitles them to the distribution rights of the older entries and have just decided not to risk possibly being taken to court.
 
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If I made a Hero-U game in the style we made Quest for Infamy, it'd be pretty cool.
Steve, every game you've made is pretty cool. I think pretty much everyone in this thread -even those who (like myself) largely enjoyed Hero-U- have to suppress a massive facepalm anytime the Kickstarter totals of QfI and Hero-U are compared.
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
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If I made a Hero-U game in the style we made Quest for Infamy, it'd be pretty cool.
Did you ever reach out to the Coles?

To be honest, this seems like such a natural proposition -- and perhaps a way to bring a little light into dark patches for you and them.
 

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