How do you feel about the RPG Renaissance?

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Now that the dust has settled, how do you feel about the RPG Renaissance that began in 2012 when the Pillars of Eternity Kickstarter went live Legend of Grimrock released? Please vote.

I don't usually write "I fixed it for you", but I fixed it for you.

 

[SausageInYourFace]

This is how the term was most widely used on the Codex in the last couple of years:

The first wave of the isometric RPG renaissance was the games that were crowdfunded in 2012. Wasteland 2, Pillars of Eternity, Divinity: Original Sin, Shadowrun Returns, Banner Saga, Expeditions: Conquistador, etc.

The term was also used outside of the Codex. Like here: https://www.pcgamer.com/2014-the-first-year-of-the-crpg-renaissance/

But thanks to M'lady we now have to clarify what we mean.

 

[Infinitron]

I get the impression that Lilura uses the term "Renaissance" the way she does partly in order to denigrate those RPGs. "No, this was the REAL Renaissance!"

 

[Ol' Willy]

I would like to point out that AoD and Underrail were in development long before all this kickstarter business.

 

[Grauken]

I get the impression that Lilura uses the term "Renaissance" the way she does partly in order to denigrate those RPGs. "No, this was the REAL Renaissance!"

Well, where most normal codexers just denigrate RPGs by shit-talking on the forum, she went above and beyond by creating her blog to put all non-Lilura-Renaissance RPGs down. Truly a magnificent endeavor of autism

 

[Reina]

So, how long 'till RPG Baroque then?

 

[Verylittlefishes]

There is no RPG Reneissance and all Kickstarter RPG projects were a disaster.

 

[Maxie]

a renaissance takes places if there's lost continuity between old masters of a craft and new generation which unearths their techniques and sensibilities against the popular cultural current
in adventure games you can safely claim a renaissance ensued since the pixelart point&clicks from the last decade have arguably little to do with the 2000s games
in rpgs there's no renaissance, the games are being churned out by fat has-beens, same dumb-looking faces the industry has hosted since the 90s

 

[Sweeper]

and all Kickstarter RPG projects were a disaster.

That says more about you than PFKM tbh.

 

[Van-d-all]

The what now? Frequency of good RPGs is still way below of what it was in the 90s.

 

[Verylittlefishes]

The what now? Frequency of good RPGs is still way below of what it was in the 90s.

FromSoftware is the new Black Isle by terms of productivity/quality.
But this is not REAL RPGS, I understand.

 

[Grauken]

The what now? Frequency of good RPGs is still way below of what it was in the 90s.

FromSoftware is the new Black Isle by terms of productivity/quality.

But this is not REAL RPGs, I understand.

Correct

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

If by renaissance you mean ex-BI/Interplay people pretending they (still) know how to make games then lol.

If by renaissance you mean stuff like Grimrock, Underrail or Kingmaker then it was OK and fairly enjoyable, although not really all that. I still kinda hope that Wrath may become my first genuine classic since Wiz8, but I'm ready to get disappointed

 

[Thac0]

Optimistic. The western rpg has become a real market factor, and there are like a dozen rpgs of different budgets in the works. They surely can't all be bad, right?

 

[Sweeper]

FromSoftware is the new Black Isle by terms of productivity/quality.

Optimistic. The western rpg has become a real market factor, and there are like a dozen rpgs of different budgets in the works. They surely can't all be bad, right?

There's two.
Realms Beyond
WotR
Then I expect we wait a couple of more years barring any indie autism projects.

 

[Grauken]

a renaissance takes places if there's lost continuity between old masters of a craft and new generation which unearths their techniques and sensibilities against the popular cultural current
in adventure games you can safely claim a renaissance ensued since the pixelart point&clicks from the last decade have arguably little to do with the 2000s games
in rpgs there's no renaissance, the games are being churned out by fat has-beens, same dumb-looking faces the industry has hosted since the 90s

Good point, though obviously wrong as we had the likes of Age of Decadence, Underrail, Knights of the Chalice, Legends of Xulima, Paper Sorcerer, Legends of Grimrock 2, Expeditions Vikings and Disco Elysium that represent a veritable renaissance

 

[overly excitable young man]

2015 alone was a phenomenal year. I have nothing against only 0-2 good rpgs coming out in one year.
And with Realms Beyond, Colony Ship and maybe Solasta on the way it will turn out great.
When developers can't deliver you can still play stuff like Fallout Sonora.

 

[Thac0]

Realms Beyond

Heard that is dead already.

But Elex 2 will be that spark that ignites the fires of Eurojank!
Also I still have hope for Cyberpunk. And for BG3. And for some arcane reason for Avowed. And Wasteland 3 and Steel Rising and and and...
And that is if you cut the indies like Colony Ship, which are much more likely to deliver good games.

 

[Sweeper]

Heard that is dead already.

I'm so used to disappointment that shit like this doesn't even register.
I lied, it registers a lot.

 

[Falksi]

Mixed bag, but I'm glad it happened.

Hard to generalise really though, so looking individually at the ones which I've played............


The Good

• Shadowrun Returns - Brilliant bite-sized appetiser to prep you for Dragonfall. love the murder-mystery plot.

• Shadowrun Dragonfall - Shit-hot all round. One of the best games of the decade. Pretty much everything is done extremely well.

• Blackguards - Could have done with some more traditional RPG explorations elements to break it up a bit, but a really fun & solid game with some great battle scenarios.

• Tyranny - My PC couldn't handle the game after around 12 hours, but I absolutely fucking loved those initial 12 hours big time.

• Underail - Does a load of things right, with superb combat & really fun exploration. Just needed more meat to the story.

The Average

• POE - Average at best. Played it around 3/4's of the way through and enjoyed it to some degree. But combat really lacked & was too repetitive, the predictable structure + lack of C&C made any later playthrough attempts redundant, and there were also crippling bugs too. Overall it felt like a half-done job.

• Shadowrun Hong Kong - Dropped the ball here. Too text heavy & loses all the tight paced-ness of dragonfall. Still Ok though.

• Banner Saga - A bit lacklustre & dull at times, but really moody & great vibe to it all. Not great, first 2 parts way better than the disappointing 3rd part, but still worth playing.

• Serpent in the Staglands - WONDERFUL vibe, awesome opening & setup, drew me in and had me enamoured. Only to then delivered a fairly bland, poorly paced game with a crap magic system & dull combat. Massive shame

The Bad & Ugly

• Wasteland 2 - Bag of fucking wank. Dull as hell, crap pointless combat with no real challenge, awkward to play in general.

• Divinity: Original Sin - A mish-mash of good CRPG & modern RPG ingredients which to me really doesn't work as a whole. Whereas Dragon Age: Origins feels like a great blend of old & new, this seems to somehow take the worst elements of both & meshes them together

• Torment: TON - Dull as fuck text bomb which drains the soul out of any creature with life still left in them.

• Age of Decadence - Noble attempt at something more realistic, which forgets that realism isn't always fun, and ends up being a real slog.

So I definitely think it's been worth it. It's just a shame that some of those titles didn't avoid falling into what seems like very obvious pitfalls. Most of the average/shit games felt like they were started with enthusiasm, but the devs didn't have the stamina to see them through fully to brilliance.

Serpent in the Staglands was the fucker. I fell in love with that game from the off, but it just didn't deliver.

 

[Verylittlefishes]

Mixed bag, but I'm glad it happened.

Hard to generalise really though, so looking individually at the ones which I've played............


The Good

• Shadowrun Returns - Brilliant bite-sized appetiser to prep you for Dragonfall. love the murder-mystery plot.

• Shadowrun Dragonfall - Shit-hot all round. One of the best games of the decade. Pretty much everything is done extremely well.

• Blackguards - Could have done with some more traditional RPG explorations elements to break it up a bit, but a really fun & solid game with some great battle scenarios.

• Tyranny - My PC couldn't handle the game after around 12 hours, but I absolutely fucking loved those initial 12 hours big time.

• Underail - Does a load of things right, with superb combat & really fun exploration. Just needed more meat to the story.

The Average

• POE - Average at best. Played it around 3/4's of the way through and enjoyed it to some degree. But combat really lacked & was too repetitive, the predictable structure + lack of C&C made any later playthrough attempts redundant, and there were also crippling bugs too. Overall it felt like a half-done job.

• Shadowrun Hong Kong - Dropped the ball here. Too text heavy & loses all the tight paced-ness of dragonfall. Still Ok though.

• Banner Saga - A bit lacklustre & dull at times, but really moody & great vibe to it all. Not great, first 2 parts way better than the disappointing 3rd part, but still worth playing.

• Serpent in the Staglands - WONDERFUL vibe, awesome opening & setup, drew me in and had me enamoured. Only to then delivered a fairly bland, poorly paced game with a crap magic system & dull combat. Massive shame

The Bad & Ugly

• Wasteland 2 - Bag of fucking wank. Dull as hell, crap pointless combat with no real challenge, awkward to play in general.

• Divinity: Original Sin - A mish-mash of good CRPG & modern RPG ingredients which to me really doesn't work as a whole. Whereas Dragon Age: Origins feels like a great blend of old & new, this seems to somehow take the worst elements of both & meshes them together

• Torment: TON - Dull as fuck text bomb which drains the soul out of any creature with life still left in them.

• Age of Decadence - Noble attempt at something more realistic, which forgets that realism isn't always fun, and ends up being a real slog.

So I definitely think it's been worth it. It's just a shame that some of those titles didn't avoid falling into what seems like very obvious pitfalls. Most of the average/shit games felt like they were started with enthusiasm, but the devs didn't have the stamina to see them through fully to brilliance.

Serpent in the Staglands was the fucker. I fell in love with that game from the off, but it just didn't deliver.

So you loved Tyranny and didn't like The Age of Decadence.
Interesting.

 

[Falksi]

So you loved Tyranny and didn't like The Age of Decadence.
Interesting.

The difference in them was absolute night & day IMO. As I say, I only played 12 hours of Tyranny so that may change when I'm able to play it through fully, but I slipped into it easy as can be. AOD felt like a constant fucking battle against one of numerous obstacles, both gaming & technical.

 

[Thac0]

Torment: TON - Dull as fuck text bomb which drains the soul out of any creature with life still left in them.

The only hinderance for me to brofist this. One of my favourite renaissance rpgs. Then again I read through Memory, Sorrow and Thorn so I am thoroughly immunised to the concept of a text bomb.

 

[Silverfish]

Impressed. The renaissance isn't on a par with the 90's, but damn, after stuff like Fallout 3 it's a minor miracle.

 

[Butter]

The past 8 years have given us Underrail, Grimoire, Pathfinder: Kingmaker, Age of Decadence/Dungeon Rats, ATOM RPG, and Kingdom: Come Deliverance. That's certainly more than we got out of the 8 years previous.