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CRPGAddict

Grauken

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lol, now he's just trolling people

I have to be up front with you: Matrix Cubed is going to have a tough time overcoming the bias that I have unintentionally built up against it. This is a bias based on my own experience with its predecessor, my general preference for fantasy over science fiction, my ambivalence towards the setting and characters, and my understanding of the history of the brief series as covered by Jimmy Maher in 2017.

http://crpgaddict.blogspot.com/2020/08/game-374-buck-rogers-matrix-cubed-1992.html

Maher I genuinely dislike, CRPGaddict is just tone-deaf, but Maher just makes up stuff and selects his sources based on how much they support his take, often getting a hilariously wrong picture of how it really was
 

octavius

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Maher is one of those annoying patronizing types that always use female pronouns to "include" women; it just sounds so phony and fake to my ears (not a native English speaker). Unless "Jimmy" can also be a female name (you never know about English names). So I don't read Maher's stuff.
CRPG Addict is all right; he's a leftist/liberal, but it very rarely interferes with his writing.
 

CryptRat

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Matrix Cubed is fun, and I'd recommend it, yet a bit worse than Countdown To Doomsday because quite early in the game your entire party owns rocket launchers, which means nothing new for the rest of the game, plus the first ship after you leave the first area is the best part in the duology. Countdown To Doomsday is very cool, they're right about the combat not being as good as the other games with spells (and I'd add these games also have more interesting enemies) but it's still miles above average. The campaign is great as all SSI's campaigns are, and being sci-fi it is some fresh air, with cool and varied missions including small choices, stat skill (the skill system does not adds much but it is still a cool addition) checks and alternative paths here and there and, of course, cool encounters. One can argue it's not a feat but the game is very easily the best space RPG.
 

Metronome

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I don't know why the ranking system he made is controversial. It's a measure of his personal taste. The only time it really fails is if he goes back and admits he would have recommend whatever game more highly than he scored it. That happens occasionally but it's not like the stakes are very high anyway.
 

Morpheus Kitami

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Maher I genuinely dislike, CRPGaddict is just tone-deaf, but Maher just makes up stuff and selects his sources based on how much they support his take, often getting a hilariously wrong picture of how it really was
So, that's it, I just thought he was terrible at researching. Whenever I've read Maher on something I actually know about, there's always several things objectively wrong or missing. Which is deeply unsettling, because that bastard is probably going to be the introduction for a few kids to old computer games.
 

Mortmal

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I don't know why the ranking system he made is controversial. It's a measure of his personal taste. The only time it really fails is if he goes back and admits he would have recommend whatever game more highly than he scored it. That happens occasionally but it's not like the stakes are very high anyway.
Because RPG is a very broad genre , and his criterias does not apply to each of those subgenres.Thus scoring is completely irrelevant.
 

Morblot

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PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut
Does anyone have any specific examples of the Digital Antiquarian making stuff up? I've enjoyed some of his takes, e.g. the long articles on Tetris.
 

Grauken

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I don't have the energy to go through all of his CRPG articles in detail, I've read most of them in the past and here is some choice stuff. That said, I'm not saying he's lying, but he states his opinion often as a fact, when it's IMHO not based on his own experience from playing a lot of these games (or not very in-depth and just cursory), but actually from reading articles and reviews in magazines of them (he's like a more sophisticated version of AdvancedHero, spouting opinions that are the sum of other peoples opinions and a clear lack of played game time).

I don't have to tell anybody how misleading your opinion on games can be if you only read reviews of them instead of actually playing them.

https://www.filfre.net/2011/08/defining-the-crpg/

CRPGs, in other words, are essentially simulation games, albeit what is being simulated is an entirely fictional world.

Of course, I could have also simply used the definition we used in the 1980s: in adventure games you explore and solve puzzles, in CRPGs you explore and kill monsters. But that’s just too easy, isn’t it?

https://www.filfre.net/2011/12/a-word-on-akalabeth-and-chronology/

The other is that this little tale may serve as an example of the process I go through to come to (my version of) historical truth

Which of course leaves me wondering why Garriott has for so many years been saying things I’m almost certain are not true.

Garriott himself turns up in the comment to clear it up, and Maher was wrong with his assumption

https://www.filfre.net/2011/12/akalabeth/

It’s also here that we find the game’s most obvious formal innovation, its use of a three-dimensional, first-person perspective that puts us right into the storyworld. The use of such a perspective was not completely unprecedented even in 1980; there was of course that Escape game that had inspired Richard in the first place. And better remembered is Flight Simulator, the fruit of many years of 3D graphics experimentation by Bruce Artwick, which first appeared on the Apple II in 1979 or very early 1980. Garriott was, however, the first to implement it in a CRPG. As such, it would be very influential on a whole generation of dungeon-crawl games to follow, even as Garriott’s own Ultima series would ironically place increasingly less emphasis on its own dungeon delving in favor of creating ever richer above-ground worlds.

this is patently false, there was Moira and Oubliette on Plato, who inspired Wizardry, which was the title that influenced most of the Dungeon Crawlers that followed, not Akalabeth, which was a footnote in RPG dev. Yes, Akalabeth (late 1980) came out before Wizardry 1 (Sep, 1981), but it is the later most game devs from that gen cite

https://www.filfre.net/2012/03/making-wizardry/

mentions the Plato environment and that it inspired the creators of Wizardry, but Maher was oblivious to the fact that Woodhead and Greenberg copied large parts of Oubliette mechanics almost verbatim

https://www.filfre.net/2012/03/playing-wizardry/

Like their forefather, Wizardry-inspired games often take place in a single dungeon, seldom feature more than the stub of a story, and largely replace the charms of exploration, discovery, and setting with those of tactics and strategy.

what, exploration and discovery are part of the core experience of Wizardry, is Maher soft in the head?

What Wizardry lacks in fictional context, it makes up for in mechanical depth. Nothing that predates it on microcomputers offers a shadow of its complexity.

not sure if he's talking merely about PCs or computer systems in general, but again, most of that complexity was copied from Oubliette

https://www.filfre.net/2012/03/the-wizardry-phenomenon/

Dirk Pellett, who did much work on the seminal PLATO CRPG dnd, claims to this day that Woodhead attempted to copy that game and release it under his own name on PLATO as Sorcerer. When he was called out for that, claims Pellett, he and Greenberg then “plagiarized” another popular PLATO game, Oubliette, to create Wizardry. For what it’s worth, I find this claim absurd. Oubliette did pioneer many ideas used in Wizardry, including the first-person view, but the contents of the latter’s dungeons were completely original.

Matt Barton had an interview with one of Oubliette's creators (http://mattchat.us/?p=990) and the CRPGAddict review of Oubliette show a high likelhood that Greenberg and Woodhead did indeed took a lot from Oubliette. I remember an Interview with either Woodhead and Greenberg where they admitted it more or less, but I can't find it at the moment, might have been a video.

https://www.filfre.net/2016/03/opening-the-gold-box-part-4-pool-of-radiance/

We also have Gygax to thank for Pool of Radiance‘s convoluted method of handling spells. Unlike virtually every other CRPG but like tabletop Advanced Dungeons & Dragons, a cleric or magic user’s list of spells in this game isn’t treated as a handy universal repository from which she can fire off the spell of her choice at will (as long, of course, as she still has the mana to do so). No, in the Gold Box games you have to memorize ahead of time the precise spells you think you will actually want to use on your next expedition. Because you usually don’t know precisely what kind of monsters you’ll be fighting in the course of said expedition, you’re continually being caught out with the wrong selection of spells. ... Run into a pack of disease-causing undead without having memorized Cure Disease? Too bad; reload back at camp and try a different spell arsenal. Run into the rare locked door that your fighters can’t bash in, and you don’t have Knock memorized? Take the long walk back to a safe area to rest and memorize it. There’s no strategy to any of this, just rote trial and error.

What else to say, it's an opinion I guess, just a very stupid one

https://www.filfre.net/2017/03/opening-the-gold-box-part-5-all-that-glitters-is-not-gold/

While Secret of the Silver Blades still stands as arguably the line’s absolute nadir in design terms, the sheer pace at which SSI pumped out Gold Box games during the latter two years of this period in particular couldn’t help but give all of them a certain generic, interchangeable quality. It all began to feel a bit rote — a bit cheap, in stark contrast to the rarefied atmosphere of a Big Event that had surrounded Pool of Radiance

Yeah, sure Buck Rogers games, Krynn, Pools of Darkness, all very interchangeable and lacking in quality. Only someone who hasn't played any of those games could have said that. Again, not lying but just making up stuff to fit his agenda

https://www.filfre.net/2019/09/opening-the-gold-box-part-6-a-troubled-marriage/

Shattered Lands was also damaged as a computer game by its need to conform to TSR’s tabletop rules. The boxed set which presented the Dark Sun setting for the tabletop included a whole range of new rules complications and variations to distinguish it from the already convoluted Dungeon & Dragons base game, and most of these SSI was expected to implement faithfully as part of their licensing agreement. And so Shattered Lands came complete with a bunch of races and classes unfamiliar even to most Gold Box and tabletop Dungeons & Dragons veterans, along with a veritable baseline expectation that every character would be double- or triple-classed. Clerics suddenly had to choose an “element” to worship, which limited their selection of spells — and now everyone had access to a whole parallel sphere of magic known as psionics, and had to choose a specialty there as well. No game designer starting a CRPG from scratch would ever have inserted so much cruft of such marginal utility to the ultimate goal of fun; it was the sort of thing that could only arise from a company like TSR throwing rule after rule at the wall over the course of years in order to sell more supplements. Certainly none of it made much sense in a game explicitly envisioned as a new beginning for Dungeons & Dragons on computers, a place for fresh players to jump aboard.

Wow, cruft of marginal utility, Maher really wins the price for not getting it
 
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octavius

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Well, I kind of agree with her about Shattered Lands. I hardly bothered with Pisonics. Except for the very beginning and the final battle, the game was too easy, and you didn't really need to use all your options or even learn them.
So she may have reached the right conclusion for the wrong reason.
 

TheImplodingVoice

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Stopped reading crpgaddict's blog after this.

IChQAJK.png
 

flyingjohn

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The problem with him is that his review system(Gimlet) makes no sense for the genre.
He assigns the same weight to story and amount of weapons to actual rpg systems and dungeons/world.That is insanity.
 

JarlFrank

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Shattered Lands was also damaged as a computer game by its need to conform to TSR’s tabletop rules. The boxed set which presented the Dark Sun setting for the tabletop included a whole range of new rules complications and variations to distinguish it from the already convoluted Dungeon & Dragons base game, and most of these SSI was expected to implement faithfully as part of their licensing agreement. And so Shattered Lands came complete with a bunch of races and classes unfamiliar even to most Gold Box and tabletop Dungeons & Dragons veterans, along with a veritable baseline expectation that every character would be double- or triple-classed. Clerics suddenly had to choose an “element” to worship, which limited their selection of spells — and now everyone had access to a whole parallel sphere of magic known as psionics, and had to choose a specialty there as well. No game designer starting a CRPG from scratch would ever have inserted so much cruft of such marginal utility to the ultimate goal of fun; it was the sort of thing that could only arise from a company like TSR throwing rule after rule at the wall over the course of years in order to sell more supplements. Certainly none of it made much sense in a game explicitly envisioned as a new beginning for Dungeons & Dragons on computers, a place for fresh players to jump aboard.

Wow, cruft of marginal utility, Maher really wins the price for not getting it

The fuck :lol:

I'm not a peak expert on 2nd edition D&D rules, but when I first played Dark Sun: Shattered Lands - two years ago or so, I made a thread about it here cause it susprised me by being such a good game - I had no issue playing it. I didn't even have a manual, I played it blind. Sure, I played the Baldur's Gate and Gold Box games before, but it's not like Dark Sun adds huge mountains of complexity that you can only understand as a D&D veteran. It's no harder to learn than any other old D&D game. It has different races and classes, sure, but if you're unfamiliar with D&D and fantasy tropes, the insectoid thri-kreen and the huge half-giants aren't going to be any more confusing than elves and dwarves and halflings. Yeah the psionics are an additional layer of complexity above the standard spells, but I mostly ignored those and managed to get through the game just fine, you don't need them.

Overall, Dark Sun is one of the more accessible games of the DOS era, especially compared to the Gold Box titles which had a pretty antiquated interface by the 90s. Character creation gives you plenty of options but isn't overwhelming, and you can even manually adjust your stats so there's no endless rerolling to get the right stats for the class you want. The turn-based combat flows quite well, and area-effect spells show you the area of effect so you don't accidentally hit your own guys with that fireball, which even the beloved Baldur's Gate series four years later didn't do. And the difficulty level is certainly on the lower side, so even if you don't know what you're doing, you have a decent chance to get through most of the game anyway.

Has he even played this game?
 

Metronome

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Because RPG is a very broad genre , and his criterias does not apply to each of those subgenres.Thus scoring is completely irrelevant.
Let's say he likes NPCs and a game doesn't have them. He scores it lower as a result. The game's justification for a lack of NPCs is irrelevant. It doesn't make the game more enjoyable for him just because there is an excuse. If there is a whole subgenre of RPG without economics, then he enjoys the subgenre less as a result. The score is no different than if he just stated "I don't like the lack of X in this game" in some kind of summary.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
Because RPG is a very broad genre , and his criterias does not apply to each of those subgenres.Thus scoring is completely irrelevant.
Let's say he likes NPCs and a game doesn't have them. He scores it lower as a result. The game's justification for a lack of NPCs is irrelevant. It doesn't make the game more enjoyable for him just because there is an excuse. If there is a whole subgenre of RPG without economics, then he enjoys the subgenre less as a result. The score is no different than if he just stated "I don't like the lack of X in this game" in some kind of summary.
So what you're saying is that he's autistic
 

Mortmal

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I'd like to slip a racing car like forza in the pile of games he has to play still . Would be funny to see him apply his autistic scoring system to the game. Might even fare better than classics , cars have stats,you get xp, you unlock things too.
 

Sceptic

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Divinity: Original Sin
I don't have the energy to go through all of his CRPG articles in detail, I've read most of them in the past and here is some choice stuff. That said, I'm not saying he's lying, but he states his opinion often as a fact, when it's IMHO not based on his own experience from playing a lot of these games (or not very in-depth and just cursory), but actually from reading articles and reviews in magazines of them (he's like a more sophisticated version of AdvancedHero, spouting opinions that are the sum of other peoples opinions and a clear lack of played game time).
It's worse than just paraphrasing others' opinions without playing the games. Even when he clearly has played the games, he cherry-picks facts and twists them into a completely different history of what happened, one that fits his personal opinion of how he thinks things should've gone down. Some of his post strike me as insanely narcissistic as well, I think it was with Trinity where he wrote page upon page about himself and his research that had absolutely nothing to do with the game. I certainly don't have the inclination to dig through his stuff to come up examples, but I've pointed out some of his glaring inaccuracies several times on the forums here, Search function should bring up some of them.

Your post is :salute: overall.

I think he's gotten worse over the years. CRPG Addict is actually a much better historian than he is, his exploration of the PLATO lineage is one of the most interesting and thorough research I've seen on the topic. I frequently disagree with him and roll my eyes at him so completely missing the point of some games, but some of his other entries are wonderful. His Ultima Underworld writings are notable for this; he brought up the exact same arguments that contemporary reviews did on the game's innovation, and he was clearly bringing them up out of his own replaying and his own memories of the game, with some perspective but no revisionism. THIS is good historian work.
 
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Gastrick

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You would definitely become the ultimate authority on fantasy books if you read every fantasy book in existence, which is the correct analogy here
No you wouldn't, here's Schopenhauer saying why not.
"Students, and learned persons of all sorts and every age, aim as a rule at acquiring information rather than insight. They pique themselves upon knowing about everything—stones, plants, battles, experiments, and all the books in existence. It never occurs to them that information is only a means of insight, and in itself of little or no value; that it is his way of thinking that makes a man a philosopher. When I hear of these portents of learning and their imposing erudition, I sometimes say to myself: Ah, how little they must have had to think about, to have been able to read so much!"
Crpgaddict's shallow reviews show he didn't think very much about the game or rpg games in general, and that probably is all his mind would ever be capable of.
"No one writes anything that is worth writing, unless he writes entirely for the sake of his subject. What an inestimable boon it would be, if in every branch of literature there were only a few books, but those excellent!"
Those other games have little to no value, so it's irrelevant whether they are played or not.
 

Mortmal

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2020 newfags using schopenhauer citations, and writing a good post, the wheel is turning ! The curse is lifted !
 

Grauken

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"No one writes anything that is worth writing, unless he writes entirely for the sake of his subject. What an inestimable boon it would be, if in every branch of literature there were only a few books, but those excellent!"


So Schopenhauer was an idiot who couldn't manage more than a couple of books, ok
 

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