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Turn-based combat is not fun

octavius

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Agree completely with OP. Why boring, time consuming turn based when you can have exciting real time instead?
For example, ski jumping would be much more fun to watch if all the jumpers jumped at the same time instead of waiting their turn.
 

JoonaAhonen

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Agree completely with OP. Why boring, time consuming turn based when you can have exciting real time instead?
For example, ski jumping would be much more fun to watch if all the jumpers jumped at the same time instead of waiting their turn.
Gotta agree though.
 

JoonaAhonen

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The only one I didn't respond to was the guy talking about kicking someone in the ribs. Tf was that, a movie quote?
 

Sigourn

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Turn-based combat exists because dicerolls exist. In a cRPG, combat tends to be a game of chance and so you have to gauge your options. Remove dicerolls and turn-based combat turns somewhat pointless: it's still an alternative, but more along the lines of "I suck at playing action games so I need to take things slowly" instead of "I want to play my own character with their own limitations".
 

JoonaAhonen

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Turn-based combat exists because dicerolls exist. In a cRPG, combat tends to be a game of chance and so you have to gauge your options.
But why should we limit the fun just because of traditions or principle? I understand some people are very conservative, but they're the same people that are especially prone to nostalgia, and that means they should not be listened to when it comes time to make a decision involving the object of nostalgia.

See, that's the irrationality that bothers me in conservatives, and the right in general. They think with their feelings, which means they are in way of progress.
 

Sigourn

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Turn-based combat exists because dicerolls exist. In a cRPG, combat tends to be a game of chance and so you have to gauge your options.
But why should we limit the fun just because of traditions or principle? I understand some people are very conservative, but they're the same people that are especially prone to nostalgia, and that means they should not be listened to when it comes time to make a decision involving the object of nostalgia.

There are plenty of action RPGs out there. I'd say the problem is that devs don't really tackle the issues with turn-based combat. You don't really see an evolution of turn-based combat in the way that you see the evolution of actoin RPG combat.
 

buffalo bill

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sure computer games are kinda fun, but way too slow to stimulate pleasure centers. Have you tried heroin? much better pleasure and faster acting than boring computer games. Games are pretty much obsolete relics of the pre-heroin past.
 

Darkzone

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The only instance of a fun turn-based RPG I can think of, is the Mario and Luigi series. In these video games published by Nintendo, you can actually affect the damage you deal with fun little minigames, and you can dodge attacks if you are skilled enough. It takes skill, unlike a book or a movie. However well the developers executed turn-based combat, the best way to execute it is by hanging it from the tree of failed gimmicks.
Minigames Ok.... Have you considered that games that require strategy are not for you?
There is a reason why strategy games exist like Chess, Shogi and Go and why people spend their entire lives playing them, but i understand why this would escape you.
 

typical user

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Turn-based is all dandy until you have many NPCs on the screen, then it becomes mind-numbing waiting for civilians or neutral parties to do their turn during combat encounter.

I despise defending cities in Jagged Alliance 2 because of dumb-as-bricks militia taking forever to do their turn and then doing jack shit or run in the open while hostiles shred them.
 

ProphetSword

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But why should we limit the fun just because of traditions or principle?

Nobody is limiting fun. People play turn-based CRPGs because they love turn-based CRPGs. If you don't, then you shouldn't be playing them. I don't like real-time strategy games, so I don't play them...problem solved, no reason to bitch and moan about it. I personally think turn-based CRPGs trump any other kind of CRPGs that exist. To each their own. Play the type of games you like and get over it.
 

Tigranes

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But guys, what is "fun" and how could we define it?

I would like the OP to offer us his thoughts.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Nothing wrong with turn-based per se, but it's severely overrated in this neck of the woods.
Not really. TB really is the superior choice for RPGs. You can easily compare Pathfinder's two modes and see for yourself, that is much more effective and beats the combined insight of the Codex in convincing someone.

I know this is a troll thread btw.
 

Mastermind

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Nothing wrong with turn-based per se, but it's severely overrated in this neck of the woods.
Not really. TB really is the superior choice for RPGs. You can easily compare Pathfinder's two modes and see for yourself, that is much more effective and beats the combined insight of the Codex in convincing someone.

I know this is a troll thread btw.

Pathfinder is based on TB system, it's not much of a comparison.
TB is inherently inferior to real time simply because as an abstraction it will never be able to emulate the real deal to the extent that a real time system can. Its value is solely for flavor and variety to the monocled playher. It's also the system of choice for slow-witted retards which explains why it's had a surge in popularity as gaming becomes more and more mainstream. Unfortunately that means fewer good tb rpgs (IE: blobbers) and more stupid shit like Fallout and Xcom clones.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Pathfinder is based on TB system, it's not much of a comparison.
TB is inherently inferior to real time simply because as an abstraction it will never be able to emulate the real deal to the extent that a real time system can. Its value is solely for flavor and variety to the monocled playher. It's also the system of choice for slow-witted retards which explains why it's had a surge in popularity as gaming becomes more and more mainstream. Unfortunately that means fewer good tb rpgs (IE: blobbers) and more stupid shit like Fallout and Xcom clones.
While this is shockingly wrong on many different levels, I can give another example outside of Pathfinder - Tower of Time. I think that's RTwP done right, especially the removal of almost all single-target damage abilities, but it's severely limited due to the nature of RTwP. RTwP might carve itself a niche if it gets reiterated, but it needs motivation to do so and that's hard to find. Both Pathfinders are not it.
 

Tim the Bore

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You know, at least Templar would made your blood boiling with his rants. Like, you could tell he was trolling, *but*... maybe he was not?

No "but" with you unfortunately.
 

Mastermind

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Pathfinder is based on TB system, it's not much of a comparison.
TB is inherently inferior to real time simply because as an abstraction it will never be able to emulate the real deal to the extent that a real time system can. Its value is solely for flavor and variety to the monocled playher. It's also the system of choice for slow-witted retards which explains why it's had a surge in popularity as gaming becomes more and more mainstream. Unfortunately that means fewer good tb rpgs (IE: blobbers) and more stupid shit like Fallout and Xcom clones.
While this is shockingly wrong on many different levels, I can give another example outside of Pathfinder - Tower of Time. I think that's RTwP done right, especially the removal of almost all single-target damage abilities, but it's severely limited due to the nature of RTwP. RTwP might carve itself a niche if it gets reiterated, but it needs motivation to do so and that's hard to find. Both Pathfinders are not it.

Never played Tower of Time but Guild Wars shits over all TB RPGs (and it has single target abilities). There is nothing TB can do that RT cannot do because REALITY IS IN REAL TIME. The opposite is not true. TB always chokes when it comes to abstracting speed of any kind, for example. One of the reasons tbtards on the codex have such a visceral hatred of rtwp is because being able to pause the game takes away the only "advantage" TB allegedly has, which is to give the player time to think.

You could argue that more good games are being made in TB than RT and that may well be true (Guild Wars was released in 2005 and BG2 was released in 2000) but that's a different story altogether.
 

octavius

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Nothing wrong with turn-based per se, but it's severely overrated in this neck of the woods.
Not really. TB really is the superior choice for RPGs. You can easily compare Pathfinder's two modes and see for yourself, that is much more effective and beats the combined insight of the Codex in convincing someone.

I know this is a troll thread btw.

Pathfinder is based on TB system, it's not much of a comparison.
TB is inherently inferior to real time simply because as an abstraction it will never be able to emulate the real deal to the extent that a real time system can. Its value is solely for flavor and variety to the monocled playher. It's also the system of choice for slow-witted retards which explains why it's had a surge in popularity as gaming becomes more and more mainstream. Unfortunately that means fewer good tb rpgs (IE: blobbers) and more stupid shit like Fallout and Xcom clones.

Any sufficiently advanced troll is indistinguishable from a genuine kook.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Guild Wars isn't RTwP and is a total non-sequitur.
 

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