Incline Gloomhaven/Frosthaven

[pakoito]

The Top #1 boardgame in BGG is something right up the Codex' alley. It's a turn based dungeon crawler with puzzle-y mechanics. Described as "D&D in a box" it is set in a fantasy world with decent lore and poor writing. Between the base game, the expansion, the official community content, and the upcoming games you're looking at a solid TRPG with 300+ hand-crafted scenarios.

The game's also getting a 1:1 digital adaptation of the first big campaign (95+ scenarios) alongside a roguelike mode with random map generation:



There's a thread for it already: https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...rd-game-now-available-on-early-access.123176/

For those not willing to dosh out a hundred bucks to play the physical version, there's a bite-sized version of the game called "Jaws of the Lion" releasing this week on the US and in August in the rest of the world. It includes a 5-scenario tutorial, and 25 scenarios total. The content is compatible with the big game, and vice-versa!

 

[ColCol]

DId Jaws of the Lion Release?

 

[Thac0]

Gloomhaven is good, but only if you have a steady group of 2-4 players that always meet. When your friendgroup is scattered like mine and you are always meeting in different constellation you are gonna get nowhere.
The game has massive amounts of content and is meant to be played as one long continual game, like a single DnD campaign over hundreds of hours.

 

[eggdogg]

Gloom is super! Plays best with 2 people imo but the max (4 people) is doable just takes way longer and often 1 or 2 peeps get shafted each turn due to the nature of 4 characters running around a small map.

Gloom is head and shoulders more fun than any boardgame ive played.

 

[Horvatii]

So I watched some of the qucik intro video. And this game just looks like a crappy PvE videogame?
Its like a boardgame simulating coop PvE.
And its fairly trash too. It has no DM. Monsters that lol move to the closes enemy they see...
It completely ruins the actual boardgame strenght of PvP.

Wtf, why is it so hightly rated?

 

[pakoito]

tl;dr it is a good thinky PvE game, which is rare in a hobby full of "chuck dice to win" dungeon crawlers

 

[Horvatii]

Imo, "boardgames" should be exclusively PvP. Stuff like Gloomhaven needs a new name.

Btw, why play it if it mimics computer games - just play some fantasy PC gaym? For the social interactions?
I dont play boardgames so I wouldnt know..

Also, on the PVP note: how do monsters which only can move to the closest player (if I am understanding it right) as their intelligent move action ever ever compete with humans?
Just bottleneck them with your tank? I mean, it seems completely trivial to exploit those rules/mechanics in a group of players?
Even if you are restriced to these shuffled 2AP action systems.

On a random note, I guess baordgamin is now in IMDB comic-book-movie land. If I see ratings that are not in a normal distr, I disqualify the voting demographic and the ratings...

 

[Thac0]

The game is about beating a dungeon together with your friends.
Everyone has personal objectives in the dungeon, some even secret from the other players.
You fight the monsters in unison, but you can never be 100% sure what your companions will do, as your friends might just ignore the plan and torch the enemy you put under CC because they had a hidden quest to do so they couldnt (shouldnt by the rules) tell you about.
The monsters obviously have the advantage in stats and numbers, and their movement patterns can be perfectly predicted - which is amazing since it allows you to use traps, aoe and summons to your advantage and wombo combo them with your friends.
They circumvent the drawbacks of completely being able to predict the enemies turn and as suchmaking it a plan 15 moves ahead game (like some inferior boardgames like Legends of Andor) by using randomised modifier cards.
The game is heavily built around executing combos with your friends, there is even a combo system. Certain attacks add an element to the air, like some fire mana still lingering around after a fireball or some ice after an Ice arrow. Other players can consume this to power up their turn. So its all about teamplay.
Its basically just the fighting part of classical Pen and Paper isolated, but instead of the fight being under the control of a dungeon master who can sway it in anyones favor at all times it is under the control of the players and the luck of the cards.

Also it deserves its rating for sheer content size and ingenuity alone. There are so many god damn classes and levels in the game. Some good design in those too.

Edit: Also retarded for that boardgames should purely be PvP, cooperative board games need a new name. Cooperative board games exist for almost a century already and everyone just calls them board game, as the name is derived from the medium not the content lol

 

[Snorkack]

The ratings are pretty much deserved, this game offers so much... I've been playing it regularly for two years now and still everytime someone retires his character and starts a new one, the whole group dynamic shifts around so much, it's almost like a different game you have to figure out and master again.

But yeah, you should approach it more like a p&p campaign than a regular board game, meaning you have to play it regularly with the same two or three people, otherwise a lot of the gloomhaven experience is lost.

A singleplayer alternative is the print-it-yourself Gloomhaven bootleg Guildhaven City. Haven't tried it, but a gloomhaven buddy says it's cool.

Gloom is super! Plays best with 2 people imo but the max (4 people) is doable just takes way longer and often 1 or 2 peeps get shafted each turn due to the nature of 4 characters running around a small map.

Think 3 players is the sweet spot, here's why.

 

[pakoito]

Just bottleneck them with your tank? I mean, it seems completely trivial to exploit those rules/mechanics in a group of players?

The game has a built-in turn limit mechanic. Most enemies hit like trucks with more range than your characters, and have tools to move your chars around and heal back. Plus most map objectives require you to move around a bit. Stalling is a tool, but far from being the one to break the game. In my experience you're better off rolling glass cannons.

A singleplayer alternative is the print-it-yourself Gloomhaven bootleg Guildhaven City. Haven't tried it, but a gloomhaven buddy says it's cool.

I've finished 1.5 campaigns of this. The game's a bit worse than the original, still above most solo games. I had lots of fun.

 

[Bara]

More cross media for Gloom Haven, it's now getting a comic book

Gloomhaven, the world’s greatest board game, is about to become the world’s next great comic.

The City of Gloomhaven can be a tough place to make it as an adventurer and being in the right party is key to survival. The Jaws of the Lion are the top of the mountain in the hierarchy of the city, but their latest job goes sideways, and Anaphi, the mindthief, is to blame! Get ready for Quatryll punk bands, drug dealing Inox street gangs, and a dark God sleeping beneath the surface, eager to destroy the world. Welcome to the city.

I know gloomhaven's already built for long campagins but at this rate I wouldn't be surprised if they end up making their own ttrpg with the IP.

 

[pakoito]

DId Jaws of the Lion Release?

It took a bit but mine's home now and I'm gonna play through it solo over the next few weeks. I'll report afterwards :D

 

[Polanski]

I have been playing Jaws of the Lion with my girlfriend the last two weeks. Even though we have limited time together each day, we have prioritized playing this almost every evening. It is just that good. The combat system plays incredibly well with the card selection, hidden information and playing the odds. It plays a little like a mix of cooperative Magic/Hearthstone and X-com. It is also incredible value for money and the tutorial means it's easy to learn.

It is definitely the best cooperative boardgame I have ever played and I plan to get the big Gloomhaven or Frosthaven after we are done with it.

 

[Polanski]

The only thing I slightly dislike is amount of over the top gore and gloom in the setting and story, which seems a bit immature to me. But I guess that is what to be expected from a game called Gloomhaven (horrible name btw).

but it is easy to overlook as the combat, social play and character building is just so perfect.

 

[Snorkack]

The story and writing is indeed trash and the one single weak point of the game. And maybe the summoning mechanics. Thankfully you're free to ignore both.

Just wondering - Did anyone play all three games/expansions yet? Is there any point in playing Jaws of the Lion with a group that has beaten Forgotten Circles? We're one or two sessions away from completing the expansion and worried that JotL now might be trivial for us and we should rather play other games while waiting for Frosthaven.

 

[pakoito]

JotL is designed to be played with new characters and it's very linear. To the point where the rewards are measured to level you up at certain story points and such.

Also, the items and events are not compatible. Just the characters.

 

[Snorkack]

Oh I know that, maybe I should clarify: After 120 base game & expansion missions, most of them played on very hard, plus having played and figured out all classes (except concentric circles), do you think JotL will still be able to provide us with new and interesting scenarios, challenges and class synergies? Or is it more likely that it will feel like going back to tutorial missions and not really worth our time?

 

[pakoito]

Oh I know that, maybe I should clarify: After 120 base game & expansion missions, most of them played on very hard, plus having played and figured out all classes (except concentric circles), do you think JotL will still be able to provide us with new and interesting scenarios, challenges and class synergies? Or is it more likely that it will feel like going back to tutorial missions and not really worth our time?

I didn't like circles either, even if I finished the game with it.

JotL is "designed to be sold at Target", so the experience is more tight and focused than Gloomhaven but it doesn't expand on it. It's just more maps and a small amount of new enemy types. The new classes are fun to play, HATCHETT is just a blast. To the face.

I'd play the community campaigns first, as they're free and you can reuse your board tiles and characters. I'd imagine at least some will a bit more designed and harder than the base game. A couple are designed by Isaac himself.

 

[Galdred]

We started the game on tabletop, but for obvious reasons (lockdown in Europe et all), we have to migrate to online play.
Have you tried it? What was your setup for it? Tabletop Simulator + the gloomhaven module?

 

[pakoito]

We started the game on tabletop, but for obvious reasons (lockdown in Europe et all), we have to migrate to online play.
Have you tried it? What was your setup for it? Tabletop Simulator + the gloomhaven module?

I played the GH campaign with https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1301493206 and the experience was positive. There are others for JotL out now, I cannot speak about those. It has the same automation you'd get with Gloomhaven Helper, automated setup+teardown+scenario rewards, plus built-in campaign tracking.

 

[Gamezor]

We started the game on tabletop, but for obvious reasons (lockdown in Europe et all), we have to migrate to online play.
Have you tried it? What was your setup for it? Tabletop Simulator + the gloomhaven module?

I played the GH campaign with https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1301493206 and the experience was positive. There are others for JotL out now, I cannot speak about those. It has the same automation you'd get with Gloomhaven Helper, automated setup+teardown+scenario rewards, plus built-in campaign tracking.

I tried to play table top solo (no friends, wife not interested) and just got sick of the setup and what not. It struck me it would probably make a better pc game than board game because of the amount of stuff you had to track. But it was really fun and well designed for what I played. Does this also automate the monster moves? I guess I could also just wait for the pc version to be done.

 

[Angelo85]

Gamezor The tabletop simulator version has no "AI", the scripts just set up the table for chosen missions. You have to move and use skills for the enemies manually like you do for your character(s). Once you have the rules down though you can handle the movement/attacks of enemies rather quickly, like you would in the board game. You can even drop status effects right on the minis and remove them with a single click, so it's really speedy and convenient.

 

[v1rus]

God dammit, by accident i posted in the digital version, instead of physical. Just yesterday we completed first four scenarios of Jaws of the Lion. And shiet, that game so good, i wanted to play it tonight again. Still, it took us 10 hours (with learning about half the rules on the spot), so yeah, fatigue has step in.

But pretty much everyone at the table was amazed by it, and, a year ago (heck, week ago for some of us) we couldnt wrap our mind around the concept of cooperative board games. It was like "Just why?". Well if you share that opinion, buy goddamn Jaws of the Lion, and youll see why.

 

[pakoito]

Good to hear :D As you advance build theorycrafting kicks in, JotL has a couple of brilliant scenarios too. For the full version of GH there are character unlocks (16 classes total), you can use stickers to permanently modify cards, and more optional scenarios with quirky mechanics. Plus many more items. FH will introduce city management too.

 

[v1rus]

Good to hear :D As you advance build theorycrafting kicks in, JotL has a couple of brilliant scenarios too. For the full version of GH there are character unlocks (16 classes total), you can use stickers to permanently modify cards, and more optional scenarios with quirky mechanics Plus many more items. FH will introduce city management too.

and ty bro for the recommendation!

Yeah, Ive already done the research. Dont think ill be using the card stickers, (or removable stickers for that matter), just gonna write that stuff on the sleeve.

We roflstomped the first three scenarios, and while the fourth one was a noticeable bump in the difficulty, we still didnt feel challenged by it. Once we move to scen 6, and can choose the difficulty, would you recommend hard or very hard?