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Anime Ys series

Jinn

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
4,930
I'll probably get around to doing other endings eventually, I just have weird habits in how I like to do things. It's not uncommon for me to take month long breaks from games I'm in the middle of.

I get that for sure. Just know that the next two playthroughs of Nier: Automata are definitely not just identical with different characters to play as. There's a lot of unique stuff in the second playthrough and the third is entirely new.

Always just bugs me when I see people talking about Nier: Automata that way, because it makes me realize just how many people have not seen even half of the entire game.
 
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Blaza

Educated
Joined
Jul 16, 2019
Messages
58
I get that for sure. Just know that the next two playthroughs of Nier: Automata are definitely not just identical with different characters to play as. There's a lot of unique stuff in the second playthrough and the third is entirely new.

That was actually one of the points my friend told me when I got the game in like January of this year. "It's multi-story playthroughs done right". Reading back my original post it does imply that I'm never going back to it, which isn't what I meant. It may just take me a while since I just do things on whims. Probably why none of my personal projects ever get finished in a reasonable amount of time.
 

Cromwell

Arcane
Joined
Feb 16, 2013
Messages
5,443
That was actually one of the points my friend told me when I got the game in like January of this year. "It's multi-story playthroughs done right"

Automata should be seen as different chapters not different playthroughs. You didnt get one ending, you didnt finish the game at all.
 

Removal

Scholar
Joined
Jun 23, 2017
Messages
204
I might come back and do the other line later, I'm not really super enticed by story stuff. Unless he plays totally differently than Yunica, then I'll probably do it sooner. Even with Nier: Automata, one of the best games I've ever played, I only got 1 ending, then started for a second and then dropped it. I figure I have enough issues getting through games once, adding multiple playthroughs is just not really my thing most of the time.
all three characters play very differently and have different "in-between" boss line ups
 

4249

I stalk the night
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Joined
Nov 19, 2014
Messages
1,216
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut Divinity: Original Sin 2
Finally finished Ys 8 and while I initially felt it was weaker than the previous party based Ys games, I have to agree that in the end it was definitely the best of the bunch, at least so far. I had some serious fatigue at the end of Seven and Celceta, but even after playing this one for over 50 hours I didn't get the feeling of "can this shit just end". I don't think I can be arsed to finish all the raids and hunts, but might still do the post game dungeon. The basic gameplay and exploration was pretty fun throughout the game and they've refined the formula pretty nicely from game to game. Still, the combat was pretty disappointing in the end when compared to the Napishtim engine games, but at this point you've just gotta live with that. I mainly remember the really bad bosses, either there were really braindead mechanics or especially in the end you just bulldozed through them with stats, even on nightmare and without grinding stat boosts. But then again parrying was super easy on most of them, so even having superior stats was pretty unnecessary and once again healing items were abundant as well.
 

Derringer

Prophet
Joined
Jan 28, 2020
Messages
1,934
I'm still not really sure what to feel about Falcom. Most of their software is 7-8/10 stuff even back during the 90s, it's just that their competition is so bad that they're more appealing compared to blatant JRPG shovelware or progressive garbage.
 

Momock

Augur
Joined
Sep 26, 2014
Messages
644
I'm still not really sure what to feel about Falcom. Most of their software is 7-8/10 stuff even back during the 90s, it's just that their competition is so bad that they're more appealing compared to blatant JRPG shovelware or progressive garbage.
7 or 8 is good, but yeah, I hope that one day they will be better thant that.
 

Ysaye

Arbiter
Joined
May 27, 2018
Messages
771
Location
Australia
Finally finished Ys 8 and while I initially felt it was weaker than the previous party based Ys games, I have to agree that in the end it was definitely the best of the bunch, at least so far. I had some serious fatigue at the end of Seven and Celceta, but even after playing this one for over 50 hours I didn't get the feeling of "can this shit just end". I don't think I can be arsed to finish all the raids and hunts, but might still do the post game dungeon. The basic gameplay and exploration was pretty fun throughout the game and they've refined the formula pretty nicely from game to game. Still, the combat was pretty disappointing in the end when compared to the Napishtim engine games, but at this point you've just gotta live with that. I mainly remember the really bad bosses, either there were really braindead mechanics or especially in the end you just bulldozed through them with stats, even on nightmare and without grinding stat boosts. But then again parrying was super easy on most of them, so even having superior stats was pretty unnecessary and once again healing items were abundant as well.

I agree it is sad about the combat becoming just a thing of stats and button mashing; Tokyo Xanadu is more refined than what the Ys combat has become in these most recent versions.

7 or 8 is good, but yeah, I hope that one day they will be better thant that.

They have always in truth been a small-sized company (In the book The Untold History of Japanese Video Game Developers I think it is the programmer Kashima who draws up a drawing of the tiny office?) and they have always had limited resources. Clearly they have in the past invested their resources in the following order:
(1) Story writers (I believe from that history of Falcom youtube video that even Kondo was originally the writer for the initial Trails games?);
(2) Sound track (always been a strong point but also a sore point as they don't give recognition to their composers and artists);
(3) Game design; and
(4) Graphics / Animation (animation has been outsourced - with issues in say Cold Steel 3 and 4 where the animation was not that great.

In recent (last 5 or so years) they have tried to recruit new people for the last of these and they will probably develop them up on lesser games and / or remakes of classics and clearly the newly released (in August) Trails of Hajimari being one of these. It is interesting because in Hajmari they chose to ditch animation altogether, which was received really well by some but was panned by others. Given they have put a lot of work into their own new custom engine, it is likely we will see next a remake of a Ys game in that engine - either Ys 1 and 2 or Ys 5 Kefin and maybe later a remake of Trails in the Sky probably in parallel with a new Trails in Calvard games - that will allow them to save resources and get the best bang out of their recent investment, but it probably won't elevate them to anything that they weren't already.
 

Ysaye

Arbiter
Joined
May 27, 2018
Messages
771
Location
Australia
Ys 1 and 2 have been remade to death, we need a V remake.

My bet is that they would want to make one where they can turn it into a game with a party, so Ys 1&2 may not make for the best material to run with - Dogi, Lilia and Keith Fact could join you in Ys 2, But who in Ys 1?
 

Archibald

Arcane
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
Messages
7,869
Well Ys 2 would be changed significantly if you suddenly had a party so might as well alter Ys 1 heavily.
 

spekkio

Arcane
Joined
Sep 16, 2009
Messages
8,278
Was english dub for previous Ys games as bad as in this video? I always use jap audio, so I have no idea. Also EXTREME character design and indoor gameplay... I don't know. Looks like Weeb AssCreed so far.

:roll:
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I have only played Ys with Japanese VA, and I will continue to do so. I think the English VA is on par with other Ys games.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Demo stealth dropped for PS4/PS5. I don't know if there's a time limit. Performance on PS5 is solid, at 60FPS.
 
Self-Ejected

Harry Easter

Self-Ejected
Joined
Jul 27, 2016
Messages
819
In recent (last 5 or so years) they have tried to recruit new people for the last of these and they will probably develop them up on lesser games and / or remakes of classics and clearly the newly released (in August) Trails of Hajimari being one of these. It is interesting because in Hajmari they chose to ditch animation altogether, which was received really well by some but was panned by others. Given they have put a lot of work into their own new custom engine, it is likely we will see next a remake of a Ys game in that engine - either Ys 1 and 2 or Ys 5 Kefin and maybe later a remake of Trails in the Sky probably in parallel with a new Trails in Calvard games - that will allow them to save resources and get the best bang out of their recent investment, but it probably won't elevate them to anything that they weren't already.

Yeah, they need to sell a lot more units, until they can reach higher.

But it does speak for the writing of the games, that games by Falcom are still relatively successful. I hope that the engine looks descent enough, so they sell more (because let's be honest, graphicswill always be important for success) and then maybe experiment a bit with the combat. Because I think that the story of Seven and VIII are really good, but for me Ys is more about easy but fun gameplay that prepares you for great bossfights. I miss the big boss fights of Origins and Felghana. Seven had a few good ideas, especially the last one was good. Don't know about the bosses in IX, though.
 

infidel

StarInfidel
Developer
Joined
May 6, 2019
Messages
494
Strap Yourselves In
Story trailer.

Man, those English VAs. The first thirty seconds is like shady corporate types force-hiring a runner or something. I was half-expecting to hear "I never asked for this" from Adol at that point :D
 

Nutmeg

Arcane
Vatnik Wumao
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
19,803
Location
Mahou Kingdom
Just finished Ys chronicles (Ys I and II remakes) on PC.

Played with the original PC-88 OST, which is probably in my top 5 soundtracks. I listen to it all the time.

Sadly, the sound track sets a very high bar that the game cannot live up to. It's very full of emotion and the game simply failed to engage me in the same way just listening to the music while staring into space does.

But, I don't think the game plays badly, at all, with the second game much better than the first. The areas and dungeons you have to traverse manage to translate well the "fun" (some people love it, others hate it, I'm somewhere in the middle) of plotting maps on graph paper to a real time format. Of course, you don't actually plot anything, instead the layouts end up being kind of short to medium term spatial memory tests. Works well with the brisk movement.

As is the case with many of these kinds of more leisurely action games, you can trivially avoid every enemy. However, levelling up is mandatory, as you simply can't damage the bosses required to progress if you're too low level, which provides the impetus to actually fight. There's not much challenge to it, it's all very mindless after the bump combat becomes second nature. Bumping into enemies ends up being something you just happen to do while you're lost looking for the next item or way through or whatever to advance.

The meat of the play is in the bosses, and the developers recognized that by providing boss rush modes on completion. The bosses are great and quite memorable. Simple and clever. They accomplished a lot with very little.

I also liked the plot and the adventure. Has a real Japanese fairy tale vibe to it. I don't know if it's a remake thing but I felt the "fleshing out" was weak, and the game would have been better served with less NPCs with less to say. Less talking monsters. Less is more. This is where the music really really outshines the rest of the delivery.

Could have also done away with the few "what item should I use in this area to activate the trigger" puzzles. Rules based puzzles would fit these games well, not sure why they went the lame pegs and holes route.

The second game ends with the beautiful opening music from the first. It's music filled with yearning, suggesting some kind of a fog covering hidden tragedies, begging for you to delve into it. It's sad but feels as if almost by design that while playing the game was great, it did nothing to alleviate that yearning.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
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Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
:D:(

The PS5 version of YS IX runs at a smooth 60FPS, but the localized version has a crashing issue on said console. This is not an issue for the Japanese version on PS5. Oh NISA.
 

Nutmeg

Arcane
Vatnik Wumao
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
19,803
Location
Mahou Kingdom
Just finished Ys Origin. Yunica Normal.

Amazing game. I love the movement and the move-set, which grows at a good pace as you progress, with the encounter and dungeon design evolving appropriately. I found myself using everything in my arsenal, from the basic combo, to the thrust attack, to the aerial thrusts (both upward and downward), to the colored special moves and their charged versions. Yunica's red special is a shot, and the last move you get is a bomb, which really cements the game's genre as at least shmup adjacent if not an evolution. The boss design and camera reinforce this.

From this point of view, the game is competes with Nier Automata. Comparing the two, I found Origin's default overhead camera preferable to Automata's default player controllable 3rd person camera. Comparing like with like e.g. the fixed side scrolling camera set up both games sometimes adopt, reveals Automata's the movement as the more slippery of the two (I guess because it's not fixed speed movement like in Ys, but not direct analogue control either, there are animation switching delays). As a means of avoiding hits, I much prefer Ys' jump to Automata's dodge.

Anyway, I guess the move I used the least was uncharged yellow, but even that was super useful in some side scrolling sections to attack enemies the level above you. Learning to best use the basic attacks by just ensuring you commit at the right times and get the spacings correct was very fun.

Suffers the one same problem as many of these kinds of games do, which is you can just run around all the non boss enemies. Well, I shouldn't say all. Sometimes you must engage to activate a trigger of some kind. You also do need to be a certain level to meaningfully damage bosses, but there's always one particular mob in each area that gives the greatest XP (and SP) to time invested ratio, and you can avoid all the others. That being said, in the absence of foreknowledge, the natural way to play is to just clear everything, and it's very fun doing so, even though it's not much of a challenge (on Normal).

I liked that it was all just one big dungeon crawl. The dungeon had heaps of variety in terms of scenery and accompanying navigational hazards and puzzles, some taking cue from platformers (e.g. an underwater area, slippery surfaces with rolling spikes, and timed platforms) while others took cue from traditional dungeon crawling (e.g. teleporter puzzles and dead ends). I liked the shop at save point statues system. I liked the navigational puzzles mentioned above. I liked the abridged backtracking. Excellent design all around. All wheat, no chaff.

The aesthetic was all very cohesive. Falcom still milking Koshiro's work on Ys I and II, which is great (the only weird track choice was the jazzy one that plays when Yunica gets knighted). Dialogue did not detract from the pacing, and was generally well written. One part that stood out as strange was in the end when the four younger people declared their intent to stay on the surface and one of the elder members said "Oh we'll make sure to tell your loved ones they'll never see you again"
icon_biggrin.gif
. I understand more plot is revealed playing with the other characters, but what I did see so far did not do any disservice to Ys I and II and made for a good prequel.

My only regret is that I didn't play on Hard and that I overleveled against some of the bosses so was able to beat them the first time around (including final). I never did any grinding, but sometimes right before a boss I realized I was only a few kills away from a level up so went back to kill a few enemies. Probably wouldn't have mattered on Hard or up, but I trivialized some very fun challenge this way.
 

NerevarineKing

Learned
Joined
Jan 6, 2021
Messages
315
I'm a huge fan of this series and I've beaten every single "canon" title except 5 and of course 9 since it just came out in NA. Ys 9 has been really fun so far. It takes the basic formula of Ys 8 and adds a ton of 3D movement abilities. The levels and many bosses are also designed with these abilities in mind and it makes exploration pretty satisfying. I also think the side-quests are much more interesting than any other game in the series and many of them could be part of the main story. The early chapters are a bit limited with environmental variety, but then the game opens up with some nice outdoor areas. The music also just as great as any other Ys title, but that's what I expect from Falcom at this point. My main complaint is that I think the game is too easy so far, even though I'm playing Hard mode. I'm also only on Chapter 5, so maybe the difficulty will eventually increase to a more reasonable level.
 
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NerevarineKing

Learned
Joined
Jan 6, 2021
Messages
315
So, I beat Ys 9 recently. As much as I enjoyed the story and characters of Ys 9, the gameplay is a big step down from 8. I played on Hard and there was barely any challenge even when I gimped myself by not using the stat increasing items they throw at you all the time. They also removed the system from 8 that limited the heals you could use during fights and they didn't nerf the flash guard system that was already too powerful in 8. It's a bit of a shame because the movement abilities are really well implemented with the environments, but the combat was horribly balanced. There's also a lack of harder dungeon crawling. In Ys 8 there were optional sections that didn't allow you to teleport between checkpoints, so you actually had to try to conserve resources. There was also a huge post-game dungeon in 8 that didn't have a single checkpoint until right before the superboss of the game. Ys 9 has one superboss and I haven't even bothered to fight it. So, it's hard to say of this game is an improvement over 8 and it really comes down to whether you prefer story/characters or combat/gameplay. I do recommend this game, but I would definitely play on Nightmare mode or Hard at the bare minimum.
 

Nutmeg

Arcane
Vatnik Wumao
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
19,803
Location
Mahou Kingdom
Just finished Oath in Felghana.

Played it on Hard rather than Normal like I did with Origin. This was just the right amount of challenge for my skill level. Really pushed me.

Awesome game. Everything was good except the robot-golem-lava-pigeon boss that guy was so tedious.

Interesting that Adol's yellow move has i-frames. I didn't notice if Yunica's from Origin had the same, but I do recall some red "guard" text popping up when I used it so maybe indeed it is the formula they followed. In any case, it's very noticeable in Felghana because it also functions as a dash (rather than a block). Still, because it's metered, it's not something you can just spam like in some other games.

Final boss fight was quite a rush, cause I sucked at it and it took me 20+ attempts to finally nail him. I wish I had save states to practice the very last ping pong fight. It's not overly complicated but the vortex that sucks you in can be very slippery and there's a certain rhythm to it that I wish I could grind. My tip to anyone else playing it is use the D-pad for everything except in the initial pattern when trying to nail the weak spot on his head. Also turn off always dash to better navigate the bullet spiral in the ping pong phase.

Also found out late that there was an update which added the X68K and PC-88 OSTs. So, just got to enjoy the castle and the island with those.

Speaking of the castle, that was a super fun dungeon. Really cool enemies and traps there. First time I was challenged actually getting from point A to B in a Ys game. The other dungeons weren't as memorable. I liked the ruins (2nd dungeon, before you fall into the lava area) as well.

Being a side story, the plot and world weren't as engaging as Origin, which I played after Ys I and II. Overall, I think Ys I, II and Origin were a bit more interesting thematically due to the creation myth and lost civilization themes. That said it was interesting that Galbalan implied Genos was his master, or at least the same race as the goddesses from Ys (winged).

In comparison with Origin, I would say this game has higher highs, but also lower lows. That being said I cleared both on just one difficulty and Origin with only one character so I don't have a very strong opinion which one is better overall right now.

Both are S tier games and I love them.
 
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