Vapourware Realms Beyond: Ashes of the Fallen - Chaos Chronicles reborn and dead again

[fantadomat]

Speaking about Realms Beyond: https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/codex-is-still-mad-about-jarlfrank.124449/.

Good! Cryspo is a mega faggot!

 

[baud]

Lich LARPing doesn’t make you mod of the whole world, and that goes double for toons with 7 INT.

Except the sum total of everything I had to say about this game and JarlFrank's involvement with it can be found in this exact thread. Here on Codex.

Don't blame the lich.

Alright, alright, alright. I’ll check it out. Which is more than you did for me, let it not go unsaid.

Somebody give me a page number.

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads...ow-in-combat-beta.119661/page-24#post-5748427

Latest alpha of combat looks really, really cool.

Semi-serious question, though, @JarlFrank: Aren't you guys worried about your reputation, especially here on Codex, affecting your sales and your image? I mean you've still got swastikas right in your user profile.

You can argue all you want that swastikas don't mean what people think they mean and that you don't care about what people think about what the Nazis did, but you do know as well as I do that in today's, shall we say, sensitive political climate, any and all affections you've clearly plastered all over the place here at Codex and likely elsewhere towards Mr. Hitler and his friends aren't going to be looked upon with much tolerance.

Non-issue? Comments?

P.S. apologies if this has already been addressed previously ITT

I didn't follow the drama then, but it seems to start there

 

[Desiderius]

RetardoLand indeed.

We’ve got non-left Okhrana wannabe dipshits like Hobgoblin tearing our country apart as we speak. Never seen anyone so easily played.

Makes me want to hoist up the Black Flag and join the Left (not that that particular polarity retains much meaning in any case) just to give them exactly what they deserve.

This does explain what happened to RB. Cut the heart right out if it. Look, if you want to have nice things you need a place for dorks who are passionate enough to work for free and dedicate so little time to thinking about anything else that their political (or any other) views make no sense.

We’ve put up with commie dorks for almost two hundred years, you fucktards aren’t going shrivel up and die just because some random illiterate wanted a different flavor of meme politics.

 

[NJClaw]

So this looks very nice... before pledging arewe going to do a Codex fundraiser for backing this?

Guys, most likely, we won't need that money, so please donate your money to help Steve aka Blackthorne.

We can still do some post-campaign Codex fundraiser, but right now, help your fellow codexian because we're doing fine, he, unfortunately is not.

Wow. Wooooooooow.

Wooooooooooooooooooooooooow.

"We are doing fine, bro. We obviously know we didn't get the money we need, bro. But we are going to tell you that we don't need more money, bro. Because this is totally not a scam, bro."

 

[Desiderius]

Lich LARPing doesn’t make you mod of the whole world, and that goes double for toons with 7 INT.

Except the sum total of everything I had to say about this game and JarlFrank's involvement with it can be found in this exact thread. Here on Codex.

Don't blame the lich.

Sry Crisp, you come out looking pretty shitty there, especially the second comment. If you were being sincere those would have been private messages.

The amount of subtext you’re missing in general could fill a second Library of Alexandria. Folks like you were holding the torches at the original.

 

[Mortmal]

One thing that gets me is the "of course we didn't have enough money!" line, but they went ahead and spent money on convention booths? Same thing happened with Barkley 2.

Yes they admit 120k wasnt enough,unrealistic , yet they still set the bar so low willingly knowing they had no additional funding . There's still people defending them on discord of course ...

 

[Bester]

Yes they admit 120k wasnt enough,unrealistic , yet they still set the bar so low willingly knowing they had no additional funding

Gosh! I'm outraged! This never happened before!

Guys please don't pretend to be virgins here, ok?

 

[baud]

One thing that gets me is the "of course we didn't have enough money!" line, but they went ahead and spent money on convention booths? Same thing happened with Barkley 2.

Yes they admit 120k wasnt enough,unrealistic , yet they still set the bar so low willingly knowing they had no additional funding . There's still people defending them on discord of course ...

I think (like other kickstarters before) they intended to use that money to fund a prototype and use it (and the amount of money raised, sign of the interest in the game) to find an editor willing to fork the remaining cash. Except that it wasn't made clear in the KS pitch. In that regard, convention booth aren't surprising: it's not a strapped-cash dev blowing up money on frivolities, rather a dev looking for an editor

 

[Fenix]

In other words, thursday.

Better like that than never.
It's №2 game for me, after Colony Ship.
№3 is Mechjammer.

 

[Efe]

"We are doing fine, bro. We obviously know we didn't get the money we need, bro. But we are going to tell you that we don't need more money, bro. Because this is totally not a scam, bro."

at least Blackthorne survived.. could consider them having a small helping hand in it.

 

[Fenix]

Also this CEO owns 50% of company, other half is in Devs' hands and all decision and contract making power is in hands of this ghost CEO. Balanced!

Yeah more like - I make decisions and you pay for it, we own company 50/50 pal! I was in such situation - once.

Even better, doing all this in a country with a high-ish cost of living, low-ish, eternally stagnant wages, super high taxes and a largely dead gamedev scene... With peanuts for funding.

Was thinking the exactly same from the start.

Summary - it's so depressing (blame winter for that).

 

[Vault Dweller]

Why? Cause they/us were such little passive weak bitches. These fellaz will wait for unknown amount of time to pass until their CEO is finished with dealmaking thou they havent heared from him in months, he ghosted them and have no reason to believe he's making any deals except spending their money on migrant shelters, kebab meals, german beer, Microsoft Excell 2020 Pro and OnlyFans subscriptions

Also this CEO owns 50% of company, other half is in Devs' hands and all decision and contract making power is in hands of this ghost CEO. Balanced!

It's a small indie studio. There are no CEOs there and there's no real ownership of anything because there's very little traditional value there. If the person who registered the company went awol, fuck, register another company, open another bank account, rename the game if necessary. It's that fucking simple.

For the record, the game looks really cool and very promising, so it would be a shame if they just give up and walk away.

 

[mediocrepoet]

It's a small indie studio. There are no CEOs there and there's no real ownership of anything because there's very little traditional value there. If the person who registered the company went awol, fuck, register another company, open another bank account, rename the game if necessary. It's that fucking simple.

For the record, the game looks really cool and very promising, so it would be a shame if they just give up and walk away.

I had that thought that they could just take everything and run, but that depends whether or not their story is at all above board and whether any of them has the managerial skills to start pushing them to do anything at all.

More sympathetically, I figure they may also specifically not want to do any of that given they did something like that with Chaos Chronicles and got themselves into a legal dispute over assets, IIRC.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I had that thought that they could just take everything and run...

It's not running if the person in charge stopped communicating and/or lost interest months ago.

More sympathetically, I figure they may also specifically not want to do any of that given they did something like that with Chaos Chronicles and got themselves into a legal dispute over assets, IIRC.

What's the alternative though? Just abandon years of work because someone might sue them?

 

[mediocrepoet]

I had that thought that they could just take everything and run...

It's not running if the person in charge stopped communicating and/or lost interest months ago.

More sympathetically, I figure they may also specifically not want to do any of that given they did something like that with Chaos Chronicles and got themselves into a legal dispute over assets, IIRC.

What's the alternative though? Just abandon years of work because someone might sue them?

Yeah, I hear you. I have to assume that there's some actual passion for the project (or was) since they tried to revive it after the entire Chaos Chronicles debacle. I'm just not convinced that they have the proper managerial component to budget and actually get anything done. So I assume that with that and running out of money, they're all back to day jobs and trying to sort out what to do but have no one to actually kick them in the ass and push in a direction.*

The only other assumption that makes sense to me is fraud, but I doubt that.

* Disclaimer: This is all purely speculation. I have no idea what these guys are up to.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Yeah, I hear you. I have to assume that there's some actual passion for the project (or was) since they tried to revive it after the entire Chaos Chronicles debacle. I'm just not convinced that they have the proper managerial component to budget and actually get anything done.

They put together a combat beta, which is a major milestone and a testament to their ability to work together and get things done. When you get this far, it makes no sense to quit, even if you ran out of money.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Their CEO (HobGob42Trash) wrote:
/start quote
I "left" the codex last year or so because I was sick of being permanently harrassed in almost every thread/topic by so called Alt-Rights/Trumpists/Neo Nazis.
/end quote


So 75 millions+ Americans who voted for Trump are put in same company as Neo Nazis.
Look i can do it too, for example. I got hate sometimes from Biden supporters/pedophiles/socialists. This was an example of how it looks like.

p.s.
I think it is good that it is vapouware. Good riddance.

Yeah, it's really hard to stay out of GD and the politics subforum. Even if you go in, you usually have to start something yourself for anyone to look at you twice.

 

[:Flash:]

I had that thought that they could just take everything and run...

It's not running if the person in charge stopped communicating and/or lost interest months ago.

More sympathetically, I figure they may also specifically not want to do any of that given they did something like that with Chaos Chronicles and got themselves into a legal dispute over assets, IIRC.

What's the alternative though? Just abandon years of work because someone might sue them?

According to HobGob, he agreed to the 50/50, because they both owned assets that were required for the game. Drude had been a level editor on Chaos Chronicles. They won back the right to the Chaos Chronicles code and assets, I guess because bitComposer failed some milestone payments. This is also the reason that Portuguese Chaos Chronicles continuation, created by the company that had bought the bitComposer assets out of liquidation, was cancelled.

It was still an extremely stupid move. Just give 2% of the company to the graphics guy as a tie breaker and this situation wouldn't exist. Anyone you ask will tell you that much.

But it's crystal clear that they can't release the game without Drude. If he didn't care he wouldn't have stopped the publishing deal. So if the re-start without him, he has the means to stop them, and he will.

 

[Reinhardt]

But it's crystal clear that they can't release the game without Drude. If he didn't care he wouldn't have stopped the publishing deal. So if the re-start without him, he has the means to stop them, and he will.

Maybe he's secretly nazi himself so he was pissed because of J*rlFr*nk firing.

 

[Bester]

Just give 2% of the company to the graphics guy as a tie breaker and this situation wouldn't exist.

Chris Avellone had a share in Obshitian and was bought out for some funny amount like $5k. There are no mechanisms to prevent the tyranny of the majority. If one dude and his beta orbiter are the majority, it's their company. If two dudes can vote to kick out the third guy, nobody is safe, someone will get kicked out just out of greed 1 day before release. It's all shit.

 

[Efe]

could be true.
according to trusted sources, majority of germans have nazi tendenciies and are racist af

 

[Bester]

So if the re-start without him, he has the means to stop them, and he will.

It's far from given.

The way it works is this.
- You release a game on Steam
- Druid files a DMCA claim
- Steam reviews DMCA claims every Tuesday, so that leaves you an open window of 7 days to make some sales at the very least, if you time it right. That's money that goes to your bank account no matter what in 2 months.
- Steam takes your game down.
- Now here's a crucial thing. Druid now has 10 days to start a court case. If he fails to do that within 10 days, the game goes back on Steam and can't be taken down by him again. Unless Druid knows exactly what he's doing and comes prepared, it's very easy to miss that window, especially in covid times.

Other than this, Druid has no incentive to block the game from Steam if it actually releases. He's entitled to half the money, and he can get it. It'll be in his interest to keep the game on Steam, not the opposite.

What he stopped was some publisher deal. They probably offered some advance money in exchange of the large portion of the first 3 years of revenue or something like that. Bad deal, he stopped it. Nothing irrational in his behavior. Hobo and Druid not being on speaking terms is just interpersonal stuff. Someone probably fucked someone's girlfriend is what I'd put my money on.

 

[Desiderius]

But it's crystal clear that they can't release the game without Drude. If he didn't care he wouldn't have stopped the publishing deal. So if the re-start without him, he has the means to stop them, and he will.

Maybe he's secretly nazi himself so he was pissed because of J*rlFr*nk firing.

Nahtzees aren’t the ones pissed off by that kind of shit. They get off on it.

https://www.britannica.com/event/Night-of-the-Long-Knives

 

[Vault Dweller]

Just give 2% of the company to the graphics guy as a tie breaker and this situation wouldn't exist.

Chris Avellone had a share in Obshitian and was bought out for some funny amount like $5k. There are no mechanisms to prevent the tyranny of the majority. If one dude and his beta orbiter are the majority, it's their company. If two dudes can vote to kick out the third guy, nobody is safe, someone will get kicked out just out of greed 1 day before release. It's all shit.

It's their company in a sense that the majority decides which projects to take, how much money to spend, whom to hire, etc, but a co-owner's share is set in stone. If Chris did sell his share for 5k, it must have been an emotional decision on his part, like pay me what you want, I don't want any dealings with you guys. In any other case, he could (and should) have kept his share and enjoyed a steady income over the years.

Edit:

What he stopped was some publisher deal. They probably offered some advance money in exchange of the large portion of the first 3 years of revenue or something like that. Bad deal, he stopped it. Nothing irrational in his behavior.

If the company needs money to pay its employees or contractors and it's the only way to move forward, then saying no to a publisher or investor, thus killing the project, is an extremely dumb and irrational move. It's better to release a game and get paid nothing but salaries than to kill it and get paid nothing at all.

 

[Bester]

Just give 2% of the company to the graphics guy as a tie breaker and this situation wouldn't exist.

Chris Avellone had a share in Obshitian and was bought out for some funny amount like $5k. There are no mechanisms to prevent the tyranny of the majority. If one dude and his beta orbiter are the majority, it's their company. If two dudes can vote to kick out the third guy, nobody is safe, someone will get kicked out just out of greed 1 day before release. It's all shit.

It's their company in a sense that the majority decides which projects to take, how much money to spend, whom to hire, etc, but a co-owner's share is set in stone. If Chris did sell his share for 5k, it must have been an emotional decision on his part, like pay me what you want, I don't want any dealings with you guys. In any other case, he could (and should) have kept his share and enjoyed a steady income over the years.

I'll confess I'm not an expert on this thing, but I've seen it more than once to know it's real.

As for the question if there are ways to prevent it, that's open to discussion. But it's a fact that these things exist and happen all the time.

I know of 3 guys in Belgium that forced the 4th owner out for 150k the night before the company sold for 6 million. Majority decision.