Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Early Access Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Harthwain]

What are some of the most significant changes that Larian has done to the D&D mechanics? I keep reading how people say that they don't like the homebrew, but I've not found anyone specify what exactly are the changes.

Here are some lists:

Just a very minor tidbit from the official forum, as a highlight of what sucks:

• Wizard can still learn Cleric spells, since this is patch 4, starting to think Larian sees this as a feature and no a bug.
• Food still heals in combat and since there's a video tutorial for it, I expect that is here to stay.
• Moving behind someone still gives advantage and since there's a video tutorial for it, I expect that is here to stay.
• Higher ground still gives avantage for attacker and since there's a video tutorial for it, I expect that is here to stay.

And also disengage and shove still are fucking bonus actions.

If that's the case, Swen, here's the list of changes to the game that would greatly help our love to bloom even more.

1) Dodge action implemented
2) Ready action/Overwatch implemented
3) Disengage nerfed to take an action
4) Casting a spell and repeated casting of that spell (speak with dead amulet) should be a single button, not two separate buttons.
5) Menacing/Pushing attack don't need to be separated into two buttons, but should instead do melee or ranged attack depending on the equipped weapon.
6) Sneak attack should not be a button at all, but should work automatically, including on opportunity attacks.
7) Reactions should be implemented properly, like in Solasta. Smites should work on the same principle.
8) Flaming sphere must take the caster's initiative, and be moved using their turn.
9) Mage hand should not be able to push people.
10) Please stop altering Shadowheart's character at Reddit's complaints.

 

[Mortmal]

Solo runs are a terrible idea in D&D its party based, and necromancer is poorly designed school, they really have nothing, no synergies.

"At 2nd level, you gain the ability to reap life energy from creatures you kill with your spells. Once per turn when you kill one ar more creatures with a spell of 1st level or higher, you regain hit points equal to twice the spell's levei, or three times its level if the spell belongs to the School of Necramancy. Vou don't gain this benefit for killing constructs or undead."
So what the fuck were they thinking ? You are not getting into melee , the hit point drain is useless and weak, if you are getting in melee you are dead .

"At 6th levei, you add the animate dead spell to your spellbook if it is not there already, When you cast animate dead, you can target one additional corpse or pile of bones, creating another zombie or ske1eton,as appropriate"

6TH level and you finally get a shitty minion, the first act of BG3 is not covering it .There's a lot better and more useful to get. you sure arent ruling a kingdom with necromancy with a 5E necro.

 

[NJClaw]

What are some of the most significant changes that Larian has done to the D&D mechanics? I keep reading how people say that they don't like the homebrew, but I've not found anyone specify what exactly are the changes.

As of now, I'd say that their worst decisions are:

- giving advantage on attack rolls in questionable situations (higher ground, being behind the enemy). It's too easy to go behind an enemy during an encounter to attack him with advantage, and it makes no sense. With this system in place, an optimal encounter between two fighters would consist of each one of them going behind the other during his turn to gain advantage.
- lowering enemies' AC and increasing their HP. This is not actually "homebrew" since it's described in the DMG, but it's still a very dumb decision motivated by the fact that apparently casual players don't enjoy missing their attacks (if you are reading, fuck you Swen). Solasta showed that this is absolutely not necessary, and that's basically an unnecessary nerf to spells that don't target AC (like Fireball).
- making certain special actions (disengage/dash jump) usable with a bonus action. This completely breaks how encounters play out, since you can disengage at will and go wherever the fuck you want.

Sadly, these don't seem like changes that they can easily revert, since every encounter is probably designed around them. Obviously mods will fix it™, but that's not the point.

 

[Anonona]

Actually it makes kingmaker WORSE. Ground effects like Deadly Earth becomes extremely more powerful due the lack of fly. Deadly Earth is worthless vs a flying dragon on TT game. On Kingmaker, is a win button. As for teleport and dimensional lock. If you are in a lich cruypt, makes sense that the lich will have a dimensional lock to prevent his "research subjects" to escape for eg.

You are not precisely wrong, but I invalidating the whole traveling management aspect would have been a more serious issue that the loss of counter strategies against certain spells. And about the lich Dimension lock, again, not all campaigns will have liches or enemies that are able to stop you. It can seriously limit the kind of stories you can tell without hurting the suspension of disbelief as for why the mage just doesn't use certain spells.

I said many times. Make then more interesting. Not everyone equally boring to be played.

In this we agree.

 

[Varnaan]

Specialists outside of RP reasons only work when the entire spell system allows all spells to benefit from it as Sharpedge said.
In the BG games evoker is always the GOAT because big boom kill everything is a thing and the favored way of playing, and the only real counter the game has is magic immunity.
Evoker > generalist > specialists with access to evocation spells > specialists without evocation spells.

 

[Fedora Master]

All they have to do is copy the fucking manual verbatim but Noooo, gotta fuck around with it to shoehorn in your own retarded ideas.

And there's people here who defend these arrogant hacks.

 

[Shackleton]

What are some of the most significant changes that Larian has done to the D&D mechanics? I keep reading how people say that they don't like the homebrew, but I've not found anyone specify what exactly are the changes.

- giving advantage on attack rolls in questionable situations (higher ground, being behind the enemy). It's too easy to go behind an enemy during an encounter to attack him with advantage, and it makes no sense. With this system in place, an optimal encounter between two fighters would consist of each one of them going behind the other during his turn to gain advantage.

I guess Sven played a bit too much Dark Souls PvP



I can see this playing fantastically in turn-based.

 

[NJClaw]

All they have to do is copy the fucking manual verbatim but Noooo, gotta fuck around with it to shoehorn in your own retarded ideas.

And there's people here who defend these arrogant hacks.

people

 

[Varnaan]

All they have to do is copy the fucking manual verbatim but Noooo, gotta fuck around with it to shoehorn in your own retarded ideas.

And there's people here who defend these arrogant hacks.

Saying that in the context of BG is ironic considering the absolute state of the ruleset in the first two games.

 

[Gargaune]

- giving advantage on attack rolls in questionable situations (higher ground, being behind the enemy). It's too easy to go behind an enemy during an encounter to attack him with advantage, and it makes no sense.

And just for the record, stacking three crates and climbing onto them yields one level of elevation for Advantage purposes. Henceforth, the Advantage shall become a unit of measurement equal to 60 lb or 27.2155422 kg.

 

[copebot]

Some of these issues are just exacerbated by making too many things bonus actions and by having a superpowered disengage/jump. The issues with HP/AC are more related to the messed up balance of encounters (which tend to be far beyond what any party of that level should be capable of facing) and the poor balance of resting. Yeah, no kidding that low HP will be an issue if the party is facing tons of goblins every encounter with player class levels or gnolls with powerful triple-shot feats.

 

[Fedora Master]

All they have to do is copy the fucking manual verbatim but Noooo, gotta fuck around with it to shoehorn in your own retarded ideas.

And there's people here who defend these arrogant hacks.

Saying that in the context of BG is ironic considering the absolute state of the ruleset in the first two games.

All the more reason to do it right this time.

 

[underground nymph]

dash

I believe dash is an action.

 

[Sharpedge]

The rule changes are the thing that irritate me the least because they are easy to mod and change as you desire. Story and User interface are my 2 main concerns, because I don't trust modders to write a good story (modder tier writing is almost always some of the worst) and I don't think modders can fix problems with the interface. It would be great if Larian did fix everything, but I don't expect they will and until they are fixed, I will focus my own personal complaints on the things that we cannot fix ourselves (lets be real, they aren't going to fix this stuff anyhow).

 

[Nano]

Specialists outside of RP reasons only work when the entire spell system allows all spells to benefit from it as Sharpedge said.
In the BG games evoker is always the GOAT because big boom kill everything is a thing and the favored way of playing, and the only real counter the game has is magic immunity.
Evoker > generalist > specialists with access to evocation spells > specialists without evocation spells.

Necromancy has the best damage spells, dude. Skull Trap and Horrid Wilting.

 

[NJClaw]

dash

I believe dash is an action.

Yeah, you can't dash as a bonus action, but you can jump and that gives you almost as much extra movement as a proper dash. Unless they fixed it in a recent patch for some reason, of course.

 

[hell bovine]

My point is that the difference between a illusionist and a necromancer is not that big and there are few situations where the necro is better. On Pillars 2, why anyone would even make a conjurer wizard?

The difference becomes noticeable once you actually face challenging enemies, which is the point. Otherwise you won't notice a difference, not because there isn't any, but because the game is easy either way. If you can beat it by waving a wand of cloudkill around, then anyone capable of equipping this wand will do. Of course, a game can still deliver a fun experience, if it utilizes a character's class, or abilities, or any other class building mechanics outside of combat to craft a story as you play. But BG2 acknowledges your class only in strongholds, so there are no such options there.

Which you actually have in BG3, though for now there is a definitive bias. Drow seem to get the most out of dialogues, followed by the druid class.

 

[Larianshill]

and that's basically an unnecessary nerf to spells that don't target AC (like Fireball).

There's no such thing as an "unnecessary nerf to spells". Casters deserve to suffer.

 

[Cryomancer]

"At 6th levei, you add the animate dead spell to your spellbook if it is not there already, When you cast animate dead, you can target one additional corpse or pile of bones, creating another zombie or ske1eton,as appropriate"

Except by evokation, all 5e wizard specializations are WORTHLESS. Necromancers lost the OHK spells and can only animate low CR undead. Larian is making necromancer even worse cuz you can't have a familiar an mage hand eqquiped. That heavily indicates a single summon limit.

I will honestly wait till someone mods the 5e PALEMASTER into BG3. Before that, Will play as a Great Old One WLK.

Necromancy has the best damage spells, dude. Skull Trap and Horrid Wilting.

5 animated skeletons more strong than a polar bear with tier 5 spells that synergies well with cloudkill and cone of cold.
Skull trap which with sequencers can dish 60d6 damage in a instant
Wail of the BAnshee, Finger of Death and other powerful spells
(...)
Those who thinks that necromancy is not great on BG2 clearly never tried those spells.

There's no such thing as an "unnecessary nerf to spells". Casters deserve to suffer.

Larian fanboys hates more casters than Sawyer fanboys...

 

[Mortmal]

Diviner and abjuration are good especially diviner, that will never be implemented.

 

[Varnaan]

Which you actually have in BG3, though for now there is a definitive bias. Drow seem to get the most out of dialogues, followed by the druid class.

That's reasonable considering the state of Drows in the D&D universe and the fact that the first arc of BG3 is extremely druid focused.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Specialists outside of RP reasons only work when the entire spell system allows all spells to benefit from it as Sharpedge said.
In the BG games evoker is always the GOAT because big boom kill everything is a thing and the favored way of playing, and the only real counter the game has is magic immunity.
Evoker > generalist > specialists with access to evocation spells > specialists without evocation spells.

Necromancy has the best damage spells, dude. Skull Trap and Horrid Wilting.

Plus an Enchanter will trivialize most of BG1's encounters. The game throws wands for magic missile/fireball/lightning like candy so you'll never really feel like you're missing out on Evocation spells if you really do want to cast them.

 

[Nano]

Plus an Enchanter will trivialize most of BG1's encounters. The game throws wands for magic missile/fireball/lightning like candy so you'll never really feel like you're missing out on Evocation spells if you really do want to cast them.

The one thing Enchanters have going against them is the lack of Sequencers and Contingencies in BG2... but SCS turns those into universal spells, so Enchanters no longer have any major weaknesses.

 

[Cryomancer]

I talked about cooler spells, amazing mythic paths, amazing classes to chose from, but the real reason which PF:WoTR >>> BG3 is that Arueshalae > Shadowheart!!! just kidding. Any chance that we will get a psionic class on BG3?

 

[Johannes]

- making certain special actions (disengage/dash jump) usable with a bonus action. This completely breaks how encounters play out, since you can disengage at will and go wherever the fuck you want.

Nice, the game has BG combat after all