Fallout Yet another Fallout: New Vegas faction discussion

[Sigourn]

God tier intellect House fails to anticipate Benny fucking him over, is unable to retrieve the chip from Benny, and has to sit with a thumb up his ass until the Courier arrives. And this is the fucking guy you think is the best option?

Reminder that non-genius writers writing genius characters rarely goes well.

Lore > writing, and lore says House is a fucking genius and I'll take that over cancer man. Bonus points as a House victory allows the NCR to get their shit together instead of disappearing into thin air.

 

[Mark Richard]

Moral? What in the actual fuck? Slavers and rapists are moral? Killing and assimilating a culture and erasing its history is moral?. In all my playthroughs I allied with the Legion once and I felt disgusted the whole way through. And it also has no future. Caesar dies, they cannibalize each other.

Only if Caesar dies before his conquest is complete. In New Vegas he's leading a nomadic army. He plans to merge the civilian infrastructure of the NCR with his military, forming a proper empire that will survive his death.

Savagely curtailing individual freedoms to abolish other cultural identities allowed the Roman Empire to exist for a thousand years. When a civilization tolerates diversity to such an extreme as to allow for incompatible ideologies, it becomes increasingly unstable. The Master knew our differences would destroy us and sought to unify mankind by eliminating race, but I think his plan had more holes than Al Bundy's socks. Surely the super mutants would've splintered into different groups and ended up fighting each other anyway, because race is fairly superficial compared to culture and shared values.

The NCR is arguably an evolutionary dead end. The proof isn't merely in their logistical impotence, but the very irritated ground you're standing on. As for House... his moderate bigot-free pragmatism can be alluring, but it's that very same outlook which blinds him to the realities of human nature. He doesn't understand people and doesn't care to, expecting civilization to flourish under his rule without any guidance. It's like dealing with a robot keeping human pets. 'I've given you food and water, what more do you want?!'

If you could be certain that supporting Caesar's Legion would cause untold suffering in the short term but also lead to a new age of prosperity, would you do it? Is it not moral to use your historical insight to curate the wasteland for the future, or are the people who exist in the present all that matters? Should priority be given to the welfare of the individual, or the species as a whole? Do the ends justify the means? These are just some of the questions Fallout asks of players.

 

[Kum Kum Supreme Imperator]

And that's why Fallout New Vegas or Bloodlines are such masterpieces: in the end, nobody seriously cares about their engines, their graphics or their shitty combat, they just fight about the politics of their factions.
And that is CRPG at its best.

Envoyé de mon SM-A515F en utilisant Tapatalk

 

[BarãodoDesterro]

I have not read everything (one could have already share my afflictions), but I believe two fundamental misconceptions had aroused.

(1) The idea that NCR controls (has sovereignty over) Nevada. Or how it is really hard to measure success when someone is not even trying.

The only two previous defeats by NCR in Mojave are military ones: Camp Searchlight and Nelson.

Nipton is an independent city, it was not under NCR jurisdiction.

The Fiends, which are harassing the outskirts of Freeside (which is an independent city) and New Vegas (which is House’s city), would only be a NCR’s defeat if the NCR decided it was its fight in the first place. The caravans around Mojave are heavily armed by a reason: back in California, Cass supposedly started a caravan business roaming alone.

(2) The idea that NCR’s Mojave is NCR at all. Or how the Legion simply won’t be able to set foot on the Long 15.

There is no merging military infrastructure with civilian infrastructure because NCR have not even established civilian structure in Nevada.

And the idea of an invasion on actual NCR is absurd.

Archaic forms of constitution may be able to “win” when a modern state is trying to invade an untamed land, but never when invading the modern state itself.

 

[Vormulak]

And that's why Fallout New Vegas or Bloodlines are such masterpieces: in the end, nobody seriously cares about their engines, their graphics or their shitty combat, they just fight about the politics of their factions.
And that is CRPG at its best.

Envoyé de mon SM-A515F en utilisant Tapatalk

Maybe if it were done better but the depth of the factions in NV is comparable to a puddle, especially the legion. They didn't have nearly enough time to flesh out the factions as the game warranted.

 

[laclongquan]

About why NCR consider Mojave to be theirs

1. What's the most important in Mojave? The Hoover Dam and the lakes with its pure water, suitable for drinking and agriculture. And NCR troopers holding both. Every place else is just to serve these two critical possessions.

2. What's the biggest NCR's investment in here? Aside from the troops, which is important but only to protect economic interests. Aside from the troops, NCR civilians flood the cultivatable area around lake meads and Hoover Dam. Major companies invest here: NCR sharecropper system (and the pipe drawing water up) , Gun Runner, Van Graff, Crimson Caravan, and a bunch of small time companies transporting stuffs for big guys.

With that kind of investment, NCR can rightly think Mojave to be theirs.

 

[Zlaja]

Which is why you still get autismos discussing the factions and politics a decade later

No, that's because they don't have jobs.

 

[SharkClub]

Hey guys who do you think is best for the future of the Commonwealth? The Minutemen, Railroad, BoS or Institute??

No?

Well alright then.

 

[purupuru]

Reading this thread has made me realize that Caesar's Legion is actually more Mongolian than Roman. Which is funny because we already have the Great Khans, who turned out to be a bunch of insignificant losers.

 

[typical user]

About why NCR consider Mojave to be theirs

1. What's the most important in Mojave? The Hoover Dam and the lakes with its pure water

Wait, wasn't that water purified at some point before reaching New Vegas farms? NCR can just filter out salt from Pacific unless it is irradiated. But then how would lakes in Mojave be pristine? Hoover Dam is just a dam without any filtering going on.

In my opinion they care about Mojave because:

• Vegas is a tourist trap, especially Brahmin Barons who might be bored of New Reno
• a new land means new enemies to wage war against, perfect for making money as a gun runner or a politician like Kimball running for reelection
• new land to sell to Brahmin Barons or give considering NCR politicians are in ther back pockets
• Hoover Dam can help NCR with growing power consumption
• new places to trade, new customers to satisfy

Reading this thread has made me realize that Caesar's Legion is actually more Mongolian than Roman. Which is funny because we already have the Great Khans, who turned out to be a bunch of insignificant losers.

Well Khans got wiped out two times by Vault Dweller and Chosen One so I wouldn't say losers rather poor bastards who got punched in the face and the groin for making the effort to shit on NCR two times in the row.

 

[Humbaba]

Reading this thread has made me realize that Caesar's Legion is actually more Mongolian than Roman. Which is funny because we already have the Great Khans, who turned out to be a bunch of insignificant losers.

The Legion is meant to be fascist not literally Roman. The whole we wuzzing on their part only serves as a unifying national identity in order to eliminate tribalism.

 

[laclongquan]

About why NCR consider Mojave to be theirs

1. What's the most important in Mojave? The Hoover Dam and the lakes with its pure water

Wait, wasn't that water purified at some point before reaching New Vegas farms? NCR can just filter out salt from Pacific unless it is irradiated. But then how would lakes in Mojave be pristine? Hoover Dam is just a dam without any filtering going on.

It's not processed in anyway. The water, from the lake, go through the pipes, go out to sharescropper farms, and get diverted by Freeside (The Kings holding one open, and the other run to freeside farm).

They can do it because no nuke falling on the region, so the water is relatively rad-free compared to other areas. Lake Mead is deep inside continent so no relation to Pacific's sea water. Its water come from Colorado river, and its upriver source is from Rocky mountain .