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CD Projekt's Cyberpunk 2077 Update 2.0 + Phantom Liberty Expansion Thread

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The best thing they could do is to revoke all licences across all platforms and publish an apology that said "sorry".
People would still defend them though, lel.

Fuck off, everyone who bougt this shit, fuck off!
And keep deluding yourselves that you're having fun with it, haha.
 
Self-Ejected

T.Ashpool

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Effort well spent. I visited that apartment like 4 times in the entire play-through.

the whole megabuilding you're living in is completly pointless. it has just 2 floors and it has nothing but a gun shop you don't need to visit a single time because looting guns is more effective. you don't use the stash in your appartment because you can just use the stash in your car. there is nobody you can talk to or interact with. i still remember when they called the building a living ecosystem or something like that lol. maybe they'll add something to it in the "night city expansion" pack but i seriously doubt that.
 

DeepOcean

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People are claiming CDPR isnt talking about the paid DLC because they are thinking on canning them. Could it be true or are they just tight lipped because they still dont know what features they cut on the base game and are going to charge for on the DLC?
 

gerey

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People are claiming CDPR isnt talking about the paid DLC because they are thinking on canning them.
While I love to shit on CDPR, I'd argue they're keeping mum on the paid DLC for the foreseeable future to avoid getting accused of locking features cut from the base game behind a paywall.
 

racofer

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People are claiming CDPR isnt talking about the paid DLC because they are thinking on canning them.
The butthurt this move would generate could power the entire planet for the next century.

Still, it is possible, considering that consoles are no longer a target market, thus reducing profit margins considerably for any future paid DLC. The goodwill towards the game is probably way worse than CDPR publicly acknowledges, and they know further investments into this game will probably not return a profit.
 

Grotesque

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People are claiming CDPR isnt talking about the paid DLC because they are thinking on canning them.
The butthurt this move would generate could power the entire planet for the next century.

Still, it is possible, considering that consoles are no longer a target market, thus reducing profit margins considerably for any future paid DLC. The goodwill towards the game is probably way worse than CDPR publicly acknowledges, and they know further investments into this game will probably not return a profit.


They didn't receive not even nearly as much as the butthurt the devs on No man's Sky received.

And now everybody loves them
 

gerey

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And now everybody loves them
Because they stuck to their product and kept releasing update after update that introduced previously promised features and new content.

Granted, none of the updates really fixed the core gameplay issues the game suffers from, but for years they've kept polishing the turd despite all the mockery and criticism, and if nothing else that deserves respect.

They actually clawed their back into the public's good graces again and proved they are willing to support their games.

It remains to be seen if CDPR is capable of pulling something similar off. My bet is that they are neither able to properly fix the game, nor financially in a position to do so.

At best they'll keep the patching charade up a little longer, release a few free DLC featuring whatever cut content can be finished on the cheap, release a paid DLC with cut content that requires a bit more effort to complete and call it a day.

What they will not be able to recover is their reputation, since the vast majority of what they promised is unachievable with the resources currently at their disposal.
 

RRRrrr

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I like how the game did romances. This is the first game I have played that had romances that looked like something from real life, from the cheesy text messages to the awkward flirtation and the realistic first person perspective. Why do games only manage to do realistic romances now? Did game devs just start dating and have only now seen a woman? Completely different from the cringy incel fantasies we had before.
 

Gargaune

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And now everybody loves them
Because they stuck to their product and kept releasing update after update that introduced previously promised features and new content.

Granted, none of the updates really fixed the core gameplay issues the game suffers from, but for years they've kept polishing the turd despite all the mockery and criticism, and if nothing else that deserves respect.

They actually clawed their back into the public's good graces again and proved they are willing to support their games.

It remains to be seen if CDPR is capable of pulling something similar off. My bet is that they are neither able to properly fix the game, nor financially in a position to do so.

At best they'll keep the patching charade up a little longer, release a few free DLC featuring whatever cut content can be finished on the cheap, release a paid DLC with cut content that requires a bit more effort to complete and call it a day.

What they will not be able to recover is their reputation, since the vast majority of what they promised is unachievable with the resources currently at their disposal.
If they didn't fix NMS's "core gameplay issues", i.e. the lack thereof, where's the redemption in "polishing" said turd? Hello Games are a tiny indie studio who made out like bandits selling a glorified university project at AAA prices and volume, thanks to Sony's publishing muscle and an awkwardly sympathetic press, so they can probably keep "polishing" NMS for another ten years just for the fuck of it.

Cyberpunk's development, on the other hand, most likely burns through NMS's entire budget in a month. And regardless of resources, its gameplay issues go back to core design, there's nothing to "fix" anymore short of redeveloping the game from scratch. Of course, I'm talking about actual gameplay issues, like the progression systems and level design, not Reddit whining that they can't play taxi or buy houses. The best CDPR could do is build better gameplay in DLCs, to the extent the mechanics will support it, and try to salvage their performance scaling, but I'm concerned that they may end up doing neither.
 
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T.Ashpool

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I like how the game did romances. This is the first game I have played that had romances that looked like something from real life, from the cheesy text messages to the awkward flirtation and the realistic first person perspective. Why do games only manage to do realistic romances now? Did game devs just start dating and have only now seen a woman? Completely different from the cringy incel fantasies we had before.

you know what would be awesome if panam tells you she can't have sex right now because she's on her period or because she feels ugly on that day or whatever. love that realistic shit. even better, how about a quest where you have to meet her nomad parents and they invite you to an awkward dinner and interrogate you about what you're doing for a living? or she suddenly stops talking to you and you spend a week trying to figure out what's wrong only to find out she's pissed because she saw you talking to judy. no fuck that i want my incel fantasies back thank you
 

somewhatgiggly

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I like how the game did romances. This is the first game I have played that had romances that looked like something from real life, from the cheesy text messages to the awkward flirtation and the realistic first person perspective. Why do games only manage to do realistic romances now? Did game devs just start dating and have only now seen a woman? Completely different from the cringy incel fantasies we had before.

you know what would be awesome if panam tells you she can't have sex right now because she's on her period or because she feels ugly on that day or whatever. love that realistic shit. even better, how about a quest where you have to meet her nomad parents and they invite you to an awkward dinner and interrogate you about what you're doing for a living? or she suddenly stops talking to you and you spend a week trying to figure out what's wrong only to find out she's pissed because she saw you talking to judy. no fuck that i want my incel fantasies back thank you

I just want it to be a little different. Like I didn't go for it at the Haboob and the Basilik came out of left field. Like, lady, all I did was merc shit. I saved your dad-boss, got you a tank. I would like a quest where you take her to NC, relax, enjoy a small job, bond more.
 

gerey

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so they can probably keep "polishing" NMS for another ten years just for the fuck of it
But as you said, they made bank, and since they were such a small studio they could have all comfortably retired from the industry, yet they decided to to stick to their guns. I'm not saying they didn't get lucky or that they didn't have help in hyping up their game, just that they could have taken the easy way out, but didn't.

Cyberpunk's development, on the other hand, most likely burns through NMS's entire budget in a month.
And yet they seem incapable of fixing even the most mundane of bugs. How many months did it take them to change what likely amounts to a few numbers to increase the spawn distance of cops - a system they've already said was a placeholder? They have hundreds of employees, yet nearly 3 months after release the game is still a mess.

Just because CDPR has a higher overhead than the NMS devs is no excuse - unlike them this wasn't their first big game, yet they deliberately kept overpromising and hyping the game up right up until the day of release.

not Reddit whining that they can't play taxi or buy houses
That's not "Reddit whining", that's literally stuff that CDPR promised was going to be in the game, but wasn't. Need I remind you of that whole intro video montage showing your PC doing all kinds of cool stuff that they used to purposely mislead people into thinking was actual things you could do in the game?

This isn't an issue of people building up a game in their heads that never existed, this was CDPR deliberately lying about the content available in the game and marketing it is a futuristic GTA V (at least in the sense of available side activities) and repeatedly hyping up Night City as a living and breathing city, and this when the game somehow still lags behind GTA III in the simulation aspect.
 

Drowed

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Lel, who respects NMS devs? Some normies and shills.

I mean, yeah? That's 99% of Hello Games and CDPR's audience. Personally, I think No Man's Sky is still a terrible game, but after the 2016 disaster, they kept releasing updates with content for literally half a decade, and all for free. They released another one last month! And well, free shit is still shit, obviously, but even if they didn't change everyone's opinion about the game, they definitely managed to convince a lot of the "normies", as you said. The game has sold more, and today the perception is considerably positive. I don't doubt at all that a "No Man's Sky 2" would break new pre-order records.

Ironically, I think Cyberpunk is more fundamentally broken than No Man's Sky. NMS suffered mainly from lack of (a fucking ton of) content - the basis of the gameplay and systems have been essentially the same since launch, they just gradually added more stuff and polished the game more. Cyberpunk has fundamentally broken systems that would have to be remade basically from scratch to work. Even with 2 gigantic patches we still see cars disappearing when you are not looking at them, magic police, absurd reactions from NPCs, etc. The entire system that controls the game's NPCs and vehicles is fucked up, and it's definitely not something that a few tweaks can fix. The problem is not even the lack of content in the game (although it is clear that massive amounts of content have been cut), or the last-gen versions (which should not exist and everyone should forget about them), but rather that even under the best of conditions, the game simply does not work.

I could be totally wrong here. After all I was wrong once before, I thought Cyberpunk would be an acceptable FPS, a futuristic Witcher 3, so I could be wrong again here. But I really don't believe that CDPR will put the necessary effort into turning this game into something presentable. (If that is even possible.) I even believe that they will persist for a few months, releasing patches until they can disguise "well enough" the problems in the pillars of the game. But I bet it will be all smoke and mirrors, that without much effort you will always be able to see the disaster that is trying to be hidden behind "pretty graphics" just so they can sell their DLC in the future. The question is whether they will be able to makeup the game enough to regain its status with the media and the 'fans'.
 

gerey

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The question is whether they will be able to makeup the game enough to regain its status with the media and the 'fans'.
Nah, that ship has sailed.

Unless they pull a NMS-style "redemption" story, which I doubt they can financially support for more than a few months, they are unlikely to regain their status.
 

Yosharian

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Yeah no man's sky is still a really bad game, I keep trying to get into it and every time it's just horrible.

CP2077 needs like... a year of development to get it into a state where it isn't embarrassingly bad in specific areas.
 

RRRrrr

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you know what would be awesome if panam tells you she can't have sex right now because she's on her period or because she feels ugly on that day or whatever. love that realistic shit.
The most relatable part of the game was when you are making out with Rogue, will almost start fucking and she suddenly say "Sorry, I can't. This feels wrong. I will go home on my own".

I just want it to be a little different. Like I didn't go for it at the Haboob and the Basilik came out of left field. Like, lady, all I did was merc shit. I saved your dad-boss, got you a tank. I would like a quest where you take her to NC, relax, enjoy a small job, bond more.
That's not possible since her quest is likely a repurposed nomad origin questline, so no night city yet lol
 

Gargaune

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But as you said, they made bank, and since they were such a small studio they could have all comfortably retired from the industry, yet they decided to to stick to their guns. I'm not saying they didn't get lucky or that they didn't have help in hyping up their game, just that they could have taken the easy way out, but didn't.
I'm highly suspicious of this "Hello Games redemption" spin that's been making the rounds in the past year. The entire NMS project was one giant Chris Roberts .jpg made flesh, I don't see how you "redeem" that with some bugfixes and a trading interface or whatever, and drawing parallels with Cyberpunk reeks of NMS apologia. I'll restate my position that in CDPR's case, their main design fault was failing to recognise the aspects of their Witcher 3 formula which wouldn't translate well to their Cyberpunk concept, but that failed attempt to reinterpret a successful past design into "Witcher 3 with guns" does not belong in the same category as "you can do anything (as long as it's landing, mining and taking off)."

Just because CDPR has a higher overhead than the NMS devs is no excuse - unlike them this wasn't their first big game, yet they deliberately kept overpromising and hyping the game up right up until the day of release.
This is the bit I'm not willing to let go, and it's an academic point for me, since I steered right clear of the Purchase button long before its release - No Man's Sky wasn't Hello Games' "first big game" either, because it wasn't a "big" game to begin with it. They just told you it was - they told you in the press features and they told you in their price tag.

And this is what I view as HG's main failure (strictly in the critical sense), that they priced themselves in the AAA segment. In fact, I think I remember Murray replying to a pre-release query on pricing, arguing that they'd "worked on the game for 5 years", meaning as long as AAA studio so of course they should be charging AAA prices. Now, I'd already jettisoned any interest in the game once I'd seen the £40 tag at the bottom of a Eurogamer puff piece, but even a child will see the obvious fallacy in comparing a dozen people working for five years to a small army doing the same in that price bracket. So I can either believe that the people involved were so deluded they didn't understand the essential marketing value of a price sticker, or that they knew full well that they weren't selling that caliber of experience but decided to pitch it that way regardless.

None of this is applicable to Cyberpunk 2077. You'll see in this thread that I haven't shied away from criticising its numerous flaws in both design and execution, but the game's production scope is appropriate to its market segment. Much of the discussion is that if X had been better or if there had been more of Y, CBP could've been a solid AAA Action-Adventure RPG, and this is my biggest disappointment, that it's wasted potential. Not the case with No Man's Sky because there is no alternate universe, no permutation of features and engineering that would've justified its commercial classification - it was a $25 indie darling hyped up to a $60 milestone ripoff.

That's not "Reddit whining", that's literally stuff that CDPR promised was going to be in the game, but wasn't. Need I remind you of that whole intro video montage showing your PC doing all kinds of cool stuff that they used to purposely mislead people into thinking was actual things you could do in the game?

This isn't an issue of people building up a game in their heads that never existed, this was CDPR deliberately lying about the content available in the game and marketing it is a futuristic GTA V (at least in the sense of available side activities) and repeatedly hyping up Night City as a living and breathing city, and this when the game somehow still lags behind GTA III in the simulation aspect.
Actually, please, I could use a reminder but be mindful of dates. I remember various features being touted that subsequently got cut, but that's business as usual for videogames, the only unusual thing about Cyberpunk was the protracted development and marketing period, as a result of mismanagement. I know stuff like random ambushes, apartments, racing, were all advertised at some point, but I'm under the impression that the marketing materials close to release, like in the last year or months up to launch, were pretty accurate to the quantity of features available. Further, I think there's more than enough content in Cyberpunk, just that the quality of the experience suffers from bad design choices.

This point is vaguely reminding me of Bioshock - disgruntled System Shock fans were calling for Levine's head on a pike, but I'd merely followed the promotional materials up to release and the game turned out to be roughly what I expected.
 

cvv

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And regardless of resources, its gameplay issues go back to core design, there's nothing to "fix" anymore

Unfortunately this.

CP is like a house that looks sexy af when you enter but then you lean against the wall and you push a hole into it. You try to open a fridge and discover it's not a fridge but just a solid plastic block. You wanna use the loo but the doors are just painted on.

If you're a typical journo and just rush into the house, take a few pictures and fuck off you'll never realize it's not actually a real house. But if you actually play the game the illusion peels off p. quickly. It's a Potemkin village of a game. You can't fix an illusion, you can only make it more convincing.
 
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racofer

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