Might and Magic The Might and Magic Discussion Thread

[Darth Canoli]

I just reinstalled M&M 9 and i don't remember anything, i probably dropped it after character creation last time i tried to play it 10 years ago, does anyone knows a trick to stop the vertical movement in mouse mode?
That shit is as annoying than in Starcrawlers.

Character creation is good, portraits are worse than in any of the previous games, specially orcs, full 3D engine is somewhat paving the way for MMX but the new class system seems interesting, aside from thr druids getting the short end of the stick once more.
And the first enemies you encounter look like jumping turds.

I really want to play it but i'm not sure i'll be able to endure it.

 

[MajorMace]

Hello my fellow blobber enjoyers. There's something I'm missing with "Power" items. They're supposed to bestow my dudes some whopping +30Might, but nothing happens when I equip any of the two I got (Power Scarab and Power Belt).
What gives ?
ps : forgot to mention that i'm playing clouds of xeen.

 

[Darth Canoli]

Hello my fellow blobber enjoyers. There's something I'm missing with "Power" items. They're supposed to bestow my dudes some whopping +30Might, but nothing happens when I equip any of the two I got (Power Scarab and Power Belt).
What gives ?
ps : forgot to mention that i'm playing clouds of xeen.

List below is for Terra but i'm pretty sure the itemization didn't change much (if at all)
Source RPGclassics

Power none +10 Energy(damage) none +13 Energy Resistance
Power(2nd possibility) none none none +30 Might

 

[Ysaye]

Funny poll results.
2d gfx games: 14+23+52+160+5 = 254 votes
3d gfx games: 183+117+22+9+63 = 394 votes

After 15+ years of shitting on 3d graphics on every occasion and almost every 3d gfx game in existence codexers upvoted "3d abominations" by 50%
Pathetic retarded codexian edgelords can't even be consistent

But I reckon if you did a weighted average of everyone's Top 3 favourites, many of those that voted for MM6 would have MMXeen and MM3 close behind as favourites rather than more 3D favourites, which would put 2d gfx games ahead.

 

[octavius]

My top 3 faves would be 1, 2 and 6, with 4, 5 and 9 least faves.

 

[Darth Canoli]

But I reckon if you did a weighted average of everyone's Top 3 favourites, many of those that voted for MM6 would have MMXeen and MM3 close behind as favourites rather than more 3D favourites, which would put 2d gfx games ahead.

Maybe we should do just this.
And some people might have changed their votes but it's impossible.
I know i voted for VII but after replaying them all from 3 to 10, 7 is not even in the top 3.

1. Isles of Terra
2. World of Xeen
3. Mandate of Heaven

Day of the Destroyer in fourth position and M&M VII in fifth.
9 last, X second last, didn't significantly play 1 & 2.

 

[grimer]

ive only played 1 game from each era so far and id rank them in the order: 6>2>3. even though i think 6 has the worst combat in the entire series (worse than 3), the skill system and level design more than make up for it. it also has one of the best soundtracks among all the games ive played. withholding my vote until i play 7 which ive read is a much more polished 6 and world of xeen which i might enjoy (despite not really liking 3) purely bc of the space opera aesthetic like wizardry 7. as for 2 and 3:

ramblings on 2 vs 3

i think 3 is when the series declined and earned its reputation as a popamole blobber. almost every gameplay element in 2 was dumbed down in favor of graphical and audio improvements, most notably:

• dynamic front/rear flanks in combat based on the party's position (e.g. corridor, 2x2 room, open area) -> all characters in the front row
• random encounters selected from a different pool of enemies per area -> 3 types of enemies per area
• more enemies with unique abilities resulting in more challenging encounters
• more impactful crowd control spells (e.g. sleep/immobilize, feeblemind) also range limitations on spells like fireball and disrupt

underdeveloped features that couldve been expanded upon but were removed instead:

• class abilities: archers can use ranged weapons in melee range, thieves/ninjas can backstab/assassinate
• more challenging level design: dark zones (most of these were linear however), rest restrictions (only exists in 1 dungeon i think), disabled teleportation spells
• option to bribe or hide from enemies which ties into restricted saving at inns
• class specific quests: while most of these were just kill the best barbarian/knight/archer some of them were interesting like the cleric only quest where you are tasked with reuniting corak's soul with his body.

sry for the wall of text

 

[Alkarl]

My vote really hasn't changed:
1. Mandate of Heaven
The game I had the most moment to moment fun playing. Goofy portraits, ridiculous paperdolls, silly quests. Gameplay could still be challenging and engaging.
2. Might and Magic
I just adore these older games that toss you in head first. The interface is rough and takes some getting used to, and the plot doesn't really reveal itself right away. It's just your very naked party and a hostile world. Mapping in this game is very rewarding as is the exploration; and character progression in both levels and gear is very satisfying. Beats out the original Wizardry trilogy by a mile, imo.
3. Day of The Destroyer
I like 8, Idk what to say. I like the idea of the world, a place where all the more vile races live and built societies. I like the combat, the larger party after 6 & 7. I know the game can be a total cake walk if you know what you're doing, and it might be anyway regardless. It did remove full party creation, which really blows, but exploring new places to see who I could coerce or bribe into joining my band was a lot of fun anyway. Shit tier taste, I guess.

Then the rest. I never did play 9 or X, so with that in mind I'd probably list 2, 7, 3, then 4/5.
WoX, and, to a lesser extent, Isles, just made me feel like a fantasy lawn mower the way it presented its world and the strength of its encounters.

 

[Darth Canoli]

ive only played 1 game from each era so far and id rank them in the order: 6>2>3. even though i think 6 has the worst combat in the entire series (worse than 3), the skill system and level design more than make up for it. it also has one of the best soundtracks among all the games ive played. withholding my vote until i play 7 which ive read is a much more polished 6 and world of xeen which i might enjoy (despite not really liking 3) purely bc of the space opera aesthetic like wizardry 7. as for 2 and 3:

ramblings on 2 vs 3

i think 3 is when the series declined and earned its reputation as a popamole blobber. almost every gameplay element in 2 was dumbed down in favor of graphical and audio improvements, most notably:

• dynamic front/rear flanks in combat based on the party's position (e.g. corridor, 2x2 room, open area) -> all characters in the front row
• random encounters selected from a different pool of enemies per area -> 3 types of enemies per area
• more enemies with unique abilities resulting in more challenging encounters
• more impactful crowd control spells (e.g. sleep/immobilize, feeblemind) also range limitations on spells like fireball and disrupt

underdeveloped features that couldve been expanded upon but were removed instead:

• class abilities: archers can use ranged weapons in melee range, thieves/ninjas can backstab/assassinate
• more challenging level design: dark zones (most of these were linear however), rest restrictions (only exists in 1 dungeon i think), disabled teleportation spells
• option to bribe or hide from enemies which ties into restricted saving at inns
• class specific quests: while most of these were just kill the best barbarian/knight/archer some of them were interesting like the cleric only quest where you are tasked with reuniting corak's soul with his body.

Interesting point of view.

Nobody in its right mind would say any M&M game doesn't have room for improvement so of course, the ideal Might & Magic would feature deeper mechanism from earlier entries, SFX from VIII, graphics and exploration from III/V, skills and masteries from VI/VIII, dungeon design from best dungeons of the two trilogies (like the witch tower from IV, dungeon design from VIII is pretty good too but the dungeons are too small).
Lest not forget riddles from the early M&M.

And of course, a good class system, maybe the one from 9 is good enough if you buff the druids by giving them Dark Magic Mastery and the leveling artifacts from X.

 

[Ysaye]

But I reckon if you did a weighted average of everyone's Top 3 favourites, many of those that voted for MM6 would have MMXeen and MM3 close behind as favourites rather than more 3D favourites, which would put 2d gfx games ahead.

Maybe we should do just this.
And some people might have changed their votes but it's impossible.
I know i voted for VII but after replaying them all from 3 to 10, 7 is not even in the top 3.

1. Isles of Terra
2. World of Xeen
3. Mandate of Heaven

Day of the Destroyer in fourth position and M&M VII in fifth.
9 last, X second last, didn't significantly play 1 & 2.

Your top 3 are the same as mine...I have Mandate at one and that is what I voted for but it is only there by a whisker; it is hard to split that and Xeen and also Isle of Terra which are each better in other ways....they are all very good and all flawed in a way, but that is just the sign of progress.

 

[Dungeon Lord]

I just reinstalled M&M 9 and i don't remember anything, i probably dropped it after character creation last time i tried to play it 10 years ago, does anyone knows a trick to stop the vertical movement in mouse mode?
That shit is as annoying than in Starcrawlers.

Character creation is good, portraits are worse than in any of the previous games, specially orcs, full 3D engine is somewhat paving the way for MMX but the new class system seems interesting, aside from thr druids getting the short end of the stick once more.
And the first enemies you encounter look like jumping turds.

I really want to play it but i'm not sure i'll be able to endure it.

M&M IX is good. Of course not so great as 6-7-8.

Bigger problem is that I replayed Swords of Xeen after 20 years. I did not like it all now. I cannot remember to the first play through so it could not be a great experience.
I am getting tired of getting old fan-made games. I plays lots of mods because there is no new M&M or Wizardry.
I cannot stand the newer mind-numbing grind-fests called Wizardry japanese games.

 

[Desiderius]

IX is just (grossly) unfinished, not bad in any meaningful sense other than the post-VI RT vs TB problem.

 

[DaveO]

Swords of Xeen is one of my two game walkthru guides.

 

[Darth Canoli]

Dungeon Lord Desiderius and anyone who played M&M 9 recently
How did you manage the free vertical movement in mouse mode?

There's the option to use the keyboard only but it's a shame.

What i like from M&M 9 is the new classes, gladiator and assassin, if i launch it again, i'll probably go for gladiator/assassin/lich/cleric

A shame they rolled back to four party members, it was nice getting a fifth one in Day of the Destroyer.

 

[Baron Dupek]

Am I missing something in M&M 8? Got spear mastery for my frontliners, but Minotaur can't dual-wield anything? Then what was the point for the Master level?
edit - gave him 2h axe, his palm went from fist to open but still can't hold anything in his left hand.

 

[Darth Canoli]

Might & Magic IX

So, i completed the first island and travelled to the continent, here's my thoughts so far.

The Good

• The"first" Island (not the tutorial) is quite beautiful considering and i'm not joking.
• The new dialog trees system is interesting (i'm not sure they had the skills to really exploit it and develop a good quest design though)
• New classes (Assassin and Gladiator)
• How you can see in game your mastery limit on a given skill (if your character has a basic level in it)

The Bad

• Per+Int --> Magic...
• Loading time, not very long but earlier entries are way faster on modern computers.
• Worst intro(s) in the series
• After the jumping turds, the second enemies are micro skeletons... (luckily, they get back to giant dragonflies afterward and hopefully regular monsters)
• Goodbye dynamic maps
• 6,7 and 8 recognized AZERTY keyboards... 9 doesn't.
• Useless tutorial mini-island
  
• When you get to the continent, the outdoors get real real ugly on maximum graphic options.

This is bad but the worst has yet to come...

The Ugly

• Cities are a GIGANTIC waste of time (you can enter buildings, they're mostly empty, trainers are rooming helplessly in the streets), even Legacy is an improvement on that regard.
• Minimizing the window get you back to a black screen for some time before the games works again...

Now i see why Legacy is such a waste of programming hours, these fucking millennials just played 9 to get some ill-inspired vibes from the series they never played before...

 

[Piotrovitz]

Jump is broken on the GoG version. You need the GrayFace patch to fix it.

That's weird - I've played vanilla MM7 from GoG and cannot recall Jump being broken.

Unless you're talking about MM8 though, can't remember if it worked there as it should.

 

[DaveO]

You CANNOT clear the Wasp Nest in MM8 with the current GoG release. GrayFace is your only option.

 

[fantadomat]

You CANNOT clear the Wasp Nest in MM8 with the current GoG release. GrayFace is your only option.

Ahhh why? Also why would you want to clear it? It is a pointless dungeon that give useless money.

 

[Sinatar]

You CANNOT clear the Wasp Nest in MM8 with the current GoG release. GrayFace is your only option.

Ahhh why? Also why would you want to clear it? It is a pointless dungeon that give useless money.

Why would you want to play the game you bought? That's what you're asking?

 

[DaveO]

I'm probably pretty much done commenting in this thread or others. I'll continue providing support in the shadows, but it's time I moved on and let other voices speak.

 

[Desiderius]

Might & Magic IX

So, i completed the first island and travelled to the continent, here's my thoughts so far.

The Good

• The"first" Island (not the tutorial) is quite beautiful considering and i'm not joking.
• The new dialog trees system is interesting (i'm not sure they had the skills to really exploit it and develop a good quest design though)
• New classes (Assassin and Gladiator)
• How you can see in game your mastery limit on a given skill (if your character has a basic level in it)

The Bad

• Per+Int --> Magic...
• Loading time, not very long but earlier entries are way faster on modern computers.
• Worst intro(s) in the series
• After the jumping turds, the second enemies are micro skeletons... (luckily, they get back to giant dragonflies afterward and hopefully regular monsters)
• Goodbye dynamic maps
• 6,7 and 8 recognized AZERTY keyboards... 9 doesn't.
• Useless tutorial mini-island
  
• When you get to the continent, the outdoors get real real ugly on maximum graphic options.

This is bad but the worst has yet to come...

The Ugly

• Cities are a GIGANTIC waste of time (you can enter buildings, they're mostly empty, trainers are rooming helplessly in the streets), even Legacy is an improvement on that regard.
• Minimizing the window get you back to a black screen for some time before the games works again...

Now i see why Legacy is such a waste of programming hours, these fucking millennials just played 9 to get some ill-inspired vibes from the series they never played before...

On the other hand dungeons are pretty good I think, although some of the Relic locations are a little TOO hidden without spoilers. Also game plays much smoother if you hire the Pal. Maybe a little too much smoother.

I enjoyed the training economy and the sense of progress and the value of progressing. Getting the ship schedule helps smooth things out until you get Beacons or whatever.

 

[c u in da ballpit ashren]

Aha. Ultima, more like... bad! Aha

 

[lycanwarrior]

M&M 6 was easily the best one of the series for me, albeit I haven't had the chance to play the earlier ones. Haven't play 9 or 10 yet as well, thinking of getting from Ubisoft. I'd wish they would continue with this series, but that's likely a pipe dream at this point.

 

[DaveO]

I have decided to continue onward with the adventures known as video creation, commenting, and overall sharing my thoughts. Who would speak up for the older games that deserve to have a time and a spotlight? Not many here have gone down the path of posting videos of games from the 8 bit era like I have. This will continue.