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Unhealthy interest in sales figures

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
In the first month we sold 14,271 copies. In comparison AoD sold ~3,300 copies during the same period in Early Access, so we can consider it a very promising start. I never hype our games but if the players liked the first, fairly low-key chapter, they're going to love what comes next.
How much of this do you think can be explained away by Steam's increasing customer base rather than increased interest in the game itself? It has been what, 8 years since AoD was in early access?
If I have to guess, I'd say it's because it's our third game. People know what to expect and the confidence in us releasing the game and delivering what's promised is much higher. Better visuals don't hurt either.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
Do you do any marketing? If so, how?
We didn't really do anything since we worked on the visuals until the end (and thus couldn't do videos or anything of that sort). I emailed the mainstream media but they never responded, so not much we could do there either. We invited the YTers to take a look 3 days before the release and that was our entire marketing campaign.
 

HoboForEternity

sunset tequila
Patron
Joined
Mar 27, 2016
Messages
9,175
Location
Disco Elysium
Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
The game would have to sell 40% more just to break even (for us to get the same revenue we could get on our own). It sells 20% more, we're losing money. Thus it's one hell of a leap of faith and we aren't prepared to take this jump yet, so we'll continue with our ‘business model’ where revenues of the first game aren't a reward but the operating budget for the second game, and so on and so forth.

So the game only need around 20k copies to break even?
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
The game would have to sell 40% more just to break even (for us to get the same revenue we could get on our own). It sells 20% more, we're losing money. Thus it's one hell of a leap of faith and we aren't prepared to take this jump yet, so we'll continue with our ‘business model’ where revenues of the first game aren't a reward but the operating budget for the second game, and so on and so forth.

So the game only need around 20k copies to break even?
No, and breaking even isn't an issue here, since we aren't looking to make a return on investment here but to sell enough to pay for the next game (i.e. whatever we sell becomes the next game's budget).
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
Vault Dweller Have you considering redoing Age of Decadence in Unreal 4 and releasing a "Special Edition?" Would that be easy or a huge amount of work? Colony Ship looks so much better than Age of Decadence that I think it'd be worth it.
Yes. It won't be exactly easy but it would still be easier and faster than making another game from scratch. 3 years of work, most likely. 4 years if we add another chapter. Better than 6-7 years but still...

Do all publisher sound like mobsters?
It's a loan-sharking business, essentially, with fairly low risks, unless you do something stupid and invest a hundred mil into a flop. But signing up developers and getting 30% of revenues is a pretty good deal. The goal is to get you to sign (away your distribution rights as now the publisher gets all the revenues and pay you 70%), so whatever works. I've seen elaborate presentations hammering the same message - so many games are getting released on Steam every year, it's crazy!!! revenues are dropping, look at the median sales! look at them and despair!
 

JarlFrank

I like Thief THIS much
Patron
Joined
Jan 4, 2007
Messages
33,052
Location
KA.DINGIR.RA.KI
Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.

Rahdulan

Omnibus
Patron
Joined
Oct 26, 2012
Messages
5,105
Looking at some EA Steam reviews I wonder how many people are afraid to post negative ones because Vault Dweller will in the comments like a hawk to explain whatever issues they had.
 

Darkzone

Arcane
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
2,323
It looks amazing but I think it's too early. Maybe for the next game.
Ok... yes it is still in EA. So if you plan to release it in the next half a year it wouldn't be advised to switch the engine version.
I have already tested it and it is really a game changer:
Smoother and better level steaming (open world) with less memory requirement. Better looking nanites assets have reduced the package size due to no LOD, but they are not necessary in most cases the better solution. And Lumen does really lowers the need for Raytracing.
I still have to test the Full Body IK with the motion warping and also the Metasounds.
 

Zanzoken

Arcane
Joined
Dec 16, 2014
Messages
3,558
Vault Dweller, if I may ask... what % of sales do you guys actually receive after Steam fees, engine fees, taxes, etc have all been taken out?

I understand if you don't want to reveal too many specifics, but my guess is most indie devs probably end up with around 50% of revenue actually reaching their coffers. Is that in the ballpark?
 

Fenix

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Messages
6,458
Location
Russia atchoum!
If anything I would advise to plan next game for streaming services, OR at least next after next for sure.
But then probably whole internet infrastructure will be changed, so it all in smoke...
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
Vault Dweller, if I may ask... what % of sales do you guys actually receive after Steam fees, engine fees, taxes, etc have all been taken out?

I understand if you don't want to reveal too many specifics, but my guess is most indie devs probably end up with around 50% of revenue actually reaching their coffers. Is that in the ballpark?
There's no simple answer to this question as there are too many variable there. Take VAT, for example:

In the beginning nobody charged any tax on digital goods but now that everyone realized what a cash cow it is, not a month goes by without more countries demanding their cut. VAT makes sense when the state invests in infrastructure and services that support business growth, and when the business can get a tax credit for VAT paid, which balances it out. Without neither, it's nothing but a cash grab - a tax on the privilege to sell digital goods to Russian (20%), Swedish (25%), Italian (22%), or German (19%) gamers; 53 countries in total. In comparison, Canada doesn't charge tax on digital goods yet and the United States is 50/50 on the issue (only 28 states tax digital goods (1-7%), the rest don't), I don’t think they’ll be able to resist the temptation to put a hand in someone’s pocket for long. The tax is included in the price and thus comes out of the developer’s end, so when you buy games, 20% of what you pay goes back to your government (do your patriotic duty and buy more games to support your country!). So roughly half of what you sell is VAT-free, half isn't, but the VAT rate varies from 10 to 28%.

Engine fees also go from 0 to 5% which can be applied differently, in some cases to gross sales, even before Steam takes their cut, in others after. Corporate taxes also vary based on your setup (for example, employees vs contractors) and where the company is incorporated and whether or not it has a tax treaty with the US. If it doesn't, you have to file a US return, pay an accountant a few grand a year as the US tax code is a mess with many hidden pitfalls, and pay tax on the money paid by the US citizens. Fortunately, Canada has such a treaty which states that royalties and/or digital goods shall not be taxed, so we dodged a bullet there. The corporate taxes are low here - 11.5% (in the US it's 21% now, Biden wants to raise it to 28%), etc.
 

Zanzoken

Arcane
Joined
Dec 16, 2014
Messages
3,558
Thanks for the detailed response. From the sound of things I think my estimate was probably a bit high then.
 

Invictus

Arcane
The Real Fanboy
Joined
Nov 3, 2013
Messages
2,789
Location
Mexico
Divinity: Original Sin 2
All most of care about is that:
The EA sales did well
The game is looking good
The ensured success of ITS to make sure we get quality games from quality developers
Oh and sign me up for an updated Age of Decadence!
 

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