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Styg - Underrail

jdinatale

Cipher
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Messages
422
When you're playing Underrail, just remember that it’s not like other CRPG’s. The game is incredibly artistic, almost to the point where you have to be paying complete attention to it to even remotely understand it. I remember doing a quest in the Junk Yard (though I can't remember what it was), where I thought a character was absolute bollocks during the quest. Then, I closed my eyes for a second, and all of a sudden the plot had an entirely new meaning. It was insane the way Underrail could just become something so different when you take a look into the lore.

Another thing you should note about Underrail is that it's easy to get a headache playing the game. Not because it’s a bad game, but because of how many ideas it’s gameplay is riddled with and how complex they are. Soon enough your head will fill to the brim and the rest will just seem like noise to you. Just turn it off and give it a play the next day.

If you don't like the gameplay, you'll definitely at least enjoy reading through the lore, and picking apart the story itself and all of the artistic values that go into making it the complexity that it is.
 
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Trashos

Arcane
Joined
Dec 28, 2015
Messages
3,413
I have been playing UR for years, and there are some very basic systems that I have only looked into recently. You don't have to worry about all systems at once, pick the ones that immediately intrigue you and work with them. You can learn the rest later, with other builds. I always recommend that new players should start with simple builds (AR or SMG go brrrrrrr).

UR has been effectively in development for a looong time (actual development, not developmental hell), and it indeed plays like it. It shows in its narrative too, as it is correctly pointed out in the OP. What at first looks like a cheap trick to keep things going (and there is some of that, don't get me wrong), may actually be connected to everything else that is going on. UR has core narrative points (very little advertised) that everything seems to be attracted to, and with Expedition we also had the chance to see the philosophy that underlies it all.

UR is impressively deep in all aspects. Sometimes something in it makes me mad, but then I soon remember that I am lucky to be playing it.
 

bionicman

Liturgist
Joined
May 31, 2019
Messages
674
To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand UR. The mechanics are extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of theoretical physics most of the gameplay will go over a typical player's head. There's also the game's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into his characterization - Styg's personal philosophy draws heavily from the early Fallouts, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of this game, to realize that it's not just a game - it says something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike UnderRail truly ARE idiots - of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the setting, which itself is a cryptic reference to Harlan Ellison's epic A Boy and His Dog I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Styg's genius unfolds itself on their computer screens. What fools... how I pity them.

And yes by the way, I DO have an UR tattoo. And no, you cannot see it. It's for the ladies' eyes only - And even they have to demonstrate that they're within 5 IQ points of my own (preferably lower) beforehand.
 

jdinatale

Cipher
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Messages
422
Underrail is probably one of the most popular and important CRPG’s of the last 25 years. It has a ton of rabid, devoted fans, as well as quite a lot more casual players.

Expeditions is hailed by many Styg fans as his best game. It spawned at least one stand alone is expansion that still gets a fair amount of hype on rpg forums, to this day, 2 years after its announcement. To give such an epic and widely-celebrated game such a low score makes little sense, and to me indicates either:

1- Personal bias against Styg by reviewer

2- Personal bias against the style of CRPG by reviewer

3- Purposely trying to be controversial / edgy / trolling

4- Really poor taste and/or pretentious views on the part of the reviewer.

I could just about see it being any of these. If you don't like a particular CRPG, or (especially if ) you don't like a particular studio, you are not the right person to write the review, because your review will be biased from the start.

For example, I would not be the ideal candidate to review an game by Bethesda, or Obsidian. Not a fan of those studios, and/or their games, so anything I have to say will be tainted by that. Can I try to be objective and fair? Sure. But I'm not going to suddenly love and appreciate a game or studio I dislike, merely because I'm trying to. It's just not my thing.

I think a reviewer should have a love of the genre they're reviewing, and at least shouldn't have a personal bias against the studio.

In this case, it seems obvious that this guy has a bias against combat / exploration music, so hates those elements of Styg’s latter games. Reminds me of the typical teenage douchebag who loved Fallout 2 but hated everything that came after, because it wasn't "hardcore" enough for them.

This is the same idiot who gave the Black Isle Studio game "Planescape: Torment" (also hailed by fans as one of their best) a rating of 2 -- a whole tenth of a point higher than Fallout 2.

But he gave the Bethesda game "Morrowind" a solid 6.8.

New World Computing’s "Might & Magic VI" got an 8.9 from this Underrail douche. Let that sink in for a minute.

And I might have even been able to forgive some of this stuff, but he didn't even honestly attempt to review Underrail. He gave it a rating, and then wrote a long mocking faux-review by some fictional dumb teenage Styg fan. So he's not just trying to insult the game, he's trying to insult the fans, too.

Fuck this moron, and his shitty taste in CRPG’s.
 

LJ40

Cipher
Joined
Jul 16, 2014
Messages
612
Location
Wizardry/Ultima/Goldbox
For some reason I'm picturing jdinatale hitting his head on a sink like Doc Brown in Back to the Future, waking up and instead of inventing time travel just came to the realization that Underrail is fucking awesome.
 

Ghulgothas

Arcane
Joined
Feb 22, 2020
Messages
1,598
Location
So Below
When you're playing Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire, just remember that it’s not like other CRPG’s. The game is incredibly artistic, almost to the point where you have to be paying complete attention to it to even remotely understand it. I remember doing a quest in the Neketaka (though I can't remember what it was), where I thought a character was absolute bollocks during the quest. Then, I closed my eyes for a second, and all of a sudden the plot had an entirely new meaning. It was insane the way Deadfire could just become something so different when you take a look into the lore.

Another thing you should note about Deadfire is that it's easy to get a headache playing the game. Not because it’s a bad game, but because of how many ideas it’s gameplay is riddled with and how complex they are. Soon enough your head will fill to the brim and the rest will just seem like noise to you. Just turn it off and give it a play the next day.

If you don't like the gameplay, you'll definitely at least enjoy reading through the lore, and picking apart the story itself and all of the artistic values that go into making it the complexity that it is.

Sawyer’s games are Magical.

It took me a long time to get into and understand what all the admiration was about, but after I've finally broken into it...it's like his games are on an entirely different level. I started out on Deadfire base game, I played it once, didn't get much out of it. Then I played Beast of Winter, and Sawyer uses the god “Rymrgand" to perfect effect in the middle of the game, and it just haunted me. I played the base game again and it's like every time I played it, it eerily got better and better and became one of my favorite games in a very short period of time.

Next I played a rogue. Once again, didn't think much of it. Seemed like Deadfire base game was just experimental and overrated. Then played it again the next day... and it's like something unlocked in my mind overnight. The game was brilliant, amazing, and beautiful. It continued to get bigger and more incredible the more I played it. I've probably played over 50 characters since then.

Yesterday, I played a Fighter. Remember feeling disappointed that it was no rogue. Played again today, and it's brilliant, haunting, and marvelous. Sawyer does something I've never heard before; It's like he’s playing with the very properties of role playing to set up something you can't understand at first, then blow your mind with a gameplay idea that couldn't have been understood or expressed in just a few playthroughs. His games engage you on a spiritual level and shows you things you didn't know existed. If you don't like Deadfire, it's not because it’s "overrated" or not as good as you've heard, it's because you haven't been enlightened. The best way to listen to play is to accept that the game is excellent and you're in good hands role playing. If you try to judge it like you do most games, it will prevent you from understanding.
 
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jdinatale

Cipher
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Messages
422
For some reason I'm picturing jdinatale hitting his head on a sink like Doc Brown in Back to the Future, waking up and instead of inventing time travel just came to the realization that Underrail is fucking awesome.

Styg’s games are Magical.

It took me a long time to get into and understand what all the admiration was about, but after I've finally broken into it...it's like his games are on an entirely different level. I started out on Underrail base campaign, I played it once, didn't get much out of it. Then I played Expedition, and Styg uses the jet ski “Devastator" to perfect effect in the middle of the game, and it just haunted me. I played the base campaign again and it's like every time I played it, it eerily got better and better and became one of my favorite games in a very short period of time.

Next I played a psi build. Once again, didn't think much of it. Seemed like Underrail base campaign was just experimental and overrated. Then played it again the next day... and it's like something unlocked in my mind overnight. The game was brilliant, amazing, and beautiful. It continued to get bigger and more incredible the more I played it. I've probably played over 50 builds since then.

Yesterday, I played a crossbow build. Remember feeling disappointed that it was no psi build. Played again today, and it's brilliant, haunting, and marvelous. Styg does something I've never seen before; It's like he’s playing with the very properties of role playing to set up something you can't understand at first, then blow your mind with a gameplay idea that couldn't have been understood or expressed in just a few playthroughs. His games engage you on a spiritual level and shows you things you didn't know existed. If you don't like Underrail, it's not because it’s "overrated" or not as good as you've heard, it's because you haven't been enlightened. The best way to listen to play is to accept that the game is excellent and you're in good hands role playing. If you try to judge it like you do most games, it will prevent you from understanding.
 
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Whisper

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
4,357
There is very few bits of lore.

We never understand what godsmen/leviathans are.
What happened to earth/surface.
How psi appeared.
What is nature of Flottsomir?
What exactly Tanner wants?
Six wants?
What is Cube?
Why game is Timelapse Vertigo?
What exactly are visions from Monoliths?
Who is 3rd Godmen?


etc.

Only hints, many hints, but it is hard to figure game story even after 1000+ hours.
And this questions are after researching.

Player who finished game 1 or 2 times wont even get all monoliths, wont get Azif/Occulus, wont befriend Faceless,etc. So they will learn even less.
 
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