Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Whisper]

Interesting read.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder...ave_i_completely_screwed_myself_with_the_act/

 

[NJClaw]

Interesting read.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder...ave_i_completely_screwed_myself_with_the_act/

So to preface, I'm a long term RPG gamer but new to Pathfinder. Plus I've watched a full Let's Play of Kingmaker, so I was aware of most of the RPG aspects.

Not gatekeeping enough was a mistake.

 

[mediocrepoet]

So I need suggestions for a melee based Death Knight (Lich). I needs to be able to cast arcane spells so I can get to CL 25 and have even 1 round per level spells last 24h. But it will fight with weapons, I don't plan to take any caster based feats except maybe Extend spell.

Sword Saint makes an insanely powerful gish and with the Lich weapon abilities you get, your elemental barrage hits will be fucking nuts. Make sure you are Lawful, and use a Holy weapon (you won't get penalties), and just go to town.

Dip Oracle, Scaled Fist and Hellknight for massive CHA bonus cheese.

I don't want cheese, just a straight class/prestige class build. Game is already too easy. Originally I was planning Inquisitor as it fits better thematically but you cannot merge spellbooks.

Sword Saint is one weapon guy, I was thinking with Vampiric Blade I should go two weapons :D
Or maybe melee Skald, he can do Pounce?!

Seems Bloodrager could also fit this, did they fix Bloodrage abilities?

I guess it depends on what your idea and image is for the character.

I'd probably go for a hybrid that can wear armour for a death knight character. Since you aren't as concerned about the casting side except for buffs, I'd probably go for a straight magus. If you don't care about armour wearing, then Saint is also a good choice like Yosharian mentioned. You're not tied to one weapon with those, it's just that if you're dual wielding weapons you're foregoing spell combat, but you could swap between spell combat and dual wielding weapons depending on what you wanted to do at the time. You'd still be able to take full advantage of weapon enchanting.

Another idea is to take alchemist since their extracts don't trigger arcane casting failure and you could take additional armour feats or dip fighter for the proficiencies and additional feats to pick up some of your two weapon fighting feats.

I like those two classes in particular because they both have 6th level casting and both have transformation. Is transformation part of the skald spell list?

Bloodrager could be a good choice, but personally I'm not a fan of the class, as I generally hate rage mechanics and the round limitations, fatigue, etc.

 

[Haplo]

So I need suggestions for a melee based Death Knight (Lich). I needs to be able to cast arcane spells so I can get to CL 25 and have even 1 round per level spells last 24h. But it will fight with weapons, I don't plan to take any caster based feats except maybe Extend spell.

Sword Saint makes an insanely powerful gish and with the Lich weapon abilities you get, your elemental barrage hits will be fucking nuts. Make sure you are Lawful, and use a Holy weapon (you won't get penalties), and just go to town.

Dip Oracle, Scaled Fist and Hellknight for massive CHA bonus cheese.

If you can skip spellbook merge (and 24hr Haste ), I'd maybe try Arcane Rider instead. A Death Knight should have a mount. Mounted charge with Spirited Charge and Mythic Charge is ridiculous in this game. Lich has a power that buffs it even further, I believe. And Arcane Rider at level 14 can reposition every round as swift action to Charge again. Will still get sick damage from Elemental Barrage.
Of course then you very much want Pounce from somewhere.

Otherwise... Sylvan Sorcerer maybe. But multiclassing plus keeping the mount relevant will be tricky. So I guess pedestrian EK multiclass.

 

[Jaedar]

Interesting read.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder...ave_i_completely_screwed_myself_with_the_act/

So to preface, I'm a long term RPG gamer but new to Pathfinder. Plus I've watched a full Let's Play of Kingmaker, so I was aware of most of the RPG aspects.

Not gatekeeping enough was a mistake.

Some of the complaints are legit though. Warrior generals are the worst. The auto combat feature will frequently take losses that are mathematically impossible to get unless you just skip a bunch of turns. Gargoyles are horribly designed enemies.

 

[ga♥]

I mean 24 hour buffs are just a convenience, also you need to spend a mythic ability on them instead of something more useful.

 

[ArchAngel]

I mean 24 hour buffs are just a convenience, also you need to spend a mythic ability on them instead of something more useful.

Melee based mythic abilities are weak offensively if you are not Charging and charging is just one. There are good defensive abilities. But having 24h Haste, 24h Greater Invisibility/Displacement and other such spells gives way more. Also all 1 min per lvl buffs become 24h

 

[ga♥]

Melee based mythic abilities are weak offensively if you are not Charging and charging is just one. There are good defensive abilities. But having 24h Haste, 24h Greater Invisibility/Displacement and other such spells gives way more.

Doesn't have to be a melee specific ability. Magic nullification has definetely more value for example.

 

[Haplo]

I mean 24 hour buffs are just a convenience, also you need to spend a mythic ability on them instead of something more useful.

Melee based mythic abilities are weak offensively if you are not Charging and charging is just one. There are good defensive abilities. But having 24h Haste, 24h Greater Invisibility/Displacement and other such spells gives way more. Also all 1 min per lvl buffs become 24h

I'd like to respectfully disagree. Elemental Barrage is ridiculous - if you can take advantage of it (and maguses plus shamans excel at it... although frankly any class can use it with a certain kukuri... or the Geniekind silliness). At level 12 my Camelia does sick damage, 2nd only to the main char. And she doesn't even have Mythic/Improved critical for her rapier yet.
Leading Strikes can also be very good - but best in real time (when multiple characters deplete their iteratives at the same time - triggering Leading Strikes off each other). But can be good in Turn Based also - particularly when mounted with a multi-attack mount (even better if also has Pounce), as it will mix attacks with the rider - and keep triggering his Leading Strikes.

 

[Jaedar]

Melee based mythic abilities are weak offensively if you are not Charging and charging is just one. There are good defensive abilities. But having 24h Haste, 24h Greater Invisibility/Displacement and other such spells gives way more.

Doesn't have to be a melee specific ability. Magic nullification has definetely more value for example.

Strong disagree, assuming magic null works as it says and removes all magical effects. A melee character without buffs is dead weight, both offensively and especially defensively.

Melees don't really need offensive mythic abilities though (the mythic weapon spec etc are enough), they wreck everything within reach in one or two turns regardless.

Elemental Barrage is ridiculous - if you can take advantage of it (and maguses plus shamans excel at it... although frankly any class can use it with a certain kukuri).

Any caster with geniekind can abuse elemental barrage. Especially if you get it to be 24 hour.
But yeah, magus has the easiest time doing it, since they just get electricity/fire/ice damage for free as a class feature.

But can be good in Turn Based also - particularly when mounted with a multi-attack mount (even better if also has Pounce), as it will mix attacks with the rider - and keep triggering Leading Strikes.

Didn't know that. It seems pretty weak if you can only trigger it once per full action though.

I mean 24 hour buffs are just a convenience, also you need to spend a mythic ability on them instead of something more useful.

Melee based mythic abilities are weak offensively if you are not Charging and charging is just one. There are good defensive abilities. But having 24h Haste, 24h Greater Invisibility/Displacement and other such spells gives way more. Also all 1 min per lvl buffs become 24h

It's not bad at all, but lategame it feels like most enemies are prebuffed with true sight, which I think counters both invis and displacement?

 

[Haplo]

Yeah, as long as my Smilo can also reliably hit the enemy (gave him Shatter Defenses), he'll trigger Leading Strikes ~3 times per round. Of course, few enemies actually live that long. So maybe not awesome, but definitely not shabby either.

 

[ArchAngel]

So to merge spellbooks with lich I need to be a 9 spell lvl arcane caster?
That limits available builds by a lot.
Seems Sorc/EK/DD is only real option left.

 

[Cryomancer]

So to merge spellbooks with lich I need to be a 9 spell lvl arcane caster?

Yep. And witches count as arcane despite being a "in between" arcane X divine.

 

[Parabalus]

Elemental Barrage is ridiculous - if you can take advantage of it (and maguses plus shamans excel at it... although frankly any class can use it with a certain kukuri).

Any caster with geniekind can abuse elemental barrage. Especially if you get it to be 24 hour.
But yeah, magus has the easiest time doing it, since they just get electricity/fire/ice damage for free as a class feature.

Trickster can also do this, along with 2 extra enchantments from Knowledge: Arcana on the weapon.

 

[Jaedar]

So to merge spellbooks with lich I need to be a 9 spell lvl arcane caster?

Yep. And witches count as arcane despite being a "in between" arcane X divine.

I would not really recommend doing a witch main though. Hexes are awesome for support, not something you want your attackers spending turns on.

Seems Sorc/EK/DD is only real option left.

Wiz/EK/Loremaster is also an option. Loremaster is pretty nice in general, can get some good bonus feats. Of course nothing prevents a sorc from taking a loremaster level or two either.

 

[ga♥]

Strong disagree, assuming magic null works as it says and removes all magical effects. A melee character without buffs is dead weight, both offensively and especially defensively.

It makes you also immune to magic, which could be useful sometimes.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Not gatekeeping enough was a mistake.

I would have been interesting to analyze the "sentiment" of Pathfinder subreddit before and after the Fangberry cave nerf. Unfortunately, I am not a data scientist .

 

[ArchAngel]

Strong disagree, assuming magic null works as it says and removes all magical effects. A melee character without buffs is dead weight, both offensively and especially defensively.

It makes you also immune to magic, which could be useful sometimes.

And removes all your 24h buffs lol

 

[NJClaw]

This game can be pretty anticlimactic at times:

Spoiler

 

[Haplo]

Woah, that's impressive!
How did you achieve 323 damage mod?

 

[Jaedar]

This game can be pretty anticlimactic at times:

Spoiler

It's ridiculous just how op angel mythic is is.

 

[NJClaw]

Woah, that's impressive!
How did you achieve 323 damage mod?

Honestly... I don't know.

I had +30 from Strength, +30 from Mythic Power Attack, +5 from weapon enhancement, +1 from the book, +4 from Inspire Courage, and +19 from Smite Evil, so the final damage modifier with Mythic Vital Strike should have been 356. However, last time I checked, Mythic Vital Strike didn't work correctly with Smite Evil, so I'm kinda lost here.

EDIT: I checked out and Smite Evil still doesn't work with Mythic Vital Strike, so that +323 can only be the result of (76 * 4) + 19.

 

[ga♥]

Strong disagree, assuming magic null works as it says and removes all magical effects. A melee character without buffs is dead weight, both offensively and especially defensively.

It makes you also immune to magic, which could be useful sometimes.

And removes all your 24h buffs lol

And debuffs, like the pig slaver "dazzle" in the fleshmarket.
I guess the utility depends on the difficulty you play but the point is not about magic nullification, the point is that there are more useful things you will most likely sacrifice just to avoid "buffing".

 

[Haplo]

Woah, that's impressive!
How did you achieve 323 damage mod?

Honestly... I don't know.

I had +30 from Strength, +30 from Mythic Power Attack, +5 from weapon enhancement, +1 from the book, +4 from Inspire Courage, and +19 from Smite Evil, so the final damage modifier with Mythic Vital Strike should have been 356. However, last time I checked, Mythic Vital Strike didn't work correctly with Smite Evil, so I'm kinda lost here.

Looking at that screenshot, it appears to be 323 damage BEFORE Mythic Vital Strike x4 multiplier. Crazy....

 

[ArchAngel]

Strong disagree, assuming magic null works as it says and removes all magical effects. A melee character without buffs is dead weight, both offensively and especially defensively.

It makes you also immune to magic, which could be useful sometimes.

And removes all your 24h buffs lol

And debuffs, like the pig slaver "dazzle" in the fleshmarket.
I guess the utility depends on the difficulty you play but the point is not about magic nullification, the point is that there are more useful things you will most likely sacrifice just to avoid "buffing".

And to avoid resting often.