Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Rieser]

Is this worth playing? Is this game - codex rpg of 2021?

Yes.
Probably yes, though it shouldn't be.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Is this worth playing? Is this game - codex rpg of 2021?

1. No.
2. Yes, as it should be.

 

[Yosharian]

Boots of the Stampede seem to be fixed. They just don't identify the damage source properly.

Fixed ages ago

 

[Haplo]

Yo, they finally fixed the half pair amulet?

Yep, already a while ago (first for characters, but eventually also for mounts).

But the paired defensive ring All-round defense from the Battlebliss derakni siblings fight appears to do nothing
...unless it shows no effect and only shows up in "flanked" scenarios.

 

[ArchAngel]

Armor training is awesome, what are you smoking? Mithril Fullplates with armor training means best armor value with 0 loss of movement and 0 penalty to skills.

There are light and medium armors that are a lot more useful than le mithral full plate and have similar AC bonuses to boot. Heavy armor might be the worst in the game. Not to mention Archmage Armor, the dubious utility of high AC in more difficult encounters in general and the infinitely more useful crit resistance only mutation warrior gets.

Not for fighters. If you don't have archmage armor and don't cheese with monk levels +4 mithril full plate and armor training is the best. That is 13 base armor, same as archmage armor at mythic 9.

 

[ArchAngel]

Yea lets waste Mythic abilities for a small boost.

This is one of the dumber things I've seen in this thread and you had some stiff competition. Congratz!

So if +6 natural armour, +8 to one physical stat, +6 to a second physical stat, and +4 to the third physical stat, as a boost type that stacks with everything else in exchange for a -2 to the three mental stats is a small boost, what's an example of a big one?
Seems pretty busted when you compare that as an undispellable, permanent buff vs. what you get from armour training. (Hint: +4 max dex adjustment, -4 armour check penalty, +5 DR)

These buffs aren't even in the same league, what the hell are you on? The only reason to pick pure fighter is for RP reasons. It's not bad, but mutation warrior knocks it out of the park.

Ok I will accept that this bonus is nice but that is a high level boost and you are stuck with mithril breastplates or light armors. You will only have 1 or 2 overall armor more with mutagen and stat boosts are nice but cost -2 to 3 mental stats (less will saves and skill values) and a mythic ability.
It has its bonuses and penalties, for archers especially since they got so many good mythic abilities and mythic feats.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

As nice as mutation warrior is, the real issue with it is how the upgrades are spread over the leveling curve. That's the typical problem I have with theorycrafting powergamers that don't play the game much. "That class is lit yo (dabs), the fact that you get these bonuses about two chapters after you've already dropped the playthrough doesn't really matter".

 

[Alienman]

Just curious about length of game. So far I get the impression it is massive, bigger than Kingmaker. I'm in chapter 3, fairly early and I'm already 50-60 hours in

Are the remaining chapters as huge?

 

[Jaedar]

Just curious about length of game. So far I get the impression it is massive, bigger than Kingmaker. I'm in chapter 3, fairly early and I'm already 50-60 hours in

Are the remaining chapters as huge?

Chapter 3 is the biggest one, but both act 4 and 5 are larger than act 1 and 2. I got a bit more than 100 hours in my finished playthrough.

 

[Haplo]

As nice as mutation warrior is, the real issue with it is how the upgrades are spread over the leveling curve. That's the typical problem I have with theorycrafting powergamers that don't play the game much. "That class is lit yo (dabs), the fact that you get these bonuses about two chapters after you've already dropped the playthrough doesn't really matter".

I beg you pardon?
It gets bonus feats on level 1 and every even level - like the regular fighter. It gets Weapon Training at level 5 and upgrades every 4 levels - like the regular fighter.
The only thing its missing is the armor training. But gets Mutagen at level 3 and Medical Discoveries every 4 levels thereafter.
Not sure, but maybe you can even trade them for Combat Tricks to spam even MOAR feats then a regular fighter has.

Not that you'd want to. You get extras like Bite attack, Feral Wings, potentially up to 75% Fortification.
No, I don't think it looks good for the vanilla Fighter.

 

[Bigg Boss]

I just figured I would come into this thread to see what the debate on Paladins is.

 

[Haplo]

Yea lets waste Mythic abilities for a small boost.

This is one of the dumber things I've seen in this thread and you had some stiff competition. Congratz!

So if +6 natural armour, +8 to one physical stat, +6 to a second physical stat, and +4 to the third physical stat, as a boost type that stacks with everything else in exchange for a -2 to the three mental stats is a small boost, what's an example of a big one?
Seems pretty busted when you compare that as an undispellable, permanent buff vs. what you get from armour training. (Hint: +4 max dex adjustment, -4 armour check penalty, +5 DR)

These buffs aren't even in the same league, what the hell are you on? The only reason to pick pure fighter is for RP reasons. It's not bad, but mutation warrior knocks it out of the park.

Ok I will accept that this bonus is nice but that is a high level boost and you are stuck with mithril breastplates or light armors. You will only have 1 or 2 overall armor more with mutagen and stat boosts are nice but cost -2 to 3 mental stats (less will saves and skill values) and a mythic ability.
It has its bonuses and penalties, for archers especially since they got so many good mythic abilities and mythic feats.

At level 20 you also have like +4 AB, +4-7 damage and +7 CMB and CMD over that vanilla Fighter. Also higher HP total. And potentially Heavy Fortification and/or Bite attack & Feral Wings.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

As nice as mutation warrior is, the real issue with it is how the upgrades are spread over the leveling curve. That's the typical problem I have with theorycrafting powergamers that don't play the game much. "That class is lit yo (dabs), the fact that you get these bonuses about two chapters after you've already dropped the playthrough doesn't really matter".

I beg you pardon?
It gets bonus feats on level 1 and every even level - like the regular fighter. It gets Weapon Training at level 5 and upgrades every 4 levels - like the regular fighter.
The only thing its missing is the armor training. But gets Mutagen at level 3 and Medical Discoveries every 4 levels thereafter.
Not sure, but maybe you can even trade them for Combat Tricks to spam even MOAR feats then a regular fighter has.

Not that you'd want to. You get extras like Bite attack, Feral Wings, potentially up to 75% Fortification.
No, I don't think it looks good for the vanilla Fighter.

Not sure if my post was somehow unclear, but it is definitely a very good subclass and an upgrade on vanilla by quite a distance. What I meant is that it became sort of like a new vivi and a lot of people seem to treat it like those stat and na bonuses jump at you right out of the gate, when the better mutagnes are quite far down the line, which is definitely a factor to consider, same as with a lot of other popular things (like going naked etc).

 

[Daidre]

As nice as mutation warrior is, the real issue with it is how the upgrades are spread over the leveling curve. That's the typical problem I have with theorycrafting powergamers that don't play the game much. "That class is lit yo (dabs), the fact that you get these bonuses about two chapters after you've already dropped the playthrough doesn't really matter".

Mutation Warrior is a good 5 level dip for some martials for the 3 extra feats, Mutagen and Weapon Training that could be boosted to +3 with gloves.
I would rather call whole Archmage Armor thing a theorycrafting trap because:
1) it is only +5 - 9 until the late Chapter 4 due to Mythic Level progression over main story.
2) First 4 Mythic Feats tend to be extremely important for 99% of builds in the game, so wasting them on 1-4 extra Ac is awful.
3) Game is extremely stingy (after Kingmaker) with Physical/Mental Perfection items and +Some Stat items that is not in Belt/Helm slots in general. I have never seen +6 and +8 Belt of Physical Perfection in the game and + 6 Mental Stats tiara's appear only in Chapter 5. There is also amazing helmet that competes for the head slot:

Spoiler

So it not that sunny for all those MAD builds who are STR-based melees but want to go for high unarmored AC with high DEX/CHA.

Well, at least if you are not filthy bug abuser who can't leave home without Glory domain or three stacks of different Mutagens.

 

[Haplo]

I usually combo it with Sohei for extra attacks on Trained Weapons. The Mutagen is a nice extra on top of the fighter bonus feats. Only +4 to a primary stat and +2 AC, but still neat.
Not sure if 5 levels still qualify as a "dip", but I consider them very worthwhile.

 

[ArchAngel]

I usually combo it with Sohei for extra attacks on Trained Weapons. The Mutagen is a nice extra on top of the fighter bonus feats. Only +4 to a primary stat and +2 AC, but still neat.
Not sure if 5 levels still qualify as a "dip", but I consider them very worthwhile.

Ok, so it is a good munchkin class to combine with Monks. Noted. I also agreed about that. But not everyone wants to play a Lawful character or cares for maximum numbers. This is why pure fighter is cool and armor training is nice for most of the game. I really don't care what lvl 20 or even lvl 19 or 18 gives. This game is finished by end of Act 4, Act 5 is just mopping up.

 

[Daidre]

Ok, so it is a good munchkin class to combine with Monks. Noted. I also agreed about that. But not everyone wants to play a Lawful character or cares for maximum numbers. This is why pure fighter is cool and armor training is nice for most of the game. I really don't care what lvl 20 or even lvl 19 or 18 gives. This game is finished by end of Act 4, Act 5 is just mopping up.

For me, the most of the use from this archetype came from 3 level dip Mutagen Warrior on Greybor to fix his god-damn-awful build and make him tiny bit more useful with archery feats for dual-wielding throwing axes.

Similar thing could be done with Woljif with only difference that he actually makes a damn good dual-wielding thrower. But I still achieved best results by reclassing him into Dragonheir Scion for extra proc of Elemental Barrage from Acid Arcane Strike and Frost Axe early:

Spoiler

But he got 24h long Angel buffs in this run and anybody is a monster under them.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Similar thing could be done with Woljif with only difference that he actually makes a damn good dual-wielding thrower. But I still achieved best results for him by reclassing him into Dragonheir Scion for extra proc of Elemental Barrage from Acid Arcane Strike:

Interesting build, why did you pick the Slayer levels though?

 

[Daidre]

Interesting build, why did you pick the Slayer levels though?

I really wanted Slippery Mind at some point in early Chapter 4 to fix his lackluster Will saves. It was closest way to it without BAB loss and I've got Studied Target + 1 on top.

 

[ArchAngel]

Interesting build, why did you pick the Slayer levels though?

I really wanted Slippery Mind at some point in early Chapter 4 to fix his lackluster Will saves. It was closest way to it without BAB loss and I've got Studied Target + 1 on top.

Slippery Mind is really powerful on Wolfjit, not so on Greybor, especially if you cast Legendary spell on him.

 

[razvedchiki]

whats the best background for a mutation warrior (using greataxe)?

 

[Humbaba]

Is this worth playing? Is this game - codex rpg of 2021?

Yes

Not for fighters. If you don't have archmage armor and don't cheese with monk levels +4 mithril full plate and armor training is the best. That is 13 base armor, same as archmage armor at mythic 9.

"If you ignore all the things that are better than full plate, then full plate is the best"

 

[Daidre]

whats the best background for a mutation warrior (using greataxe)?

I would have taken something that turns Use Magic Item into class skill, for Scrolls and Mirror image wands. But it is useless with dumped CHA. Or Pickpocket, for +2 Initiative.

 

[Humbaba]

whats the best background for a mutation warrior (using greataxe)?

Lumberjack I guess.

 

[Humbaba]

Just curious about length of game. So far I get the impression it is massive, bigger than Kingmaker. I'm in chapter 3, fairly early and I'm already 50-60 hours in

Are the remaining chapters as huge?

CH3 is by far the biggest but a playthrough is about 100+ hours. Granted, crusade mode pads a lot of that time.

I just figured I would come into this thread to see what the debate on Paladins is.

Good, because Radiance is in the game but also bad because there already is a paladin companion.