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From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

NJClaw

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Does upgrading shields decrease the stamina cost for blocking beyond the shield's basic value?
Yes. For example, the Fingerprint Stone Shield (which is love and which is life) goes from 81 boost to 90 at +25.

Imagine upgrading a non-weapon to +25 in the game's upgrade mat economy :D
I have multiple ancient dragon smithing stones sitting in my inventory doing nothing, and going from 99 boost to 100 guarantees I will never lose stamina. 99 is functionally identical because that 1% is just chip damage, but I still need to cater to my autistic needs.

Greatshields are the real easy mode, I love it
This has always been the case. People LOVE to say that shields aren't viable in DS3, but this only shows they never used a good greatshield. With a top-tier greatshield, you can tank ANY combo in the game. You can tank Midir, you can tank Gael, you can tank the Soul of Cinder, and you can tank Friede. People equip a random unupgraded shitty medium shield and expect it to protect them from the apocalypse.
 

ElectricOtter

Guest
planescape - lol so gay

vtmb - ur a faget

majoras mask - havent played so just gonna say zzzzzeeelda

dmc3 - cry moar lol

no1 mentioned them but ya those games r pretty shit to

not as shit as bloodborne tho :3

incelcraft 'horror' fans = cringe take galore
 

Curratum

Guest
Not to mention that what Memezaki does is not quite the same thing. The theories that the fan base come up with are not anything definitive or clear but the stories that Memehackzaky read did have a beginning and an ending. He only needed someone to translate the stuff he didn't get and he would have understood the whole story.

well ER does have beginning and ending "go forth tarnished become elden lord" > "good job you are eldenlord now!". It just happens that the 100? hours in between raiding samey caves isnt really supported with story and structure which would probably help keeping players engaged.

That's exactly it. There is nothing to move things forward in ANY way throughout the game. I knew nothing about everything in the end, just like I did when I entered Limgrave.
 

Brickfrog

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mods have to label an account to give it the "dumbfuck" tag, right?

Why do people continue posting here even after everything they write has been labelled as moronic by the operators of the forum?

It's a weird kind of shamelessness, the urge to post is so strong they can't help themselves I guess?
 
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Zizka

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The initial 40 or 50 hours gave me a feeling of awe and discovery and amazement that none of the mentioned games had.

I think that’s the general consensus regarding the beginning. Elden Ring is so similar to previous From titles that I think it deserves a very similar score more or less. It’s essentially Dark Souls 4 with jumping button and a more open world.

Like previously mentioned by someone else, I hope From starts investing in other innovative projects. They have a team of talented people, they could craft an entirely new experience. Much like the transition from King’s Field to Demon Souls/Dark Souls. The demand for a Dark Souls 5 or Elden Ring 2 or another new title which is the same thing with a new minor mechanic and even bigger open world. The market demands for open world/action rpgs/dark souls like at the moment unfortunately so their hands might be tied for the near future.
 
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Sadly I don't see From making anything other than more Souls clones as they've been continuously rewarded for doing so for the past decade, and now have sold 10 million copies of Elden Ring on PC alone. They're just going to churn out Souls games like Ubisoft churns out Assassin's Creed and Activision churns out Call of Duty.
 
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Zizka

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This is from Miyazaki himself:
Hidetaka Miyazaki says he’s ready to close the book on Dark Souls. In an industry where it’s commonplace to stretch the popularity of franchises across annual iterations, that may be hard to believe, but he thinks it’s critical to the future of his studio, From Software.
Source:
https://www.gamespot.com/articles/dark-souls-3-interview-it-wouldnt-be-right-to-cont/1100-6432425/

Which is why I expected Elden Ring to be a completely new franchise and not more of the same… What happened I wonder.

Another quote:
I don't think it'd be the right choice to continue indefinitely creating Souls and Bloodborne games. I'm considering Dark Souls 3 to be the big closure on the series. That's not just limited to me, but From Software and myself together want to aggressively make new things in the future. Dark Souls 3 will mark the last game where the development project began before I became president.

Aggressively? New things? Maybe his reply was mistranslated from Japanese.
 

Curratum

Guest
Good grief, Malenia is such complete and utter bullshit. This at the very least as bad as Radahn, probably worse design.

I am level 135 I think, I have TWO max-upgraded katanas and a lvl 10 mimic with the same and we're both doing chip damage to her, then she does a flurry and heals the last 30 or so seconds worth of damage, then the second phase divebomb just kills the mimic first, then me.

There's still achievements for two dragon bosses but honestly I can't be bothered with this anymore, not right now.
 

HeatEXTEND

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This has always been the case. People LOVE to say that shields aren't viable in DS3, but this only shows they never used a good greatshield. With a top-tier greatshield, you can tank ANY combo in the game.
Yup 100 hours in to the game and I have finally accessed ez mode, actually being able to block shit properly and not having to strip down my sword/board dude for every serious bossfight. Feels guud man :hero:
 

Tacgnol

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Grab the Codex by the pussy RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
Good grief, Malenia is such complete and utter bullshit. This at the very least as bad as Radahn, probably worse design.

I am level 135 I think, I have TWO max-upgraded katanas and a lvl 10 mimic with the same and we're both doing chip damage to her, then she does a flurry and heals the last 30 or so seconds worth of damage, then the second phase divebomb just kills the mimic first, then me.

There's still achievements for two dragon bosses but honestly I can't be bothered with this anymore, not right now.

What was your damage output on katanas? My gargoyle greatsword was near 800 iirc and was poise breaking her with every attack.
 

Matador

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It's sad really, but the more I think about it the more I see Miyazaki really wants to make his own version of Devil May Cry or Ninja Gaiden. Expecting him to somehow go back to Souls roots and refine/improve from there is crazy. This bird already flew (or whatever the saying is).

The difference is in NG and DMC Ryu, Dante and Nero are playing by the same rules than the enemies. In Elden Ring are playing a different game than them.

In NGB the difficulty came from tight and nasty encounter design. Ryu is very strong from the start and has everything he needs to cope with all the bullshit thown at him in his basic moveset, with the dragon sword and shurykens. Just need to purchase counter attacks and level 2 DS for Izuna Drop to beat Master Ninja. You can optimize to some specific situations with other movements and weapons, and use Ninpo for easen some encounters, to have fun with a wider repertoire. But basically you only need to improve your instincts, tactical positioning, movement and target selection, use of enviroment (wall jump attacks) and a bit of reflexes to succeed even on Master Ninja. In fact is a more tactical game than mechanical skill one.

Sekiro is similar to NGB in this sense. That's the reason I like Sekiro so much, it has a perfectly tuned combat. Almost every boss is a pleasure to fight even they are very hard, their attack spam is countered efectively with precise timing parrying to break their posture. Of course if you try to play it like a souls game you are for a bad time. You can dislike Sekiro because you want From making ARPGs, and dislike action games, fair enough. But if you say the game is bad, you are wrong, that´s it.

NG2 Mentor MN starts very well, maybe a bit too much projectile spam, but you are ultra powerful with lots of very satisfying i-frames from OTs and Guillotine throws, so I only complain on this because you can use only a limited set of movements, I don´t agree with the sentiment that is artificial difficulty, just constraining one. I dislike later chapters where the encounter design gets very lazy and boring just throwing lots of high HP enemies without rime or reason. Chapter 11 (return to Hayabusa vilage) is one of the best levels in action gaming, though. Probably the most intense and visceral level ever, and a must to experiment for any action aficionado. Ninjas are a pleasure to fight because they don´t have so much HP, so the vast hordes can be dispatched in efficient and fun ways.

In DMC series you have tons of i-frames and 1000 tools and tricks, so they can throw you whatever and you will get S Rank if you are skilled. It's not as tight design as NGB but it works, and the boss fights are indeed carefully and tightfuly crafted. Just remember satisfying fights like Nero in DMC3, Angelo Credo in DMC4 and a good pack in DMC5.

Elden Ring has enemies that don't belong there, and even then, the retardation of the delayed attacks and extended combos I would argue don't belong anywhere.

PD: I would add Metal Gear Rising to carefully tuned action systems and bosses.
 
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Curratum

Guest
Good grief, Malenia is such complete and utter bullshit. This at the very least as bad as Radahn, probably worse design.

I am level 135 I think, I have TWO max-upgraded katanas and a lvl 10 mimic with the same and we're both doing chip damage to her, then she does a flurry and heals the last 30 or so seconds worth of damage, then the second phase divebomb just kills the mimic first, then me.

There's still achievements for two dragon bosses but honestly I can't be bothered with this anymore, not right now.

What was your damage output on katanas? My gargoyle greatsword was near 800 iirc and was poise breaking her with every attack.

What I see in the stat screen always differs significantly from what I see on boss healthbars. One kataka is just over 500, the other is something like 550, but when I hit the boss, I see something like 300-400 in damage on the health bar, and I swing with both weapons. No idea wtf.
 

Tacgnol

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Grab the Codex by the pussy RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
Good grief, Malenia is such complete and utter bullshit. This at the very least as bad as Radahn, probably worse design.

I am level 135 I think, I have TWO max-upgraded katanas and a lvl 10 mimic with the same and we're both doing chip damage to her, then she does a flurry and heals the last 30 or so seconds worth of damage, then the second phase divebomb just kills the mimic first, then me.

There's still achievements for two dragon bosses but honestly I can't be bothered with this anymore, not right now.

What was your damage output on katanas? My gargoyle greatsword was near 800 iirc and was poise breaking her with every attack.

What I see in the stat screen always differs significantly from what I see on boss healthbars. One kataka is just over 500, the other is something like 550, but when I hit the boss, I see something like 300-400 in damage on the health bar, and I swing with both weapons. No idea wtf.

Bosses have armour and damage reduction much as the player.

Your damage output sounds quite low though. You should definitely have at least A scaling on one stat by that point if you're using a max upgraded weapon. A keen katana gets A dex scaling at around +20 iirc.
 
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Zizka

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money, souls sells

I’d like to know what happened for him to say he wanted to wrap up Dark Souls series and then produced Elden Ring/Dark Souls 4. He was either lying during the interview (November 20, 2015) or his idea for a brand new game was discouraged as being too risky. He was appointed president in 2014 so one would think he had a lot of creative input as to how Elden Ring would turn out…

Maybe he said it’d be aggressively different to build up hype for marketing reasons as saying “It’s essentially Dark Souls 4” wouldn’t have the same impact.

Work began on the game in early 2017 following the release of The Ringed City, a piece of downloadable content for Dark Souls III, and was developed alongside Sekiro.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elden_Ring

The interview took place at the very end of 2015, essentially 2016. He had to have some sort of idea of what Elden Ring would be about by then…
 

Gruncheon

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Apr 30, 2015
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It's sad really, but the more I think about it the more I see Miyazaki really wants to make his own version of Devil May Cry or Ninja Gaiden. Expecting him to somehow go back to Souls roots and refine/improve from there is crazy. This bird already flew (or whatever the saying is).

The difference is in NG and DMC Ryu, Dante and Nero are playing by the same rules than the enemies. In Elden Ring are playing a different game than them.

In NGB the difficulty came from tight and nasty encounter design. Ryu is very strong from the start and has everything he needs to cope with all the bullshit thown at him in his basic moveset, with the dragon sword and shurykens. Just need to purchase counter attacks and level 2 DS for Izuna Drop to beat Master Ninja. You can optimize to some specific situations with other movements and weapons, and use Ninpo for easen some encounters, to have fun with a wider repertoire. But basically you only need to improve your instincts, tactical positioning, movement and target selection, use of enviroment (wall jump attacks) and a bit of reflexes to succeed even on Master Ninja. In fact is a more tactical game than mechanical skill one.

Sekiro is similar to NGB in this sense. That's the reason I like Sekiro so much, it has a perfectly tuned combat. Almost every boss is a pleasure to fight even they are very hard, their attack spam is countered efectively with precise timing parrying to break their posture. Of course if you try to play it like a souls game you are for a bad time. You can dislike Sekiro because you want From making ARPGs, and dislike action games, fair enough. But if you say the game is bad, you are wrong, that´s it.

NG2 Mentor MN starts very well, maybe a bit too much projectile spam, but you are ultra powerful with lots of very satisfying i-frames from OTs and Guillotine throws, so I only complain on this because you can use only a limited set of movements, I don´t agree with the sentiment that is artificial difficulty, just constraining one. I dislike later chapters where the encounter design gets very lazy and boring just throwing lots of high HP enemies without rime or reason. Chapter 11 (return to Hayabusa vilage) is one of the best levels in action gaming, though. Probably the most intense and visceral level ever, and a must to experiment for any action aficionado. Ninjas are a pleasure to fight because they don´t have so much HP, so the vast hordes can be dispatched in efficient and fun ways.

In DMC series you have tons of i-frames and 1000 tools and tricks, so they can throw you whatever and you will get S Rank if you are skilled. It's not as tight design as NGB but it works, and the boss fights are indeed carefully and tightfuly crafted. Just remember satisfying fights like Nero in DMC3, Angelo Credo in DMC4 and a good pack in DMC5.

Elden Ring has enemies that don't belong there, and even them, the retardation of the delayed attacks and extended combos I would argue don't belong anywhere.

PD: I would add Metal Gear Rising to carefully tuned action systems and bosses.

Great poast. Even as a huge fan of action games, I've only played a little bit of Ninja Gaiden. What's the best way to get into the series now?

I loved Sekiro for that reason as well - it's clear they started with the idea of making a more aggressive, clash of swords type game and built everything around that concept. I can see why fans of the older Demon Souls and Dark Souls style of gameplay would resent it (and Bloodborne) as well. I basically agree with the criticism that leaning into the combat (at the expense of adventuring) in these games is the wrong direction, but Bloodborne and Sekiro are so good it's hard to really dislike them for it, even if they represent a somewhat bad trend for From in general.
 

hackncrazy

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Jun 9, 2015
Messages
415
It's sad really, but the more I think about it the more I see Miyazaki really wants to make his own version of Devil May Cry or Ninja Gaiden. Expecting him to somehow go back to Souls roots and refine/improve from there is crazy. This bird already flew (or whatever the saying is).

The difference is in NG and DMC Ryu, Dante and Nero are playing by the same rules than the enemies. In Elden Ring are playing a different game than them.

In NGB the difficulty came from tight and nasty encounter design. Ryu is very strong from the start and has everything he needs to cope with all the bullshit thown at him in his basic moveset, with the dragon sword and shurykens. Just need to purchase counter attacks and level 2 DS for Izuna Drop to beat Master Ninja. You can optimize to some specific situations with other movements and weapons, and use Ninpo for easen some encounters, to have fun with a wider repertoire. But basically you only need to improve your instincts, tactical positioning, movement and target selection, use of enviroment (wall jump attacks) and a bit of reflexes to succeed even on Master Ninja. In fact is a more tactical game than mechanical skill one.

Sekiro is similar to NGB in this sense. That's the reason I like Sekiro so much, it has a perfectly tuned combat. Almost every boss is a pleasure to fight even they are very hard, their attack spam is countered efectively with precise timing parrying to break their posture. Of course if you try to play it like a souls game you are for a bad time. You can dislike Sekiro because you want From making ARPGs, and dislike action games, fair enough. But if you say the game is bad, you are wrong, that´s it.

NG2 Mentor MN starts very well, maybe a bit too much projectile spam, but you are ultra powerful with lots of very satisfying i-frames from OTs and Guillotine throws, so I only complain on this because you can use only a limited set of movements, I don´t agree with the sentiment that is artificial difficulty, just constraining one. I dislike later chapters where the encounter design gets very lazy and boring just throwing lots of high HP enemies without rime or reason. Chapter 11 (return to Hayabusa vilage) is one of the best levels in action gaming, though. Probably the most intense and visceral level ever, and a must to experiment for any action aficionado. Ninjas are a pleasure to fight because they don´t have so much HP, so the vast hordes can be dispatched in efficient and fun ways.

In DMC series you have tons of i-frames and 1000 tools and tricks, so they can throw you whatever and you will get S Rank if you are skilled. It's not as tight design as NGB but it works, and the boss fights are indeed carefully and tightfuly crafted. Just remember satisfying fights like Nero in DMC3, Angelo Credo in DMC4 and a good pack in DMC5.

Elden Ring has enemies that don't belong there, and even them, the retardation of the delayed attacks and extended combos I would argue don't belong anywhere.

PD: I would add Metal Gear Rising to carefully tuned action systems and bosses.

I agree with pretty much everything. Which is why I said that a Bloodborne moveset would do wonders for ER.

The only thing I disagree is about bosses delaying attacks. I really, really like this, and bosses that uses this a lot (Margit, Godfrey, Radagon) have an extra layer of challenge because just spamming roll when they bring up their arms is not enough, you really have to adapt.

Different from Malenia that has speed of light fucking combos that on top of all that heals her. That's a fight I have absolutely no desire in play ever again.
 

hackncrazy

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Also, let me play Devil's Advocate in terms of FS method of storytelling and such: I'm not a storyfag at all. In fact, I pretty much dislike every single attempt of storytelling in games, because in 95% the way of telling a story is placing a NPC with a bible worth of dialogue or something similar.

From Software games have a big difference for me because the story is not invasive at all. I can finish every single one of their games without reading one single line of lore and without having pretty much any forced NPC interactions. For a non storyfag like me, this is marvelous. For me, videogames are a very interactive media, so storytelling in this games should be as dynamic as possible, mainly without using classic methods you'd see in a book.

Take games like Shadow of the Colossus or Outer Wilds. Even though the latter has quite a good amount of written lore, you can create a lot of theories and question just by the way of level design. Things like discovering on why a space station is so close to the sun, why there are two planets that act like an hourglass and so on. In the case of Shadow of the Colossus, you can look at small details at the scenario and wonder how things got there and so on. In Elden Ring, and other FS games in general, there's a lot of these small details, like the fact that there are like 300000 birdcages at Raya Lucaria made me wonder how they got there and for me it's more fun to try to theorize this in my mind than having an NPC at the end of the hall clarifying everthing.

But at the end, I know I'm in the vast minority here. I love being puzzled by stories, which is why I love films from directors like David Lynch, Alejandro Jodorowsky, Shinya Tsukamoto and other similar ones. For me, creating a lot of questions and theorizing about them brings more satisfaction then just receiving the answers.
 

Matador

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The difference is in NG and DMC Ryu, Dante and Nero are playing by the same rules than the enemies. In Elden Ring are playing a different game than them.
Wut, you are a godlike powerhouse compared to most enemies in those games.

True, but the encounters were tuned around your mobility, power and tools.

I prefer beating encounters executing proper movement and attacks, than spawning a Mimic summon or spamming a broken art.

For spergs: (I know there is broken stuff in NGB)
 
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