Underrail: The Incline Awakens

[Parabalus]

Bros, quick question: I took a glance at the wiki and saw some items being marked with, "This [item] is not meant to and cannot be worn in a normal playthrough." Does this mean the item in question

(1). Can't be retrieved and equipped through normal means (and has to be through cheat engine/console command or similar ways) or
(2). Can't be retrieved when playing on a Normal-difficulty playthrough?

Because if it's the (2), I think I finally have really good reason graduate from Normal difficulty, and start a proper Hard playthrough.

First.

Don't think there are any major additions on Hard, DOMINATING adds some new areas.

 

[Tygrende]

Bros, quick question: I took a glance at the wiki and saw some items being marked with, "This [item] is not meant to and cannot be worn in a normal playthrough." Does this mean the item in question

(1). Can't be retrieved and equipped through normal means (and has to be through cheat engine/console command or similar ways) or
(2). Can't be retrieved when playing on a Normal-difficulty playthrough?

Because if it's the (2), I think I finally have really good reason graduate from Normal difficulty, and start a proper Hard playthrough.

Those are either cut content or items found in the mutant-only questline. That or false/outdated info, there's a bit of that on the wiki too.

 

[Blaine]

Tygrende

Some of them are equipment that's worn by unique/named enemies, like the modified robe that allows Stygian what's-his-name to spam Bilocation in the Arena.

Do not try to understand the rules—that's impossible. The enemies don't follow the rules. Instead, only try to realize that you must obliterate every enemy in one turn before it can attempt to cheat.

Spoiler

Also take Versatility, pump Dexterity to 18, set Perception and Constitution to 3, as well as take Psi Empathy and invest in Temporal Manipulation.

 

[ItsChon]

Dominating really isn't super hard, I don't know what people are complaining about. I had to restart five times before I could get a build right that was viable on normal, and it probably would've taken me even more attempts if I didn't finally read peoples builds and get an idea of what I needed. I only play Dominating now, and I often play sub-par builds that use cobbled together elements from multiple different builts. I.E, my Metathermic Tin Can Sledge Hammer Build. I wanted to be tanky as fuck. I wanted to try a Metathermics build with the new Plasma Beam Psi power, and I wanted to slam people with a sledge hammer. I made a build that works. It's far from optimal, but I was able to do everything I wanted to do, and I had a great time doing it. If you don't want to play Dominating, that's fine, but I don't think it's gimmicky at all. I honestly can't play the game any other way now, since anything below Dominating is just way too easy.

EDIT: Metathermic Tin Can was really fun though, and I'm sure it could be optimized even further if someone that was actually good at making builds took a crack at it. If anyone's interested I can drop.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

ofc it's not hard, you just find some autistic person who wasted hours making an optimized build and copy it

speaking of which, got any builds to share chon?

 

[ItsChon]

ofc it's not hard, you just find some autistic person who wasted hours making an optimized build and copy it

speaking of which, got any builds to share chon?

That's my point though, you don't have to hyper optimize anything. Here's my Sledgehammer Tin Can Metathermic Psion for example (rough feat order).

https://underrail.info/build/?HA4DA...zxoXgAAwpYASABbKwhfLVAqPxI9wrxgLlUfZMK2wrjfvw

I want my build to do three things. Soak up damage, deal enough damage through Metathermics to be useful, and deal enough damage with my Sledgehammer to be useful. If I want to soak up damage, I'll need some Constitution, if I want to deal damage with my Sledgehammer, I'll need strength, and if I want to deal damage with Psionics, I'll need Will and likely some intelligence. I start by dumping Dexterity, Perception, and Agility to three. This gives me 19 skill points to play around with. I have some experience with Psi builds, so I know that six intelligence is a must for Premeditation, and I also know that the only Psionic feats that rely on an intelligence higher than six is psycho-neural flexibility. How do I know that? I went into the character builder, and I typed "Psi" into the feat section, and just looked at every skill. Plus, I need it for Expose Weakness too, so an easy choice. So now I'm down to 16 skill points. I want my build to be tanky, so I go ahead and type "Constitution" into the feat bar next. A quick glance over lets me see that there are a ton of useful feats that rely on Constitution, so it looks like I'm going to have to invest a lot of points here. I put the cut off at 9 Constitution, as this allows me to take all the damage resisting feats that I need. This means I forego thick skull, but since Bullhead exists, this is a sacrifice I'm willing to make, not to mention I'm used to avoiding stuns due to playing primarily glass cannon builds. This leaves me with 10 points, and two stats left. This is where some of the experience comes into play, and I admit that someone who hasn't experimented with both sledgehammer builds and psi builds couldn't implicitly know this. I've played Psi builds before, and I know that you can still deal a fairly decent amount of damage with just 10 or even 8 points into Will. I've also played Sledgehammer builds before, and I know that if you're not dealing enough damage to consistently one shot enemies, you're going to have a rough time. Knowing this, I split my remaining ten points between Will and Strength, giving me a final split of

Strength: 8
Dexterity: 3
Agility: 3
Constitution: 9
Perception: 3
Will: 8
Intelligence: 6

and I'll be pumping ever stat point I get into strength to make sure my melee damage scales throughout the game. I don't care that I only have 8 Will because the whole point of this build is to whittle down the tanky enemies as they close the distance, and the squishy enemies that deal a lot of damage will be weak enough so that my low Will score won't matter. Just from looking at these base stats I know that I won't be as effective in the early game due to less than optimal base stats in my two main combat abilities, but this is temporary, and I know I can deal with a lot of this early game weakness by utilizing traps and grenades.

All that's left to worry about is feats. As I established previously, I want to be tanky, I want to deal damage with my sledgehammer, and I want to deal damage with psionics (metathermics). So, I look up all the feats that are related to being tanky, and I make note of them. I look up all the feats that are related to sledgehammers, and I take note of them, and I look up all the feats that are related to dealing Metathermic damage, and I take note of them. I also take note of some utility/QoL feats that I might want. Finally, I review the mental list I've made, and I try to make sure that I have enough feats to accommodate everything, and if I don't, I start making cuts to see what I can live without. If I have a question about a feat and its usefulness, I'll just check the Underrail and RPGCodex forums to ask. The rest is just ordering them as I see fit, and that changes depending on how the build fares through the game. The build above is the end result. I did all the quests and side content, even went through Fetid Marsh.

I broke it down as simply as possible, and this same process goes for any build. I handicap myself by taking persuasion in every single build, and I have not made some otherwise viable builds because I couldn't make the skill point distribution work. I'm honestly not good at making builds; I never have been. If this constitutes "autism", then fair enough, but I'm pretty sure anyone here can do this, and there's people here that can probably do it far better than me. I just don't like when people sit around and circle-jerk about how dominating is super hard and only turbo-autists can make dominating viable builds. I mean, it definitely feeds into my superiority complex, but it's really not that hard.

 

[Black Angel]

First.

Don't think there are any major additions on Hard, DOMINATING adds some new areas.

Those are either cut content or items found in the mutant-only questline. That or false/outdated info, there's a bit of that on the wiki too.

Sheessh, sounds like either some kind of oversight to get those things in the wiki, or just plain no fun allowed.

But wait, DOMINATING-only content pretty much confirmed? I thought it's just because people hasn't been playing on Normal, or at least hasn't confirmed if those content can't be found on Hard...what the fuck is this?

Dominating really isn't super hard, I don't know what people are complaining about.

My problem with this case is the fact that Stygsoft themselves proclaimed, in-game, that Normal is The Way the Game Meant to Be Played™, and that DOMINATING weren't meant to be viable to be beaten normally. Actually, my problem is with difficulty modes in general.

Anyway, I could understand if these exclusive content were meant to reward those who played above Normal, meaning at least Hard playthrough would've been pretty much welcome. But the literal Insane Difficulty? Really, Styg?

 

[Blaine]

Black Angel

If you want to experience Dominating content, simply import your level 30 character into a new game carrying all fifty tons of his accumulated possessions and charons with him.

That's what I'm going to do.

 

[Blaine]

I've just hit 22 with my sniper, and I'm changing my lesson plan.

For the first time ever, I'll be dropping Power Management. I've come to terms with the unnecessary and obnoxious bullshit of feeding small batteries into NVGs like they're reverse Pez dispensers, because waiting until they're empty and then using a big battery can be hazardous if you happen to forget. Best to keep them topped off, in which case Power Management is largely superfluous. I'm going to take Trap Expert instead, because frankly I don't have enough time left in my life left to waste arming traps at the default snail's pace, fast-forward function or no. Additionally, the extra speed can allow me to place traps in places that might otherwise get me noticed before I finish setting them.

I'm strongly considering swapping Blindsiding for Opportunist, since I don't really feel I need the extra power for sniper rifle special attacks at this stage, and Opportunist works with both traps and flashbangs during intervals when I can't use Snipe or Aimed Shot.

Once I hit 30, I can decide between Strider, Gun Nut, Blindsiding, or whatever else I may want by then.

For the first time ever, I'm speccing Interloper to the max (other spec was 1/4 Shooting Spree). This way, when I pop out of stealth to use Snipe and Aimed Shot as I nearly always do, I will have real MP left to use in addition to Sprint—and can Blitz it all up if necessary, combine with an Adrenaline Shot, or whatever. There are also Smoke Bombs to consider, now that I have access to Oculus.

I've settled on an 8.6mm primary sniper rifle. It's powerful enough with a Smart Module and AA scope, and with a RR, it costs 32 AP to fire. This is perfect, because ideally I'll be able to Snipe, Aimed Shot, throw a grenade or incendiary, inject a Focus Stim or whatever (with Doctor's Pouch), then fire yet a third time, possibly benefiting from Ambush; and if I miss initially, I'm slightly less fucked than I was when relying on a 50 AP 12.7mm.

All in all, getting very close to enemies and spraying with the SMG "felt better" to me than playing a sniper, because snipers rely on cooldown bursts and a little luck, and have to fall back on Spearheads or the Dragunov if anything gets remotely close (if you went full-blown sniper with Strafe, as I did). Ambush is also virtually guaranteed not to help you if enemies are close. Snipers are generally dogshit at close range when waiting out cooldowns, which of course makes sense, but can be annoying.

 

[Trashos]

Dominating is designed around metagaming so I'm not sure what the problem is. It's the difficulty for people who have memorised the entire game, including all crawler locations. Death stalkers need to be threatening to make up for how easy to counter they are when you know they're there.
They're also pretty easy to skip, especially on dominating. Most of them are in optional areas that you don't need to go to, and a lot of the ones that aren't can be killed by luring them into fights with other enemies. I can't think of any that you actually have to fight before the Institute (if there are any then feel free to point them out), and by then you should be able to take them. And if you can't then again, dominating is designed around metagaming, use the beartraps.

Spoiler

In Junkyard, in the little cave where you go to plant the explosives before the Eels-Scrappers showdown. I do not remember whether it is a stalker or a crawler, but that's the first one I meet.

 

[thesecret1]

Dominating is designed around metagaming so I'm not sure what the problem is. It's the difficulty for people who have memorised the entire game, including all crawler locations. Death stalkers need to be threatening to make up for how easy to counter they are when you know they're there.
They're also pretty easy to skip, especially on dominating. Most of them are in optional areas that you don't need to go to, and a lot of the ones that aren't can be killed by luring them into fights with other enemies. I can't think of any that you actually have to fight before the Institute (if there are any then feel free to point them out), and by then you should be able to take them. And if you can't then again, dominating is designed around metagaming, use the beartraps.

Spoiler

In Junkyard, in the little cave where you go to plant the explosives before the Eels-Scrappers showdown. I do not remember whether it is a stalker or a crawler, but that's the first one I meet.

There's a death stalker there.

 

[Blaine]

Today, after >1300 hrs., I've discovered for the first time that crawlers can re-enter stealth instantaneously. I'm not entirely sure how these circumstances came to pass or why turn-based mode didn't immediately engage. I'd just descended the ladder to the Lower Passages crawler pit when I bumped into the last living crawler down there, which had wandered close to the ladder; perhaps my own combat button being on cooldown due to zone transition had something to do with it.

Regardless, all crawlers must be annihilated. They are so adept at hiding that they're absent even from the sight of the gods. Their powers clearly come directly from the Underworld—from the waters of the Styx, you might even say. Some malevolent force has uttered a vile malediction that exempts the crawling filth from all true and good laws of nature, laws to which even cannibalistic murderers must adhere.

The crawling filth must be expunged. The dirty cheaters will not prosper. They may cheat the laws of nature, but they can't cheat death.

 

[Spark Mandriller]

Spoiler

In Junkyard, in the little cave where you go to plant the explosives before the Eels-Scrappers showdown. I do not remember whether it is a stalker or a crawler, but that's the first one I meet.

That one does suck, but it spawns off to the south (at least I think it does) so most of the time you can plant the explosives and leave before it sees you. Most of the time.
Not sure what they were thinking when they put that one there after years of that room being empty.

 

[Blaine]

Eels vs. Scrappers is an entirely optional confrontation. I still haven't bothered to go through with it in my current game, and I'm nearly level 24.

I probably won't go through with it, since my character is aligned with Oculus, Free Drones, and Pirates, and can't pass the Persuasion check to enlist SGS. I don't do flat-out cRPG RP, because that's gay, but I have a thematic appreciation for what I've seen referred to as "flavor."

 

[Blaine]

I remember hearing vague rumors that Phreak's questline conflicts with the Oligarchs'.

I've had Phreak on the back burner while I do other things (including doing everything I felt I needed to before finally confronting the Hunters), and now I really want My House, since my SGS quarters are crammed full of shit.

Strongly considering just blowing the old fart up and checking his shit out in a new playthrough. It's that or explore Upper Underrail earlier than I really wanted to and do puzzles at night (in real life) when I'm tired.

Ah fuck it, I'll keep filling the five containers in the SGS quarters full of shit. It has to be those five, too, for the moving-in to go smoothly.

 

[thesecret1]

I remember hearing vague rumors that Phreak's questline conflicts with the Oligarchs'.

Somewhat. Basically, the moment you are eligible for the mission to check out coretech labs (you don't need to accept the mission, just being eligible for it is enough, meaning you did all the previous quests for the oligarch of your choice AND fought enough in the arena to become a gladiator), Phreak vanishes from his hideout and his questline is cancelled, so you usually want to do his whole questline first, then do an oligarch questline.

Strongly considering just blowing the old fart up and checking his shit out in a new playthrough.

He has a unique glove and that's about it. You can access his laptop once he vanishes (you'll find it tossed in the garbage to the right of the room, if you have enough PER).

 

[Scrounger]

Blaine, if it helps, doing only Phreak questline does lock you up from free house. You can still buy it afterwards for 10k....not that I oppose wasting him though

 

[Blaine]

Blaine, if it helps, doing only Phreak questline does lock you up from free house. You can still buy it afterwards for 10k....not that I oppose wasting him though

That does help! I was indeed wondering if you'd receive an option to outright purchase the house during Phreak's questline. For whatever reason, I didn't ask.

Regarding the phreaking puzzles: The audio tones themselves present no problem for me at all, and the PER hint seems fairly useless except to define the pattern, which I don't need. What fucks me up is the seven-century pause between each tone as it's played. By the time each sequence reaches its end, I've started to forget the damn sequence. If the tones played rapidly, I'd be able to solve the three sequences in well under a minute by switching rapidly between "practice mode" and "entry mode."

But you see, fellas... remember when I mentioned that I can read guitar tab? There just so happens to be a physical guitar tuner sitting on my real-life coffee table.

Yes, in order to solve the phreaking puzzle in Styg's game, I have used a real-life electronic black box. I have literally phreaked the phreaking puzzle!

 

[Zeem]

What fucks me up is the seven-century pause between each tone as it's played.

Game speed affects how fast the tones are played. Set it to max to minimize the downtime between individual ones.

 

[Blaine]

What fucks me up is the seven-century pause between each tone as it's played.

Game speed affects how fast the tones are played. Set it to max to minimize the downtime between individual ones.

I also managed to turn the slowness to my advantage, Korg tuner or no Korg tuner.

I simply play the demo sequence several times, hitting practice tones quickly as each demonstrative tone is automatically played. As I find matches, I jot down a shorthand of the match's icon/color (Yl Wr, Rd Rt, etc.) in order. I identify at least one and often two or three tones and their positions per demo playback.

It seems my brain can handle the discord and simultaneity of many practice tones playing over the current "target" tone. The intervals are also short enough that I can always keep the "target" tone in mind, then shift to the next one.

 

[Blaine]

Well, Phreak's questline just petered to a halt. I assume I'll need to ADVANCE THE MAIN QUEST to UNLOCK FACTION VENDOR and UNLOCK HOUSE.

There's finally an Underrail Wiki entry for Phreak, but it seems that he hasn't UNLOCKED AS A MERCHANT for me—and that that's probably about it for him. I may need to have a very personal discussion with Phreak regarding the usefulness of Coretech's faction vendor and my keen interest in his glove.

 

[lukaszek]

there is also abomination page. Apparently it will die for good after its killed... several number of times. I guess I wasnt patient enough

 

[Blaine]

One classic aspect of later-game Merry Merchanting remains in force today:

You have a million guns.

General store owners are assholes, sitting on large piles of charons, but typically only buying a shirt, a flashlight lens, and a bottle of Tums. They always buy ammo, though.

Trade guns for tons of ammo you don't really need, then trade the ammo to general store owners. You'll take a substantial loss, but after a certain point, it hardly matters.

Now I just need to re-determine which ammo types and calibers are the most weight-efficient....

 

[Blaine]

Right. As with nearly every build, my sniper has really taken off in the early- to mid-20s.

I've settled on a Rapid Smart 8.6mm Reaper (32 AP, 175% crit bonus, >50% special attack bonus) primary, and a Rapid Spearhead Commando (26 AP, no move/shoot penalties with Strafe) secondary. As soon as I reach level 26 and grab Increased Perception, I'll have 13 PER + 2 PER from Mushroom Salads and The Juice, so accuracy will more-or-less cease to ever be a significant factor again.

My investment in Agility 10 has paid off, as it keeps Stealth quite high for Snipe and skulking about, and I find myself using Blitz regularly. Many's the time I've killed four or even five enemies on the first turn with the Spearhead without using any medication or utilities.

I don't miss Power Management much. My energy shield is very rarely used, ~120 capacity (what I've currently got) is fine for goggles, and I'm speccing Interloper, so the hit to Cloaking Device runtime is lessened for the purposes of sneaking around crowded areas in broad daylight.

I'd like to use traps a little more, but they're heavy and fiddly, so I use them relatively sparingly. Nevertheless, there is no realistic way for this character to attack silently, so traps are, if anything, more useful for a sniper even than for a Crossbows build. You generate your own noise. Can't clear rooms silently one by one, but you can cause everyone to bumble into a death field when they come to see what all the fuss is about without carrying 80 lbs. of TNT everywhere.

I've realized that there's no convenient way to create light or fire on demand while riding a jet ski, so that means very few opportunities to use Ambush, no stealth, no Snipe, no possibility of deploying traps (once again, I wish there were naval mines), etc. Since sniper rifles are extremely sensitive to any drop in accuracy, which anything less than near-perfect stability is great at bringing about, I generally feel that this build is awful on the water despite the long-range potential. I can only imagine that a Crossbows/Traps build would be in an even sadder state.

On the other hand, unlike many other builds, a sniper is incredible at surgically removing zoners from jet skis whilst entrenched on land. Indeed, when I (very belately) realized that there's now a jet ski mini-quest at the Camp Hathor docks, I found a nice little island nearby and pirated several additional skis using 8.6mm JHP. Sadly, even JHP can one-hit junk skis from full health if using Snipe, but a wreck reef is also quite handy for stopping random skiers in their predictable tracks.

 

[jackofshadows]

Noise isn't a big deal when you have vanishing powder. Sometimes even a flashbang is enough to re-stealth after a kill-streak. Traps - yeah, not worth it outside of good old bear ones very occasionally just to stall someone.

And weren't incendiary grenades working on water? Not 100% sure rn.