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POSTAL 4: No Regerts from Running with Scissors

Riskbreaker

Guest
So this made me actually pay attention to Brain Damage, the upcoming spin-off, and it turns out it might be promising?

Right off the bat it doesn't look like it risks any commentary on the current topics, anymore than this thing. It's set in this surreal, out of time, vaguely 50s looking suburbia, styled upon the cartoons from the era, populated with overweight folks, promiscuous looking young women, gun totting rednecks etc. One of your weapons is a gun with a screen attached which seems to capable of automatically targeting folks' brains. So there's some much safer, vaguer, familiar commentary going on. But, it looks legitimately good, combat and movement appear slick and satisfying, there is a fair bit of detail and character to the environment, exploration is actually rewarding (one common complaint re Postal 4 is that it's pointless the explore, interiors are empty not only of props but of weapons, ammo, health, money).
 

d1r

Busin 0 Wizardry Alternative Neo fanatic
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Can we plese stop pretending that the Postal franchise isn't dead? It's getting really tiresome.
 

Konjad

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Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
This game is trash. IGN wasn't far off that much it seems (I didn't read their review though).

Played for an hour and refunded.

It's utterly buggy. Loading a new area doesn't work more often than it does. Memory leaks all over. Runs shit (though with my HW it is playable) and the gameplay appears to be similar to Postal 2 if you take the fun out of it and replace humor with unfunny one. AI is literally non-existent, and generally I can't think of one positive thing about it except perhaps I like the UI because it's like in Postal 2.

I'm surprised how bad it is, because the recent Postal 2 expansion was actually quite fun even if worse than P2.
 

Curratum

Guest
Played the Postal Brain Damage demo a couple of months ago, it was probably the most unfun, uninspired boomer shooter I ever tried.
 

Riskbreaker

Guest
Played the Postal Brain Damage demo a couple of months ago, it was probably the most unfun, uninspired boomer shooter I ever tried.
Never got to try it out myself but it looked interesting enough from the videos, especially the aesthetics.
Of Hyperstrange's prior games, Elderborn I found pretty underwhelming - I couldn't force myself to finish its second act - but Blood West is shaping rather nicely so far. So I guess I gave Brain Damaged 50/50 chance.
 

Curratum

Guest
Played the Postal Brain Damage demo a couple of months ago, it was probably the most unfun, uninspired boomer shooter I ever tried.
Never got to try it out myself but it looked interesting enough from the videos, especially the aesthetics.
Of Hyperstrange's prior games, Elderborn I found pretty underwhelming - I couldn't force myself to finish its second act - but Blood West is shaping rather nicely so far. So I guess I gave Brain Damaged 50/50 chance.

Same experience with Elderborn, stopped after the first boss. Brain Damage looks a lot better in the trailers compared to what you get in the demo. Maybe the put the weakest dullest level in the demo, but why would you do that?
 

Parsifarka

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Never got to try it out myself but it looked interesting enough from the videos, especially the aesthetics.
You can try it yourself, I just played though the demo. Curratum is right in that the available level screams 'TUTORIAL' all over the place, and it's way too long for being what it is. The aesthetics are solid, they built some really pretty gardens, the light captures the time of day and I particularly liked the burger-throwing flying Tweedle Dees and Dums, but there are only three models for civilians (who don't even puke when you pee on them!) and every house looks exactly the same in their interiors —this wouldn't be a problem weren't there SO many repetitions in just one level. On top of it the level is extraordinarily easy so it really isn't that engaging as the same situations are presented over and over with a very slow addition of enemies to the mix with only one of them (the huge dog) being able to wake up the player.
The available weapons all have a secondary attack, and in the case of the chain-spade-saw it's a projectile deflecting maneuver also attached to a hotkey so you don't need to actually change your weapon to execute it instantly. Movement includes automatic bhopping and sliding, but whatever you people mean by "boomer shooter" I doubt this is trying to be one: there's a mind-boggling excess of resources, enemies deal little damage, encounters with multiple foes are rare and if this map is anything to go by the level design has little focus feeling like a slightly twisted cut from a Postal 2 map. Then again, this is obviously the first level and there is still potential as the map did actually get a tad less dull as it progressed and the game feels quite polished as if there were some actual care put into it, so I wouldn't write the game off completely though expectations must be adjusted: expect a glorified mod level of quality, like the latter Painkiller sequels something that you would play only because you like the original THAT much.
As for Postal 4, I though it looked like a shitty remake of P2 ever since the first trailer they presented, the sort made by people with little understanding of the current technology and with few or none of the original developers behind . This impression has only gotten stronger now that reviews are out; of course I didn't buy it nor followed the development: no regerts, no surprises.
 
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Finished Wednesday. A quick (by no means exhaustive!) rundown:

- Tuesday had better missions than Monday (by that I mean they weren't altogether terrible, just mediocre at best). Wednesday was as bad as Monday, with one particularly unfun and tiresome "clean up all the piles of shit"-mission that threw near-constant crashes into the mix (I had a total of 9 crashes in that one mission!).
- Money seems rather hard to come by. NPCs apparently no longer carry money. P2 was smart about this by introducing a bank you could rob on the very first day. In P4, on the other hand, you can enter the Mexican boss' vault starting Tuesday, with money littered around everywhere - thing is, you can't pick any of it up.
- Erratic item placement. You enter one house - it has nothing in it. You enter another one and it has a kevlar west in each room (AND another one in the hallway).
- You frequently clip through objects, walls, doors. Can come in handy for entering secret areas you're not supposed to be in (was able to enter a locked cave with some keypad in front of it by clipping through the wall).
- The waypoint marker is one of the worst/most useless I've seen in any game ever. This heavily ties to the next point...
- The missions themselves are bugged all to hell, to the point where the game is unsure whether you completed a mission or not. You finish a mission shooting power boxes. After finishing the mission, you will still occasionally get instructions that there's "just a couple more power boxes to go". The waypoint marker will often direct you to an altogether different mission than the one you selected. Loading areas aren't indicated on the map (and the waypoint doesn't show them either), so it's pure guesswork which way to go to most effectively get to your destination while suffering the least amount of endless loading screens.
- Load times are horrendous and made up a major part of my play time
- NPCs are vomiting through their foreheads
- I had a lighting bug in Tuesday's opening cutscene (It's supposed to be moody, dark lighting, whereas it was brightly lit in my playthrough)
- Using powerups is really cumbersome compared to P2
- Tuesday introduces a subway system to get around the map more quickly. Unfortunately, these are so hard to spot it kinda makes the whole feature redundant.
- Running people down with scooters only counts as a kill under very specific circumstances. This became obvious in a Kill Frenzy mission where I was able to score only a single kill despite running down NPCs by the dozens.
- Wheels flying off exploding cars make this really annoying sharp sound that sound like your eardrums are popping if you're wearing headphones
- Doors can get blocked, even with quest-relevant items stuck on the other side
- Tonally much closer to P3 than to P2
- Mission design much closer to P3 than to P2 (loads of boring-ass "Do X amount of Y"-missions)
- Invisible walls in areas that look like they might have something interesting, while no invisible walls in other areas that have nothing in them but might come in handy by preventing the player from falling off the map
- No quicksaves during some of the more combat-heavy missions (loads of fun with the constant threat of crashes looming)

Stuff I noticed you can no longer do compared to vanilla P2 (by no means exhaustive!):
- Pick up donuts
- Lure a cop with donuts
- Piss on dropped donuts, lure a cop to the pissed on donut, which makes them throw up
- Dogs playing fetch with severed heads (on that note: kicking feels terrible in P4)
- Getting injured by running into a cactus
- No more Chompy The Fish
- No more scissors (they sucked as a weapon and I never used them, but still...) and a bunch of other fun weapons (cow head, napalm launcher)
- Maybe there's still a way to steal a police uniform and wear it and then go about your daily misdeeds with impunity (while other cops look on and say things like "Hey, stop! Someone might have a camera!"), but I haven't found it yet.

This game is what happens when you dump a game in Early Access, while having an army of cock-slobbering fanbois that will defend your product to the death with the Steamtard evergreen "That's not fair to criticise this! It's not even finished yet!" No one has the guts to simply say "This is a buggy piece of shit and nothing works right." or "Hey assholes! How about designing some missions that aren't either simply not fun or cookie cutter rehashes of Postal 2's missions (and not fun)?".

Played the Postal Brain Damage demo a couple of months ago, it was probably the most unfun, uninspired boomer shooter I ever tried.
Not sure if I'd call it the most unfun, uninspired boomer shooter I ever tried (because there's plenty of unfun, uninspired boomer shooters to go around), but I agree that it was certainly unfun and uninspired.
 
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CyberModuled

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As a retard who decided to pick up this game back when it was $20 in hopes that it would become good, the thing that probably kills the game hardest for me (even more than how boring the open world design is or the lackluster NPC reactions or the missions just being kind of shit) would be how much you really don't need to explore anymore because of how much stuff the game almost willingly gives you. Postal 2's rewards for exploring areas were usually nonsense but still rewarding anyway just for looking through nook and crannies. Even when P4 doesn't have a locked out interior or building that's pretty much empty, I rarely ever have to because the levels that the main missions take the player though give you ample health, armor, and items just thrown around the map like the developers were scared of the player dying. Honestly, no wonder they still kept Civvie giving away health pipes at $10, they're FUCKING EVERYWHERE in the open world. You can't go through a single mission area without finding at least one and they're just as effective as they were in Postal 2.

Hell, just to TRY and make this a bit more challenging, I'm doing a blind pacifist run and unfortunately, I think it's actually making the game go faster since 99% of the time, the solution is to just run the fuck away from enemies (and only once on a mission during Wednesday have I needed to actually use some cat nip and health pipes to tank damage). The only time the game got remotely clever about me not killing something directly was pissing in a dog's bowl as a cat so it'd vomit and cringe its way down a cliff (and by extension, only one of the two laughs the game gave me).

Also relating to the devs, this gets on my nerves the most. From a video who're the only few actually willing to criticize the game beyond just the technical issues, got a response from MarphitimusBlackimus, saying just because they removed the game from Early Access and slapped a "1.0" number on it, it doesn't mean it's actually "complete". Fuck off RWS, you had two and a half years and gave people something that's about as worthy as a sequel to Postal 2 as Postal 3 was. With attitudes like this, it's clear they'll never fix any of the actual big issues of this game and keep acting like it's only because of bad performance and visuals that kept people from liking the game. I feel fucking embarrassed for having faith in these people because of Paradise Lost.

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Dexter

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Mar 31, 2011
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Played the Postal Brain Damage demo a couple of months ago, it was probably the most unfun, uninspired boomer shooter I ever tried.
Yeah, posted my impressions about it back when I played it here, and honestly I didn't feel any need to see any more of it after that, "Blood West" seemed like the better game from the same developer that made this and even that didn't feel like a "Must Play":
POSTAL: Brain Damaged: Subcontracted to some Polish studio that's also working on Supplice and Blood West. You wake up in a distorted room in what appears to be American Suburbs in a random house that looks like those weird Dream sequences in Psychonauts. You find your first weapon in the garage (a chainsaw shovel) and a auto target-acquiring pistol soon after and go ahead slaying what vaguely looks like Trump-supporting grandpa's holding shotguns, mutant dogs and flying Burger Americans throwing burgers at you while searching for "Secrets" and walking through people's houses, looking through their cupboards and collecting Power-ups and posters of pixelated scantily clad women. All this to the backdrop of zany one-liners from the voice actor. It's like something that could stem from fantadoormat's imaginative vision of America. Your first mission is to find the Red Key to get out of the house. Ctrl to slide. Then the game tells you to press F to piss on things. Pissing on electrical outlets apparently makes them explode. Then you advance through the city collecting the Yellow and Blue Keys and learning that you can propel yourself through the air along metal anchors using the Shotgun to bridge abysses. The NPCs you kill have no faces or personality for some reason and are abstract. A bit derivative of itself and slightly dull due to sameness, was funner when the idea was fresh and NPCs actually had faces and personalities, but playable enough.
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toughasnails

Guest
Also relating to the devs, this gets on my nerves the most.
I mean this is at least SOMEWHAT understandable, bc yes you expect that the 1.0 release of anything would receive further work, but it certainly doesn't excuse the game's state.
I'm far more baffled by them actually encouraging "of course it's bad, it's Postal so it's meant to suck" as a "defense" of their game. You can't go very far with that, it's ultimately self destructive. It's also p unfair to Postal 2 and people who worked on it as any of the comparisons of that game's mission design, options, attention to detail with this shows.
 
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This is some bizarre shit!

"Chances are, you don't remember what postal 2 was like two weeks after release"
I remember perfectly well, because I have a 1.0 retail copy right here and played it recently to rinse the foul taste of Postal 4 out of my mouth. I remember the load times being quite long on my 2002-ish rig and it was prone to crashes, so those are fair points, but other than that, even the 1.0 version of P2 is far from what I'd call janky. Everything works as intended and for a low-budget indie game from 2003 it's quite impressive.

"It was rushed out the door unfinished (there's an entire expansion pack dedicated to this)"
And thank God for that, I guess! Because Apocalypse Weekend (boomerang machete aside) kinda sucks and it's the moment when Postal went horribly wrong, with an emphasis on tedious "Do X of Y" mission design. Good thing that shit was axed from the main game, which now ends with a bang (Waco siege and raining cats) instead of an army base that goes on forever and is a chore to play.

"it received low ratings on release"
Well, gee, it's not like the common conception of gaemz journolols being fucking retarded came out of nowhere! The downside to no one taking these bozos seriously anymore is that it gave P4 a lot more street cred than it deserved. The players are finding this out the hard way now. The Steam score for recent reviews steadily dropped from 80ish on release day (Take that, IGN!!!) and now sits at 52. Wouldn't be surprised if this dropped into the 40s or even lower eventually.

"I could barely play it due to the horrendous load times and crashes"
There's a major difference in how those affected gameplay in the respective games: When P2 crashed, I started it right up again, because the game was so damn fun and original I wanted to see what would happen next, long load times be damned. When P4 crashes, it's almost a relief.

"Work continues on"
That's nice and all, but the problems with P4 go far deeper than the various tech issues. For starters, they'd have to rip out whole missions and redesign them from scratch. Monday in particular should be axed in its entirety and replaced with something not aggressively tedious. I wouldn't mind if they halved the map in size and instead made each location map count, instead of having lots of empty placeholder buildings.

But considering how they (is that Blackismus dude actually involved with RWS? - if he's just a retarded apologist fanboi he can fuck right off) are so hyperdefensive of P4 that they will now piss on the legacy of the legitimately great P2 in an effort to excuse for how badly P4 turned out, I don't have high hopes. Even with 5 second load times and at a smooth 60FPS, Postal 4 would still be excruciating garbage.
 

CyberModuled

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I'm far more baffled by them actually encouraging "of course it's bad, it's Postal so it's meant to suck" as a "defense" of their game. You can't go very far with that, it's ultimately self destructive. It's also p unfair to Postal 2 and people who worked on it as any of the comparisons of that game's mission design, options, attention to detail with this shows.
They keep ringing the "Least it's better than Postal 3" sentiment so fucking hard at this point it's getting obnoxious. Yes, Postal 3 is a piece of shit but imagine putting your game up on a pedestal just because it's better than one of the shittiest games out there. Especially when Paradise Lost handled P3's existence in a way that was pretty funny and final in a, "Moving on from this because we've let Postal 2 cement our legacy, not Postal 3" sort of way that they should clearly be trying to top their best game.
(is that Blackismus dude actually involved with RWS? - if he's just a retarded apologist fanboi he can fuck right off)
Yeah, he's been working at RWS since Paradise Lost to my understanding. I wouldn't have posted that comment otherwise if it was just some shill. It's just annoying to see a developer be this adamant about defending an unfinished game they're pushing as "1.0" instead of trying to hunker down and fix it.
 

CyberModuled

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Messages
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There were only two hard missions in the entire game (the bidet installation on Wednesday and the dam plugging on Friday) and both of them were solved by mindlessly huffing pipes and catnip while enemies swarmed me. For that matter, if it weren't for the dam mission being the last one to do (or I knew the layout of the level beforehand), I would still had 8 cat nip and 15 pipes at the end. Game was already fairly easy in pacifist mode not just because of easy item obtainment (in hindsight, I had a ton of Vitamins that lets piss act as a hose cannon to stun enemies) but also due to Thursday introducing the Rattler weapon (the thing you see on the cover of Postal X) to purchase for dirt cheap. Despite its appearance, it has a non-lethal option you can enable and the secondary fire throws it at enemies, meaning stunning has never been easier. Maybe it is petty to hark on "balance" (after all, Postal 2's weaponry is powerful and I'm pretty sure the Steam version grants you the double barrel by Thursday besides) but added with the lack of challenge or interesting scenarios on what is supposed to be the "hard" way to play Postal 4, makes it really trivial. The distinction between "non-lethal" and "speedrunning" the game barley fucking exists.

I'd say the apocalypse event at the end really does go to show how fucking lifeless the NPCs feel too. In the context of P2, even if it was as simple as enemies aggroing on the player once you were in their sights, the smaller scale of Paradise so the player was in closer proximity to NPCs and the fact the military is a factor to deal with on Friday makes it somewhat of a challenge and a nice way to cap off the game. Comparatively, P4's areas being too big for their own good results in the spread of NPCs being too wide so you never really see anybody shooting each other as well as all NPCs being civilians, meaning they go down very easily (made all the more boring that my pacifist run just had me driving around them rather than even being able to shoot so I couldn't even get the catharsis of shooting them).

Final boss got bodied by the Rattler too. Just spam throw and he was stun locked. Run back to where you started and the game's over. Pacifist ending is whatever (basically the same as the regular ending but some Postal 1 motifs to it) but I never played it for that more than to just prove a point on how easy the game is so the inclusion of something extra was a nice enough gesture. Game's shit, just play Postal 2 again (I'm sure anyone reading this topic pretty much got that message at this point though).
 

lightbane

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Yeah, he's been working at RWS since Paradise Lost to my understanding. I wouldn't have posted that comment otherwise if it was just some shill. It's just annoying to see a developer be this adamant about defending an unfinished game they're pushing as "1.0" instead of trying to hunker down and fix it.
Shame, that explains why he stopped posting videos of HL Lore as often as he did.

So far it seems the game is a pale shadow of Postal 2, which is as expected in today's age. Did they get rid of the trannies and weirdos in the sewers from EA? These produced a minor shitstorm, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were removed.

Perhaps waiting a few months until it's cheaper/less buggy is the answer here... Just like most games launched during the last decade, darn it.
 

CyberModuled

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Did they get rid of the trannies and weirdos in the sewers from EA? These produced a minor shitstorm, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were removed.
There were weirdos but I didn't see a tranny. Not sure how much of that is because I couldn't see for how ugly the green hue they give the area where the homeless are or because there's zero reason to even interact with those NPCs in the first place. They're just in the middle of a big room that interconnects the other tasks you're supposed to do and do nothing else. The fucking oversized rats are more dangerous than the human NPCs down there and they can just be outran in the pipes.

Ironically, looking into it to see if there were trannies at one point, I found out two slightly related things:

1. There was supposed to be a final section to the sewer level after doing all three tasks back in 2019 (this doesn't happen in the current build).
2. There used to be alligators in older builds and explain why the player would take damage if they were in water during a platforming section. They just removed it and replaced it with toxic water I guess because they couldn't properly get the AI to work for them.
Perhaps waiting a few months until it's cheaper/less buggy is the answer here... Just like most games launched during the last decade, darn it.
That is being extremely optimistic for this game. Giving the benefit of the doubt they can squash the majority of crashes, performance issues, and bugs by the end of the year, you still get a game that's filled with content that isn't anywhere near as fun as Postal 2.

This is the result of RWS seemingly taking the Early Access approach of simply adding content to the game overtime and the occasional bug fixing for game breaking stuff without bothering to polish the content in the first place before moving on. Based on the fact the other days of the week didn't really improve after the initial ones, I think it's also fair to say they didn't take any criticisms to heart (well, the few they may have gotten given the amount of dick sucking the community gave them purely for P4 existing) since all the other areas also feel generally bloated to explore nor do the missions ever really get better. A lot of this is just due to the core not being very entertaining.

All the fun and erratic reactions you could get from Postal 2 NPCs (especially playing something like Hestonworld mode) barley exist in 4, Edensin is monotonous to navigate around due to being too big so your options boil down to either sprinting, using the electrical scooters, or the fast travel option, exploration doesn't feel rewarded anywhere near as much due to giving the player too many items to even really need to scavenge, and the missions aren't very memorable or even fit within the "mundane tasks gone wrong" theme that made them memorable in P2. Fixing all that shit above would take years minimum (which probably could've been prevented or at least minimized if they bothered to tweak things earlier in EA and design the new content around that over what we have now) but at this point, it seems like RWS don't see eye to eye with the critical side of the playerbase and act like everything is okay but the technical stuff (to which they'll just winge and say even that's acceptable because Postal 2 was also a buggy mess on initial release). To me, it just feels very clear they don't care or are too blind by their fans to change anything and if that's the hill they want to die on, they can go right ahead. Especially since people OUTSIDE of the general Postal playerbase (which I know doesn't sound like a big deal, but I'd argue otherwise when many people got introduced to Postal 2 when they released it on Steam) aren't bothering when they're charging $40 for a game they've fully admitted isn't finished but they pulled the EA tag off of anyway because they needed more money for funding. It's only a matter of time before funding dries up as the thing barley made a dent in Steam's global bestsellers list at the time of release.
 
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Well, I finally managed to soldier through this pile of shit. I can't remember the last time I so eagerly anticipated the end of a game. RWS must've bribed IGN with truckloads of Doritos and MTN Dew, considering they let them get away with a 2/10.

In an earlier post my recommendation was "If you're a hardcore Postal fan, wait for a deep discount." I have to revise that. If you're a hardcore Postal fan: AVOID IT! If it eventually sells for 2 bucks on RWS' website like all their other games: AVOID IT! If someone gives it to you as a present for mother's day: AVOID IT!

It has no redeeming features whatsoever (apart from letting you pick the Postal Dude's voice - but the downside to that is that you would still have to play the the actual game).There is not a single mission that is not aggressively tedious and the open world is a pale imitation of Postal 2. In order to make this thing remotely enjoyable, they would have to strip about 80% of content out of this game (including scrapping every single mission and starting over from scratch) and then make the remaining 20% not boring. This thing is absolutely unsalvageable.

Do not waste time or money on this. Best pretend it never happened.
 

toughasnails

Guest
According to Synthetic man's video review current day RWS is made in part of Postal 2 modders whom they hired over years. I wonder how much can be explained by that. It is one thing to create content for an existing older game, it's whole other to create a new game from scratch on a newer, more complex engine. Maybe this could explain the cavalier attitude towards previous games too depending how many of their original devs remain at RWS today.
 

502

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I gave this game a million chances but I suppose it's time to admit it's irredeemable at everything that counts and plays like ass.
 

d1r

Busin 0 Wizardry Alternative Neo fanatic
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Postal Brain Damage unironically looks better than 4.

Once again, it just proves that Art Style > Graphics.

Something that a lot of developers WILL NEVER understand.
 

toughasnails

Guest
Postal Brain Damage unironically looks better than 4.

Once again, it just proves that Art Style > Graphics.

Something that a lot of developers WILL NEVER understand.
There doesn't seem to be much love for it around these parts but yeah I agree. Brain Damage's art direction, movement, combat combined with Postal 2's structure would make for a fantastic game.
 

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