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Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

Strange Fellow

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Also keep in mind that class changing generally sucks, as a class changed character starts with the new class at level 1, but with the XP requirements of their real level.

Hmm...I didn't know that last part. Still, I guess it will be worth it to develop a Priest and a Bard quickly, and later change them to more combat focused classes. I assume the Bard can still use the Music skill after class changing?
Yes, but it can't be raised further at all. Still, it's one of the few cases where a class-change can be beneficial, as instruments aren't restricted by class. Generally this is only done after the Music skill is nearly maxed out, allowing access to all the instruments. If you do it sooner, you'll miss out on the late-game instruments, some of which are extremely good. The Bard is an amazing class from beginning to end.
As for the Priest, he won't make a good physical fighter as he'll have pitiful HP and unoptimised stats. If made into a Bishop, he'll start training in the other schools from scratch, so he'll be lagging way behind everyone else in the party, as well as the level of enemies you're likely to be facing at that point. You'll never get access to the high-level spells in other schools. If you wanted a healer who can also do attack magic, starting out as a two-school Bishop is much better and won't lag behind nearly as much, if at all.

Also worth noting is that the Valkyrie is a very decent caster in her own right, as buffs and healing are often cast outside of combat and can be allowed to fizzle, which means that Divinity is much easier to level than the other schools for a hybrid. Valkyries are also good enough fighters that you can spend all their skill points on magic and leave the physical skills to level by use.
 
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Self-Ejected

HereticGuy

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D.W. Bradley is a genius developer, and should not be evaluated by Dungeon Lords
Oh, didn't intent to talk shit about Bradley; Dungeon Lords was a frustration when I was a teenager. Later I came to realize his good works on the genre. Currently installing Wizards & Warriors, never played it before. Do you have a recommended party or can it be beateble with any party compostition?
 

Dorateen

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D.W. Bradley is a genius developer, and should not be evaluated by Dungeon Lords
Oh, didn't intent to talk shit about Bradley; Dungeon Lords was a frustration when I was a teenager. Later I came to realize his good works on the genre. Currently installing Wizards & Warriors, never played it before. Do you have a recommended party or can it be beateble with any party compostition?

I didn't find combat too difficult, I think it can be beaten with any party combination. There is the usual class changing/upgrading, in some ways similar to the later Wizardry games.
 

LarryTyphoid

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Started Wiz6 again, remapping everything with Grid Cartographer. Definitely a lot more enjoyable than graph paper. I made a new party consisting of a fighter, valkyrie, priest, bard, alchemist, and mage. I feel like having two spellcasters in the back is a big boon for combat. I don't have the ranger for scouting anymore but that seemed kinda useless anyway. If you get a message or something then it's obvious to search every tile in the room.
 

Butter

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Does the Bishop Identify glitch not work on the DOS version of Proving Grounds? I'm just getting the error noise when I try it.
 

Marat

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Say, hypothetically, that there is a codexer who has never played Wizardry and he asked me what would be a good starting point for the series/installments worth playing. What would I play tell him?
 

Poseidon00

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Say, hypothetically, that there is a codexer who has never played Wizardry and he asked me what would be a good starting point for the series/installments worth playing. What would I play tell him?

Others may disagree but 8 is clearly the best in my opinion. Though I also have a soft spot for the snes version of Heart of the Maelstrom. These two games differ wildly in gameplay.

A lot of the Wizardry games are hard. Like balls to the wall, you will make a career out of reloading, move 15 steps back for every step forward hard. Fair warning. And don't use guides like a chump
 

LarryTyphoid

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Say, hypothetically, that there is a codexer who has never played Wizardry and he asked me what would be a good starting point for the series/installments worth playing. What would I play tell him?
I'm getting into it recently myself. I started with Wiz1, expecting to play all of the games in order, but it's honestly fucking boring to play. You should play it to get a grip on the mechanics, stop when you're bored, then skip to Wiz6. That's what I've been doing.
 

Butter

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Say, hypothetically, that there is a codexer who has never played Wizardry and he asked me what would be a good starting point for the series/installments worth playing. What would I play tell him?
8 is the most "modern", but it's also arguably the least representative of the series whole, and it's the third game in a trilogy. If you can't be bothered to play the wireframe Wizardries, you should start with 6.
 

LarryTyphoid

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Yeah, I was gonna play all the games in order, but Wiz1 seemed like it'd either quickly become a savescum nightmare or I'd spend 100 hours grinding with 50 different parties after dying to all the instadeath bullshit. I read an LP and even that guy was savescumming hard, which led me to believe that it's what most people do when playing that game. And in Wiz4, savescumming is practically mandatory from what I've seen. You savescum in Wiz6 too, but at least you don't have to quit out of the whole game to reload a save, and even then it's less common.
 

Desiderius

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Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
savescumming is practically mandatory from what I've seen.
You have to understand that reloading felt a lot less scummy when it cost a quarter (in 1980 money) a pop, and that’s what people were used to, so you were highly motivated to do everything in your power to minimize it in the face of unapologetically hostile RNG.

It was like poker.
 

Zboj Lamignat

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In Wiz 8 how does skill progression work?
In 6 and 7 some skills, like the weapons skills, increased by use, while others could only increase by spending skill points.
It's kind of nice to know beforehand, but I couldn't find anything about in the manual.
You want a simple or complicated answer?

Simple: all skills rise through use, but you also get points on level ups that can be used to increase them as well (9 points per level up, max 3 can be assigned to any given skill.

Complicated: there's a lot to unpack here.

1. Points can be assigned only up to 75. Everything above needs to be increased by use.
2. Getting 100 in an attribute (needs to be via assigning attribute points, increasing them through spells or item bonuses doesn't count) unlocks an extra skill connected to it that starts at 0. Imo, it's always worth it to choose 2 attributes for any char and pump them to 100* asap instead of spreading, and not only for this particular reason.
3. Every skill has governing attributes and having them on a higher level means that the skill will train through use faster. However, the difference is not nearly big enough to invest point in suboptimal attributes in hope of increasing skills faster.
4. There are skills that increase through use at a steady pace and there are those who are a pain to train. The former mostly being weapon and magic skills, the latter majority of all else (there are exceptions, though). For that reason it is usually worth considering to pump level up points into skills that increase slowly. Yes, your character will be weaker initially, but it will pay off in the long run.
5. Like with all learn-through-use rpg systems, you can get, uh, "creative" and cheese a lot of skills. Some of the possible methods you will notice quickly yourself, some need a bit of metaknowledge (like the fact you can cast healing spells on enemies). I definitely advise against using it, but it's your decision. Also, some skills are kinda too easy to powertrain to refrain from doing it (like music).
6. Any skill can increase through use once per round (standard 6 seconds, I think) maximum. Remember about it when doing degenerate stuff like splitting stacks of unidentified ammo to powertrain artifacts skill etc.
7. This game has lots of mechanics where you just don't know how things work, exactly, and training skills is no different. In general, skill needs to do something to get skill xp, but there are some weird exceptions. Take two curative water spells: cure lesser condition and stamina. With cure, you need to cast it on a character that's actually afflicted by something to get skill xp and you can do it both in combat and outside of it. With stamina it, theoretically, works the same and you need to cast it on someone with less than maximum stamina to get xp, but, for some weird reason, it will only ever increase governing skills when cast in combat. Why? Itisamystery.

*Meta advice that you wish you knew: there's a point in early-to-mid game when you can easily get a permanent +5 INT for all characters. You want 100 INT for casters asap to unlock powercast, but refrain from assigning more than 95 until you get the bonus.
 

octavius

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Yeah, I was gonna play all the games in order, but Wiz1 seemed like it'd either quickly become a savescum nightmare or I'd spend 100 hours grinding with 50 different parties after dying to all the instadeath bullshit. I read an LP and even that guy was savescumming hard, which led me to believe that it's what most people do when playing that game.

Pfffff! I played Wiz 1 Iron Man (except for one reload in the final battle) and beat it the first time I played it. I was an experienced blobberer at the time, though, but still...If you play cautiously you can complete it without reloading or grinding.

And in Wiz4, savescumming is practically mandatory from what I've seen.

Wiz4 is a meta game, so engaging in meta gaming yourself is no disgrace.

You savescum in Wiz6 too, but at least you don't have to quit out of the whole game to reload a save, and even then it's less common.

Wiz 6 is harder than Wiz 1 IMO, at least in the start. But no savescumming is required.
 
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KeighnMcDeath

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Grats in that iron man (which i thought was the only way early wiz was played). I had a lot of deaths including a damn surpise by the zombie dragons. Retrieving parties was fun though (or attempting). So many dead when I first tried. C64 was kinda slow though so I liked the fast PC.

I never tried the more graphical versions of the early sagas.
 

octavius

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The level scaling in Wiz 8 is fucking ridicilous.
My Ninja with 40 Crit Hit plonks away for 2 damage per attack against Metallic Slimes never critting them. It's like an exercise in tediousness.
And don't get me started on the respawning...
 

LarryTyphoid

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I haven't gotten to Wiz8 yet, of course, but I question its quality if it's basically mandatory to mod the tediousness out of the game.
 

octavius

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I don't suppose there are any mods that deal with the level scaling and the respawning?
Usually I don't mind lots of combat in blobbers, but in Wiz8 it's all there is (apart from some NPC interaction), while in true blobbers without auto-map I also spend time mapping, so the pacing of the game is better.
 

octavius

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I assume that if I class change all my characters the game will not throw lvl 1 monsters at me, but will use the "real" levels of my character?
Seems like using imported characters you reach too high levels before you find any decent weapons? I've reached the Upper Monastery and I still haven't found a single weapon worth equipping.
 

CHEMS

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Sooo... i installed a mod called Wizardry Reforged and i'm having a blast so far. To bad Arnika lags like shit due to the textures they used.
 

Strange Fellow

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Ah, metallic slimes. Better go make yourself a cup of something, set combat to continuous and sit back, because you're gonna be there for a while.

Seems like using imported characters you reach too high levels before you find any decent weapons? I've reached the Upper Monastery and I still haven't found a single weapon worth equipping.
I mean, you're still in the tutorial dungeon. Can't expect to be showered in riches at that point.
 

octavius

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All my dudes have the skill, but I think I've seen it work like two times before I reached the Upper Monastery.
 

Shadenuat

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hm don't remember where are metal slimes early but I think banal lightning rod works ok. And microwave ray burns even platinum slime.
 

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